Panasonic JZ2000 disappointment 😞

TomNZ

Novice Member
So I waited and waited. Finally it was down to a Sony A90J or a Panasonic Jz2000.
My friendly local Panasonic dealer persuaded me and a few days later I have a brand new Jz2000 65 inch.

For the last 10 years I have had a Panasonic plasma.
This new TV is my first 4k Oled and to be honest I am really disappointed.

The judder I am getting on motion is just terrible. Panning shots are just awful. Watching squid game the other night it looked like my screen was going to shake itself to death.

I ran some tests and sadly it seems to be better if you leave all the frame creation etc on, it helps the motion, but the picture looks terrible.
I cant win.
I think I am going to take it back and stick with the plasma.
 

Phil1975

Distinguished Member
Think this year the Sony A90J is OLED tv to beat.
 

dotnotbot

Active Member
LG's Cinematic Movement on C1/G1 gets universally praised as the best motion interpolation for movies on OLED yet. Haven't seen it personally but try it out if you can.
I had A80J and HZ1000 and while on A80J (same processor as A90J) motion interpolation is more consistent than HZ1000, it still looks quite fake even on the lowest setting, so if you don't like the way it looks on Pana you may be also disappointed with Sony.
 

WarHog

Member
This is the only thing that is causing me hesitation moving from my Panasonic VT60 plasma to an OLED, I'm worried I will see motion judder and regret buying one. You'd think that with the first TV's coming out around 100 years ago that all modern TV's would be able to cope with motion.
 
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mikej

Well-known Member
Picture menu > Intelligent Frame Creation: Set this to OFF
IFC helps to reduce judder. Turning it off will make things worse.
 

WarHog

Member
Is there any reason why a JZ2000 owner would experience bad motion judder, when most other owners on here don't seem to have it? Is it as simple as incorrect settings, or a faulty TV?
 

Cryfreman

Active Member
Motion on these OLEDS is terrible coming from a plasma to people that ‘see’ it. Some people don’t seem to suffer and think it’s fine.
Be ready for the oled gang coming in to tell you how great oled motion is etc.
Still struggle here with my GZ950 after a year+ of ownership coming from a plasma.
 

Muratcan

Member
Motion on these OLEDS is terrible coming from a plasma to people that ‘see’ it. Some people don’t seem to suffer and think it’s fine.
Be ready for the oled gang coming in to tell you how great oled motion is etc.
Still struggle here with my GZ950 after a year+ of ownership coming from a plasma.
But does the HDR specular highlight detail and 4K resolution, outweigh the motion benefits of 1080p SDR plasma?
 

wesslan

Member
And total blacks and no pwm light buzzing and less heat from panel but yeah I also loved my plasmas but this is a step up on most accounts. Sure if your stuck with your dvd collection and low bitrate tv channels 95% of the time plasma makes sense.
 

WarHog

Member
Most of our viewing on our plasma is with Sky Q, Netflix & Amazon video.
Im hoping if I buy an OLED that the picture quality will remain at least what Im currently used to.
 

thedoswells

Well-known Member
I really believe its down to your sensitivity. I have had 2 Panasonic OLEDs and have no issue with motion at all. And I don't have any motion interpolation on. If you really struggle then maybe avoid oled.
 

Snafu

Member
Have you checked that there are no 24Hz/25Hz/50Hz/60Hz stream/app/somethingsomething settings that weren't right at the moment ?
For example when using apps+chromecast i need to run Disney+ in 60Hz mode but HBO 50Hz or i get judder.
 

thx75

Active Member

v1c

Active Member
IFC helps to reduce judder. Turning it off will make things worse.
I had my EZ952 professionally calibrated and it's off. I came from owning 2 pioneer plasma's over 16 years , didn't go 4k OLED till 3 years ago as was concerned about the picture difference. Turns out it was all in the settings and i can say now that the picture i watch now is an improvement over my plasma and i loved my plasma. I think you need to deep dive settings before you change your mind.
 

Jim Di Griz

Distinguished Member
I loved my three old Panasonic plasmas but the OLED's are something else - massive step up for me. And that's with watching SD, HD, DVD's, Blu-rays, 4K Blu-rays and a bit of streaming (mainly sports).
 

belladona

Novice Member
So I waited and waited. Finally it was down to a Sony A90J or a Panasonic Jz2000.
My friendly local Panasonic dealer persuaded me and a few days later I have a brand new Jz2000 65 inch.

For the last 10 years I have had a Panasonic plasma.
This new TV is my first 4k Oled and to be honest I am really disappointed.

The judder I am getting on motion is just terrible. Panning shots are just awful. Watching squid game the other night it looked like my screen was going to shake itself to death.

I ran some tests and sadly it seems to be better if you leave all the frame creation etc on, it helps the motion, but the picture looks terrible.
I cant win.
I think I am going to take it back and stick with the plasma.
I totally understand what you are saying. I went from a Plasma to LG C8 first and it was horrendous. The problem was the judder but also the fact that the motion interpolation was unusable. If I put it on even the lowest settings there were artefacts left right and center. Picture quality was amazing though but I suffered 2 years until I decided to go for a Panasonic HZ2000, I could test it out in store and watched some blu-ray where I knew the LG had issues and even with motion interpolation I could not see any artefacts.

That being said: I KNOW EXACTLY what you mean about squid game. Even with the Panasonic I struggled at times. The scenes where they sit in front of a WHITE background and there is a panning shot around the participants: horrible judder and shaking.

What works for me is having motion interpolation at MIN and black frame insertion at MIN... this isn't very noticeable (mild soap opera effect but I got used to that pretty quickly), and it helps tremendously with general motion for me...

Sadly I noticed luminance overshoot at times with my Panasonic HZ2000 and now THAT is annoying me because once you see it you start looking for it and it keeps taking you out of the experience. Just like motion did for me with the LG C8... So I cannot win either...

So I understand your disappointment...
 

P Adams

Active Member
Came from a new 2008 THX calibrated Pioneer Kuro LX5090 of 10 years (which my sister still has going strong) to an LG 65E7 OLED in 2018. Hated the motion on it after tweaking everything possible. Sent it back to John Lewis

Replaced it with a Panasonic 65FZ802B in 2018 and have loved it since then. Tweaked the IFC motion settings to between 1 and 3 on ‘blur reduction’ and ‘film smooth’ and it looks superb to us. Haven’t looked back and enjoy SD, HD, terrestrial and Sky+ HD, Blurays, 4K Blurays and 4K streaming on BBC iPlayer and Amazon 4K Fire stick

So the latest Panny OLEDs should be even better yes?! Not sure my wife would like me much if I said I wanted an HZ2000 or 1500 now!
 
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LockStock01

Active Member
For those that have these JZ series OLEDS, and in fact the Sony A series OLEDs or 90J LED tvs. I think I have found the main issue.

The TVs for whatever reason do not process 60Hz content very well at all, this is where the judder becomes difficult to dial out. I believe some content streamed from the built in apps is provided in 60Hz format and this cant be avoided. Similarly in some apps they are in 50Hz but the TV doesnt provide all the necessary motion settings to 'fix it' in those apps. The Iplayer app is an example of this for some of it's UHD content, if you don't like SOE and it's UHD on iplaer you are out of luck.

I have started using my AppleTV 4K for my apps. this allows me to set the native resolution, refresh rate and colour gamut on the apple TV. As an example, if I lock the output to 60Hz, regardless of the underlying native content (24,50,60hz), when given to the TV as 60Hz, I have to chose between high motion settings resulting in soe, and arrifacts, or motion judder... If I set the output to 50Hz, the tv can dial out all the judder by turning everything off except Itelligent frame creation set to 2, 2.

I then tested with setting the basic output limited to 50Hz (not 60hz), but allowing refresh rate to auto match the source content on the Apple TV 4K. again, the tv can perfectly dial out the motion judder in almost all situations. 24hz with all off except frame creation between 2,2 and 4,4 depending on content.. likewise 50 and 60hz looks fine too.. Iplayer looks like a normal TV broadcast watched on a crt...

Unscientifically I'm gonna put this down to native refresh rate. In the UK everything is PAL 50Hz, appaently the panel is 100hz not 120 (i dont understand his if tv does 4k120.. but oh well)..

Anyway, I say give this a try, I bet you find using an external hdmi source so you can chose the refresh rate will give good results compared to the built in apps.

What doesnt work is the 4k120... The TV does not fully support it... it 'says' it does, but it is quietly downgrading to 1080p when using a 120hz 4k signal.. I have tested this with a PS5, and even with VRR and HDR off, the tv says it is outputing 4k120, but I can see there is alternate line skipping on the vertical resolution... This was reported as an issue on the Sony Tvs that share the same chipset... so yea.. looks like only LG and Samsung can support 4k120 this generation... Sony and Panasonic have 'cheated' because the mediatek chipset cant handle the bandwidth..... My tv has had the update that 'enablesn4k20'.....
 

stephentw

Active Member
I didn't realise Panasonic had released the 4k120 update yet? It's half vertical resolution until that arrives.

In terms of the skipping/judder with 50hz, HDTV Test mentions this in his reviews, I'm sure he says it's present on all OLED this year? I'm sure he also mentions issues with streaming but I can't remember which TV it was now as I've watched all his OLED reviews and comparisons from this and last year while researching for my own purchase.

I think your solution seems right though, using an external box for streaming apps. I always find manufacturers don't keep apps updated as often as for example Apple or Android anyway and at some point in the TV's lifespan they'll just stop working so an extra box while less convenient seems a better solution to me.
 

LockStock01

Active Member
I didn't realise Panasonic had released the 4k120 update yet? It's half vertical resolution until that arrives.

In terms of the skipping/judder with 50hz, HDTV Test mentions this in his reviews, I'm sure he says it's present on all OLED this year? I'm sure he also mentions issues with streaming but I can't remember which TV it was now as I've watched all his OLED reviews and comparisons from this and last year while researching for my own purchase.

I think your solution seems right though, using an external box for streaming apps. I always find manufacturers don't keep apps updated as often as for example Apple or Android anyway and at some point in the TV's lifespan they'll just stop working so an extra box while less convenient seems a better solution to me.
Yea I made the mistake of thinking the most recent update provided a fix as VRR is available in the menu and also 4k120hz with dolby vision was 'working'... But I think you are right and I'm mistaken, there hasn't been an update so still getting half resolution. I'm fairly sure it's a hardware limitation for the chipset so doubt it will be fixed.

I should say I actually found that it is 60Hz material where the judder can't be rectified, and with 50hz from an external source, the TV can resolve this resolution with good motion using minimal frame creation (2,2 to 4,4)... With 50hz material on some built in apps it's a problem though such as iplayer. It may make a difference whether the source material is interlaced or progressive but I couldn't test this.

Anyway, compared to the sony x90j, x85j and even the A70J, the panny jz1000 easily has the best (imo) motion handling. it manages to get rid of almost any noticable motion judder in panning shots whilst avoiding SOE. The sony just couldnt do it without SOE and artifacts. The LG do handle motion well, to reduce judder, but they all have SOE I can't deal with.. for live sports i found the LG C15 had artifacts when using ifc to deal with fast motion...
 

WarHog

Member
So is it best to use say an Apple TV box when watching Netflix or Amazon Video instead of using these apps from the TV?
 

LockStock01

Active Member
So is it best to use say an Apple TV box.. when watching Netflix or Amazon Video instead of using these apps from the TV?
netflix and amazon are okay, but you loose some of the picture options and modes... for example they repeatedly enable dolby vision, max out luminance and don't allow motion adjustment fully.. iplayer is rubbish.. so yea, not essential but I use apple tv for all apps
 

WarHog

Member
Thanks. How about Disney+, would that be better when viewed from the Apple TV rather than from the TV itself?
 

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