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Panasonic S97 first impression.

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by leedsfireman, Jan 25, 2005.

  1. leedsfireman

    leedsfireman
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    Just got a S97 to use with my Pio434HD via HDMI but I must admit I'm not too impressed. The pic quality at 720p or 1080i is no better than my other DVD players. Either the set up is wrong or all this hype about upscaling DVD players & HDMI is wrong. :mad:
     
  2. edinburgh160

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    Hi,

    sorry to hear that. must admit that my picture through DVID is nothing short of outstanding . I used to use component (Qunex SR-CV1) and the DVI knocks the socks off it.
    interesting to see if anyone else has problems
     
  3. ginger

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    I've got mine hooked up using a QED HDMI cable and it certainly looks better at either 720p or 1080i (can't really tell the difference between the two with what I've watched) than my PS2 at 480i using the IXOS component cable. Can't compare with anything else I'm afraid
     
  4. Loada

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    I have one on the way. I'll report how it fares with a NEC VR5 plasma...
     
  5. andya

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    it could be the settings i thought it was dreadful at first but once set up on my z3 projector it is amazing superb quality
     
  6. mjcairney

    mjcairney
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    I have the S97 linked by QED HDMI cable to my PDP435FDE and find the picture, in either 720p or 1080i, to be fantastic although, like Ginger, I cannot see any difference between the two.

    One thing I cannot really understand is that the plasma reports the inputs as being 750p and 1125i - I thought 720p and 1080i were the de facto standard - anyone able to enlighten me here?

    Cheers,

    Martin.
     
  7. gstadt

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    My understanding is that there is a certain amount of additional data that is cropped when processed onto the screen??
     
  8. mjcairney

    mjcairney
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    gstadt - I don't know is the simple answer here.

    I should also have added that the S97 reports output at the same resolution as I mentioned in my earlier post.

    Cheers,

    Martin.
     
  9. ginger

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    I've read somewhere that it's additional lines of non-picture information. If you look in the manual it actually quotes the normally recognised figures in brackets - 750 (720p), 1125 (1080i).

    :rtfm: (sorry, couldn't resist it :devil: )
     
  10. mjcairney

    mjcairney
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    Fair comment re :rtfm:

    but I find it is not the most user-friendly manual I've ever come across, plus the fact I hate manuals anyway.

    Cheers,

    Martin.
     
  11. ginger

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    I must agree it's possibly the least user friendly manual I've ever read - all it does is tell you how to turn various things on and off without actually explaining what they're for e.g. HDMI Colour Space - what the %$£! is that all about?
     
  12. chris210972

    chris210972
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    i've just hooked this up to my toshiba 32wl48p lcd via hdmi and the picture is horrible.
    the picure looks better via rgb scart on my pioneer 575 player.
    surley this can't be right???
    the picture is very "grainy & blocky".
     
  13. WonkyEwok

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    From my stupid amounts of time reading up on this :rolleyes: :rolleyes: the different TV formats (ntsc / pal / 720 digital / 1080 digital) have the same numbers representing different colours. E.g. maybe for pal (10,50,50) is a blue, whereas for 720 digital it's a bit more sea-greeny. The 'colour space' is the table that turns numbers into colours.

    The problem comes when a player converts e.g. a dvd from pal up to 720p or 1080i digital for transmission over hdmi. It (probably) should work out "what colour does the dvd want the image to be here based on the data and the pal colour scheme?" and then "I'll calculate and send out the 720p numbers that will result in the same colour being displayed, assuming the display uses the 720p colour scheme correctly". But some players don't convert colour space internally when upscaling (the sony 975 I think from what I've read), and some tvs might be expecting different colour schemes. Maybe.

    So the S97 gives you the choice of what colour scheme it should assume the display is going to be using, and then it'll send out picture data which should look correct when displayed that way. Maybe try different values and see what looks best? Or ask the manufacturer, look here or on www.avsforum.com to see if anyone knows what colour space your display is using? I'm sure someone here knows enough about this to answer :thumbsup:

    The different colour spaces may have come about as displays have got better and can now display a wider gamut of colours than 20+ years ago when they were first chosen. So recent digital transmission schemes like hdmi, designed for recent displays, use different colour spaces to pal and ntsc. Again, maybe...

    Apologies if this was too long-winded :blush: or for any errors.
     
  14. leedsfireman

    leedsfireman
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    chris210972 I have to agree with you I get the same results v dissapointed.
     
  15. chris210972

    chris210972
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    i wasn't sure it the tv was faulty but now i'm thinking its the dvd player.
    i was all excited then when i saw the picture i couldn't belive my eyes, it just looked crap!
    i can't watch it so i plugged in my pioneer 575 via component instead.
    that was miles better.
    so its rather a dodgy hdmi socket on the tv or a crap 250.00 dvd player.
     
  16. mjcairney

    mjcairney
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    That's exactly what I'm on about - they seem to assume that everyone knows everything and therefore just tell you how to switch things on and off - what a load of :censored:

    Thanks to WonkyEwok for his explanation re HDMI colour space.

    Cheers,

    Martin.
     
  17. HouseofMu

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    I have my new S97 hooked upto a Tosh MT8, using a HDMI/DVI adapter and DVI cable into pj.

    PJ ratio is set to Native, colorspace auto (RGB), color gain offsets sets to 66/33 as per recommended by InFocus engineer, DVD player outputting 720p.

    I noticed a marked improvment in sharpness and deeper colours over my previous connection of scart RGB. But not that much of an improvment when compared to a Component connection.

    btw, Does anyone have a Prono remote CCF for this player ?

    cheers
     
  18. edinburgh160

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    Looks like I'm in a minority but I have no problems with the quality of the S97.
    I hook it up to my 5200 by HDMI-DVI cable and couldn't believe the upgrade in quality. I used to connect via component using Qunex SR-CV1 leads (about £100 wasted).
    Don't know if I'm lucky, but it's not so good to hear about hassles you guys are having. I have ordered the DVE disc to try and tweak further better results,
    Results as 1080i are crystal, after altering slightly some settings - these are
    Depth enhancer +1
    3-D Dnr +2 (or +1)
    MPEG-DNR dont use
    Contrast -1
    Sharpness +2
    although our Plasmas are probably all different.
     
  19. HouseofMu

    HouseofMu
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    Is your plasma a 1080 rez native panel ? If it isn't, doesn't that mean your upscaling to 1080i in the player, then further downscaling to your plasma true rez ?

    I could do the same with my pj, but i couldn't see the point in upscaling to 1080 (then downscaling to 720 in pj, so i just send 720 from player.
     
  20. edinburgh160

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    Hi, pasted this from earlier post on Hitachi thread.

    the 42PD5200 does support 1080i50, 720p60 and 1080i60, as stated both in the manual (granted, you have to read very carefully) and in the facts (1080i50 at least has been tested and proven via DVI-HDCP, and I have no doubt the 60Hz formats are properly supported too).



    Trader Rating: (0) It's DVI out from a DVD player with DVI-HDCP output, but same would hold for PC (you'd have to switch mode on the PD5200 from DVi-PC to DVi-STB). So you're all covered on 1080i50. 720p50.
     
  21. ptoboley

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    Just read a similar thread over on the plasma forum about disappointment with the S97... Think I'll have to see if the local store will loan me one to trial...

    Mu: Google tells me the 42PD5200 is UXGA resolution (1024x1024).
     
  22. AGroucutt

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    How do I change to 720 or 1080 on my S97 like you say the manual is not very good. Or id this only possible with R1 dvd's?
     
  23. HouseofMu

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    To get 1080 simply select it from the main setup menu, Other Settings then Video Output Mode. It can be set to 720p or 1080i.

    What I was infering with the scaling was that I think its prolly better to only scale once, either inplayer or in display device. even if 720(750) or 1080(1125) isn't a native rez of the panel. But then you've also got the issue of scaler quality. I can say te one in the 97 in very capable, so I let it do the duties rather than the one in my pj.

    I must admit, i've not fine tuned the S97 picture options yet (3D-DNR etc) - Are there some recommended settings for these ?
     
  24. mjcairney

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    You can also change when a DVD is playing, as follows:-

    Press "Display" on the remote
    Then select "Other Settings"
    Then select "Video Output Mode"
    Choose the one you want with the "Up" and "Down" keys
    and then press "Return" to go back.

    Hope this helps.

    Cheers,

    Martin.
     
  25. edinburgh160

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    After spending the best part of a night looking at all settings, I put the players AV enhancer on 'auto'
    I have changed alot of settings of the DVI settings on my Plasma (compared to RGB SKY+), to compliment the auto though. These wouldn't help unless you have the 42pd5200 unfortunately.
    I should be getting the DVE disc next week, and will let you know how I get on, but to be honest I'd be surprised if the PQ got any better. I watched Monsters Inc last night (great test) and the results were unbelievable. Also Pirates of the Carribean which has alot of darker scenes passed no problems.

    For people having PQ problems, have you used any of the THX tests found on the likes of Monsters Inc etc etc. They can help alot

    cheers
     
  26. AGroucutt

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    Thanks Martin that's the way to do it. It worked at 1025 but at 720 it was wavey screen etc. I was going to try and change the dvi to pc mode and try but I didn't get time last night.

    With these higher settings i.e. 720 and 1025 what should i see different is it just more lines higher quality picture or should the image get bigger aswell?
     
  27. mjcairney

    mjcairney
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    I have to tell you that personally I cannot see any difference between 720p and 1080i - I find one to be as good as the other.

    Cheers,

    Martin.
     
  28. Prax

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    Hi MJCAIRNEY

    I have a FDE Plasma as well.

    Been looking for an affordable dvd players and am deciding between the 1910 denon and the S97 for the DVI and HDMI connection.

    Would have liked the 2910 denon but too expensive.

    Would you recommend the S97 or should i consider the 2910 Denon...also is it multi region?

    Thanks :lesson:
     
  29. mjcairney

    mjcairney
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    Hi Prax,

    I am not familiar with the Denon players, although I do have a Denon AVR-2805 receiver with which I am very happy - I don't think Denon do bad equipment - but I definitely would have no hesitation in recommending the S97 - I am delighted with mine and yes, it is multi-region modded.

    Best of luck with your choice, whichever it may be.

    Cheers,

    Martin.
     
  30. Prax

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    thanks for that

    Now got to find a good deal for the S97

    :thumbsup:
     

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