Panasonic DP-UB820EB, DP-UB420EB and DP-UB320EB Owners Thread

I thought you said your UB820 was in storage as backup....;)

All the time = when it is being used. My UB700 fan came on at startup, then shutoff again and never came back on again during playback
It was. I dug it out recently just to check that it was still OK. All OK at present after playing a couple of discs, so now back in its box again. No fan noise though.
 
Would have thought that was obvious, given I specifically mentioned Panasonic TV's and it not being beneficial in that scenario. But as you're asking, you may see a benefit with the HDR Optimiser, in that case.

All the HDR Optimiser does is essentially pre-tone map the outgoing video, which changes the point at which specular highlights clip. And it's using Panasonic's strategy to do so. That's the important part as if you have a recent Panasonic TV, it will already be using that strategy. If you don't, and own an LG E6 for example, it won't and the feature could very well noticeably improve the PQ, with HDR10 content, over a player that doesn't have that feature. Like a UB700.

''''''''particularly useful for certain OLED's and more budget LCD TVs as their max light output is typically someway short of 1000 nits.
Make your mind up :)
One minute Optimiser is no benefit "I'd be surprised if it was anywhere near that level of improvement, if there was any at all"...."in a double blind test, you'd struggle to tell any difference" and the next it is 'see a benefit' or 'could noticeably improve the PQ" for some TVs.
It's also worth pointing out that most recent TV's, including the later LG OLEDs, have their own dynamic tone mapping functionality, for HDR10 content. This too would render the HDR Optimiser pretty much useless too.
Ah, too good to hope for. We're back here with a "pretty much useless" line again
Are you speaking theoretically or from experience of all recent TVs?

With my 2018 LG E8 at least, DTM adjusts both the top end (clipping) and the bottom end (blacks). I don't use it because of this as it produces elevated blacks a lot of the time. DTM (for LG E8 at least) thus can screw up overall near black calibration as a result. Whereas Optimiser only works on the top end reducing clipping and basically leaves the calibration untouched.

I use Optimiser, I don't use the TV's dynamic tone mapping which I find lacking.
That aside, only one specific disc mentioned, with a specific TV and no mention of what specifically is improved?!
You should be able to work that out by yourself. What does Optimiser do? Tone map to reduce clipping. What is improved? overall PQ (you have just referred to that exact same point yourself 'could very well noticeably improve the PQ').

With Sony 4K 35mm film scans the high nits used has a tendency to cause enhanced, more visible HDR grain and produce way too hot contrast. Starship Troopers, Crouching Tiger and others from that time suffer from this. Run them through Optimiser and most/all of that is gone.
I'm not sure what you're trying to state here? The HDR Optimiser should operate at all MaxCLL's, those typically being 1000 nits, 2000 nits, 4000 nits and 10000 nits. That's the very point of its existence. And it's particularly useful for certain OLED's and more budget LCD TVs as their max light output is typically someway short of 1000 nits.
I'm trying to state exactly what I said. While on the one hand I think Optimiser is something worth having; on the other hand I think it's worthwhile and fair to point out to potential buyers that HDR Optimiser will do nothing for most TVs falling into the High LCD/Oled/Middle LCD category with the many recent UHDs which are mastered below 1000 nits.

Your 'MaxCLL' figures appear to be Max Luminance numbers rather than MaxCLL (shown as Maximum Light level on the UB820/UB9000 metadata display).

Have you checked the MaxCLL and MaxFall metadata of recent discs? The discs have metadata mostly below, in some cases well below, 1000 nits. Look at the metadata of Bladerunner 2049 UHD for an example of this. MaxCLL: 487 and MaxFALL: 179. Or Tenet UHD MaxCLL 349 and MaxFALL: 86.

Optimiser doesn't do changes*** (it shows both input and output metadata as being the same) at <1000 nits as that is the operating target in its algorithm for Oleds and Middle LCD.
IF MaxCLL >1000 nits, reduce to 1,000 nits; else leave untouched.
(For High LCD display replace 1000 above with 1500, for PJ replace 1000 with 500 or 350 (UB9000)).

*** except to Max Luminance where for this type of disc it will change MaxLum to the highest of MaxCLL or MaxFALL. In the case of Tenet, 4000-->349. However as that 349 is well below 1000 nits which the TV's own tone mapping should be able to deal with I see little potential benefit in that change. Certainly I personally can't see any difference whether Optimiser is on or off for these low nits discs on a TV which can reach 750-800 nits.

I'm not sure if there has been a change in the processing here as I seem to remember when the UB820 first came out the MaxLum being passed untouched where it was 1,000 or changed to 1,000 if at say 4,000, not to a low MaxCLL figure..

Even for PJs and TVs set at the 500 nits display type (PJ/Low LCD) many recent discs will not exceed the Optimiser target nits level. Only at the 350 nits display type level can it be pretty much guaranteed to be doing something with all discs. But that target display level is only available on the UB9000, not on the UB820. And it is the UB820 that is being discussed.
I'd argue any TV should have adequate picture controls onboard.
You may argue that, but it's not reflected in what TV manufacturers actually do...
  1. Do Panasonic TVs have the same controls as a UB820? Dynamic Range Adjust, tone curve (black), tone curve (white), System Gamma? My LG E8 doesn't.
  2. Do Panasonic TV allow you to change gamma for HDR10? My LG doesn't and it is locked to 2.2
  3. Do you really want to change a calibrated TV's picture controls and what's more change them on a disc by disc basis? I certainly don't.
  4. Which brings me onto that after using Calman Autocal on LG most important picture controls are locked anyway (except Colour, Oled Light, Contrast and Brightness). Even gamma is locked for SDR.
  5. Do Panasonic TVs have the fine granularity for picture adjustment controls that the players offer. Both my LG TVs don't. I'd estimate the player has 3-4 adjustment clicks to 1 click on the TV.
And the SoC is different as it doesn't need to include the HDR Optimiser.
If that were the case the original HCX SOC from the UB700/UB900 could have been used as neither of them have the HDR Optimiser. It wasn't. Instead, presumably on cost grounds to bring the player in at a lower price point, another SOC was used which imo offers a reduced feature set in terms of picture adjustment than the HCX or HCX2 SOCs.
But we've been over that, and how much difference it will make...
No, you've been over that.
For you maybe it makes no difference as you have a new TV (still using the lumagen with that?). For most others who aren't in that position of having a new TV it can make a difference worth the £100 premium to get it. Better to have a feature and not need it than need the feature and find to get it will require spending twice.

To bring it back to the OP question, I'd rather upgrade from a UB700 to a UB820 (I did) than downgrade to a UB450. The reasons why are covered in what has turned out to be an alarming long post...:(
 
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Make your mind up :)
One minute Optimiser is no benefit "I'd be surprised if it was anywhere near that level of improvement, if there was any at all"...."in a double blind test, you'd struggle to tell any difference" and the next it is 'see a benefit' or 'could noticeably improve the PQ" for some TVs.
Ah, too good to hope for. We're back here with a "pretty much useless" line again
Are you speaking theoretically or from experience of all recent TVs?

With my 2018 LG E8 at least, DTM adjusts both the top end (clipping) and the bottom end (blacks). I don't use it because of this as it produces elevated blacks a lot of the time. DTM (for LG E8 at least) thus can screw up overall near black calibration as a result. Whereas Optimiser only works on the top end reducing clipping and basically leaves the calibration untouched.

I use Optimiser, I don't use the TV's dynamic tone mapping which I find lacking.

You should be able to work that out by yourself. What does Optimiser do? Tone map to reduce clipping. What is improved? overall PQ (you have just referred to that exact same point yourself 'could very well noticeably improve the PQ').

With Sony 4K 35mm film scans the high nits used has a tendency to cause enhanced, more visible HDR grain and produce way too hot contrast. Starship Troopers, Crouching Tiger and others from that time suffer from this. Run them through Optimiser and most/all of that is gone.

I'm trying to state exactly what I said. While on the one hand I think Optimiser is something worth having; on the other hand I think it's worthwhile and fair to point out to potential buyers that HDR Optimiser will do nothing for most TVs falling into the High LCD/Oled/Middle LCD category with the many recent UHDs which are mastered below 1000 nits.

Your 'MaxCLL' figures appear to be Max Luminance numbers rather than MaxCLL (shown as Maximum Light level on the UB820/UB9000 metadata display).

Have you checked the MaxCLL and MaxFall metadata of recent discs? The discs have metadata mostly below, in some cases well below, 1000 nits. Look at the metadata of Bladerunner 2049 UHD for an example of this. MaxCLL: 487 and MaxFALL: 179. Or Tenet UHD MaxCLL 349 and MaxFALL: 86.

Optimiser doesn't do changes*** (it shows both input and output metadata as being the same) at <1000 nits as that is the operating target in its algorithm for Oleds and Middle LCD.
IF MaxCLL >1000 nits, reduce to 1,000 nits; else leave untouched.
(For High LCD display replace 1000 above with 1500, for PJ replace 1000 with 500 or 350 (UB9000)).

*** except to Max Luminance where for this type of disc it will change MaxLum to the highest of MaxCLL or MaxFALL. In the case of Tenet, 4000-->349. However as that 349 is well below 1000 nits which the TV's own tone mapping should be able to deal with I see little potential benefit in that change. Certainly I personally can't see any difference whether Optimiser is on or off for these low nits discs on a TV which can reach 750-800 nits.

I'm not sure if there has been a change in the processing here as I seem to remember when the UB820 first came out the MaxLum being passed untouched where it was 1,000 or changed to 1,000 if at say 4,000, not to a low MaxCLL figure..

Even for PJs and TVs set at the 500 nits display type (PJ/Low LCD) many recent discs will not exceed the Optimiser target nits level. Only at the 350 nits display type level can it be pretty much guaranteed to be doing something with all discs. But that target display level is only available on the UB9000, not on the UB820. And it is the UB820 that is being discussed.

You may argue that, but it's not reflected in what TV manufacturers actually do...
  1. Do Panasonic TVs have the same controls as a UB820? Dynamic Range Adjust, tone curve (black), tone curve (white), System Gamma? My LG E8 doesn't.
  2. Do Panasonic TV allow you to change gamma for HDR10? My LG doesn't and it is locked to 2.2
  3. Do you really want to change a calibrated TV's picture controls and what's more change them on a disc by disc basis? I certainly don't.
  4. Which brings me onto that after using Calman Autocal on LG most important picture controls are locked anyway (except Colour, Oled Light, Contrast and Brightness). Even gamma is locked for SDR.
  5. Do Panasonic TVs have the fine granularity for picture adjustment controls that the players offer. Both my LG TVs don't. I'd estimate the player has 3-4 adjustment clicks to 1 click on the TV.

If that were the case the original HCX SOC from the UB700/UB900 could have been used as neither of them have the HDR Optimiser. It wasn't. Instead, presumably on cost grounds to bring the player in at a lower price point, another SOC was used which imo offers a reduced feature set in terms of picture adjustment than the HCX or HCX2 SOCs.

No, you've been over that.
For you maybe it makes no difference as you have a new TV (still using the lumagen with that?). For most others who aren't in that position of having a new TV it can make a difference worth the £100 premium to get it. Better to have a feature and not need it than need the feature and find to get it will require spending twice.

To bring it back to the OP question, I'd rather upgrade from a UB700 to a UB820 (I did) than downgrade to a UB450. The reasons why are covered in what has turned out to be an alarming long post...:(
I agree entirely.
The Optimizer has greatly improved the tone curve on my tv. It's an older tv - EX750.
Even though the test material indicates the tv does not technically clip until approaching 1400-1500 nits, the actual max peak white I have measured is only 500 nit. But that level is rarely achieved in real time viewing.
The optimizer set to middle luminance (1000 nit) does nothing for 1000 nit titles and the tv tone maps these titles.
However, the way the tv maps 1000 nit titles is poor compared to the optimizer set to low 500 nit.
Simple a-b testing with optimizer on and off shows marked changes. Much more detail and colour is revealed, bringing the picture more in line with the natural image of the original. Brighter areas are indeed visibly 'clipped' without it.
Essentially, the 820 is replacing the poor tone mapping of the tv.
Granted, the tv's clipping can be eliminated by reducing contrast, so even 4000 nit titles are corrected, but in doing so those titles are dimmed. You need to reduce contrast to about 79% to eliminate clipping on numerous Sony discs.
On the ub900 I had to use the dynamic range optimizer to take the picture's contrast down to those levels on certain discs.
The examples given such as Starship Troopers look poor even on the 1000 nit level with the optimizer at Middle. Others include King Kong and Bridge on the River Kwai, which are only watchable with the optimizer set to 500 nit.
Whilst other titles mastered at below 1000 nit (between 500 and 1000, such as the Hobbit etc.) look ok without the optimizer on, again an a-b comparison shows that detail is retrieved by the optimizer set to 500 nit.
I would agree that the 820 is worth the extra outlay over the 450 and is indeed a massive upgrade over the 900.
Besides the HDR optimizer issue, the image on the 820 with the latest firmware is better than that of the 900 (which I still have).
 
Make your mind up :)
One minute Optimiser is no benefit "I'd be surprised if it was anywhere near that level of improvement, if there was any at all"...."in a double blind test, you'd struggle to tell any difference" and the next it is 'see a benefit' or 'could noticeably improve the PQ" for some TVs.
Ah, too good to hope for. We're back here with a "pretty much useless" line again
Are you speaking theoretically or from experience of all recent TVs?
My mind is made but, might I suggest that you have a re-read of what I actually wrote, instead of quoting extracts out of context?

Or, I'll just summarise, in context - if you own a recent Panasonic TV or one that has it's own dynamic tone mapping feature, HDR Optimiser will be of little use. In any other scenario, it might.

This was also inferred but, to be clear, you could also use the HDR Optimiser, if you prefer Panasonic's way of tone mapping HDR10 content.

With my 2018 LG E8 at least, DTM adjusts both the top end (clipping) and the bottom end (blacks). I don't use it because of this as it produces elevated blacks a lot of the time. DTM (for LG E8 at least) thus can screw up overall near black calibration as a result. Whereas Optimiser only works on the top end reducing clipping and basically leaves the calibration untouched.
That's clearly specific to LG's and a very odd implementation. Tone mapping was devised, as a process to deal with aspects of the content the TV could not display within its native capabilities. I.e. the parts of the content beyond around 700 nits, using your TV as an example.

I use Optimiser, I don't use the TV's dynamic tone mapping which I find lacking.
So, you prefer Panasonic's tone mapping approach, over LG's. Nothing wrong with that.

You should be able to work that out by yourself. What does Optimiser do? Tone map to reduce clipping. What is improved? overall PQ (you have just referred to that exact same point yourself 'could very well noticeably improve the PQ').
Thanks for spelling it out. If we're being pedantic, and we clearly are, no it won't. It'll improve the aspect of PQ where tone mapping occurs. I.e. beyond around 70% stimulus. You know this already though, as you'd stated it below, twice.

Or am I taking those quotes out of context?

And yes, I did write that it would improve PQ, and it will..... in the area of the content that requires tone mapping.
With Sony 4K 35mm film scans the high nits used has a tendency to cause enhanced, more visible HDR grain and produce way too hot contrast. Starship Troopers, Crouching Tiger and others from that time suffer from this. Run them through Optimiser and most/all of that is gone.
Useful to know.
I'm trying to state exactly what I said. While on the one hand I think Optimiser is something worth having; on the other hand I think it's worthwhile and fair to point out to potential buyers that HDR Optimiser will do nothing for most TVs falling into the High LCD/Oled/Middle LCD category with the many recent UHDs which are mastered below 1000 nits.
Well, that's not what you wrote as I had to ask for clarity. This statement makes sense. I think. But to ensure I'm understanding what you're actually stating. Is that because many recent UHD's are graded with a MaxCLL of under 1000 nits, and the displays in your list can get close to that, there's no need for tone mapping? And thus the HDR Optimiser? That being the case, I'd agree.
Your 'MaxCLL' figures appear to be Max Luminance numbers rather than MaxCLL (shown as Maximum Light level on the UB820/UB9000 metadata display).
They're arbitrary figures that were/ can be used to define the typical MaxCLL thresholds for UHD BD HDR gradings. As you've pointed out, discs can be graded to any MaxCLL (and MaxFALL), they don't have to stick to those numbers.
Have you checked the MaxCLL and MaxFall metadata of recent discs?
Nope. I've got better things to do with my time and just let my TV do its thing, when it comes to accurately reproducing any content I display on it.
Optimiser doesn't do changes*** (it shows both input and output metadata as being the same) at <1000 nits as that is the operating target in its algorithm for Oleds and Middle LCD.
IF MaxCLL >1000 nits, reduce to 1,000 nits; else leave untouched.
(For High LCD display replace 1000 above with 1500, for PJ replace 1000 with 500 or 350 (UB9000)).


*** except to Max Luminance where for this type of disc it will change MaxLum to the highest of MaxCLL or MaxFALL. In the case of Tenet, 4000-->349. However as that 349 is well below 1000 nits which the TV's own tone mapping should be able to deal with I see little potential benefit in that change. Certainly I personally can't see any difference whether Optimiser is on or off for these low nits discs on a TV which can reach 750-800 nits.
Well yes, but it's a bit more than just changing the MaxCLL flag isn't it?! As it actually performs tone mapping where it's changing the MaxCLL to 1000 nits, if the disc has a higher value than this.

That aside, if you've bought a modern HDR display, that supports actual HDR formats, it's onboard tone mapping process should be able to deal with any HDR content, no matter what the MaxCLL of the disc is. Should it not? As discussed, the HDR Optimiser may well do a better job of it though.
Only at the 350 nits display type level can it be pretty much guaranteed to be doing something with all discs.
That the display should already be able to do, with its onboard tone mapping process?!
I ask this again as there's a theme in your responses where you're inferring these displays aren't tone mapping themselves. They are, they may just not be very good at it.
You may argue that, but it's not reflected in what TV manufacturers actually do...
  1. Do Panasonic TVs have the same controls as a UB820? Dynamic Range Adjust, tone curve (black), tone curve (white), System Gamma? My LG E8 doesn't. System Gamma yes (it's called Gamma...). The others no, but why would it need them? The TV's processor knows the TV's own capabilities and has a tone mapping process to suit. These controls are for those who don't know the tone mapping capabilities of the display device and thus can adjust the players output to suit.
  2. Do Panasonic TV allow you to change gamma for HDR10? My LG doesn't and it is locked to 2.2 Yes, it can be changed but you wouldn't want to, especially on the OLED panels. And that's for the same reason as on your LGD WRGB OLED panel equipped LG E8. Essentially, the panels have a design gamma of 2.2 and thus the gamma/ EOTF response of the TV is created around this. If you change that display gamma figure, you'll screw up how the TV performs its EOTF. Essentially, it's locked so those who don't understand that, can't make a mess. The same reason the OLED Light, Contrast and Brightness controls are disabled.
  3. Do you really want to change a calibrated TV's picture controls and what's more change them on a disc by disc basis? I certainly don't. No, I calibrate to the standards (there is only one for HDR10), so don't need to change anything, post calibration. Mitigating a badly graded disc, by diverging from the video standards is not good practice.
  4. Which brings me onto that after using Calman Autocal on LG most important picture controls are locked anyway (except Colour, Oled Light, Contrast and Brightness). Even gamma is locked for SDR. See point 2. The only setting you may want to adjust, to suit your viewing environment is OLED Light from your list. All the others listed, no matter what the format you're calibrating for, shouldn't need adjusting. And although having Gamma disabled for SDR seems odd, you or in this case CalMAN, can adjust the individual Luminance controls to change display gamma. So it's not an issue in reality. Out of interest, are the disabled controls enabled if you perform a manual calibration?
  5. Do Panasonic TVs have the fine granularity for picture adjustment controls that the players offer. Both my LG TVs don't. I'd estimate the player has 3-4 adjustment clicks to 1 click on the TV. Which specific picture controls? Not that I need them as my GZ2000 calibrates just fine with the TV's picture controls. See chart for example.
Answers in bold. And a number of these seem to be specific to your situation, using CalMAN AutoCal.
If that were the case the original HCX SOC from the UB700/UB900 could have been used as neither of them have the HDR Optimiser. It wasn't. Instead, presumably on cost grounds to bring the player in at a lower price point, another SOC was used which imo offers a reduced feature set in terms of picture adjustment than the HCX or HCX2 SOCs.
No argument from me. As I wrote, the mentioned players do have a reduced feature set over the UB820.
No, you've been over that.
For you maybe it makes no difference as you have a new TV (still using the lumagen with that?). For most others who aren't in that position of having a new TV it can make a difference worth the £100 premium to get it. Better to have a feature and not need it than need the feature and find to get it will require spending twice.
Again, no argument, and inline with what I wrote. I do appreciate the Alien vs Predator reference though. :D

No need for the Lumagen with the GZ2000. The calibration controls work. Unlike the LG b6's, that it was used with.
To bring it back to the OP question, I'd rather upgrade from a UB700 to a UB820 (I did) than downgrade to a UB450. The reasons why are covered in what has turned out to be an alarming long post...:(
Yes, it was, wasn't it?! :D

Paul
GZ2000_1080p50_profiled_meter.PNG
 
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Have I nicked your fragile ego by disagreeing with you?
There is absolutely no need for a rude and personal attack like that.
It doesn't pass the face to face would I say that to someone I don't know in the pub test.
As a result of it, the rest of your post is ignored.
As are you, so no help from me in future for the likes of the problem I was discussing with you the other day.
 
There is absolutely no need for a rude and personal attack like that.
Was not my intention and if this is the result, I do apologise. To be honest, I was responding in kind to the perceived tone of your response. Childish I know but, there you are.
Clearly that comment won't disappear, as you've quoted it but, I'll remove it from the offending post.

Paul
 
I agree entirely.
The Optimizer has greatly improved the tone curve on my tv. It's an older tv - EX750.
Even though the test material indicates the tv does not technically clip until approaching 1400-1500 nits, the actual max peak white I have measured is only 500 nit. But that level is rarely achieved in real time viewing.
The optimizer set to middle luminance (1000 nit) does nothing for 1000 nit titles and the tv tone maps these titles.
However, the way the tv maps 1000 nit titles is poor compared to the optimizer set to low 500 nit.
Simple a-b testing with optimizer on and off shows marked changes. Much more detail and colour is revealed, bringing the picture more in line with the natural image of the original. Brighter areas are indeed visibly 'clipped' without it.
Essentially, the 820 is replacing the poor tone mapping of the tv.
Granted, the tv's clipping can be eliminated by reducing contrast, so even 4000 nit titles are corrected, but in doing so those titles are dimmed. You need to reduce contrast to about 79% to eliminate clipping on numerous Sony discs.
On the ub900 I had to use the dynamic range optimizer to take the picture's contrast down to those levels on certain discs.
The examples given such as Starship Troopers look poor even on the 1000 nit level with the optimizer at Middle. Others include King Kong and Bridge on the River Kwai, which are only watchable with the optimizer set to 500 nit.
Whilst other titles mastered at below 1000 nit (between 500 and 1000, such as the Hobbit etc.) look ok without the optimizer on, again an a-b comparison shows that detail is retrieved by the optimizer set to 500 nit.
I would agree that the 820 is worth the extra outlay over the 450 and is indeed a massive upgrade over the 900.
Besides the HDR optimizer issue, the image on the 820 with the latest firmware is better than that of the 900 (which I still have).
Useful info especially for those with older or lower nits TVs. With the specs of your TV it's not obvious that the much lower nits display type setting would prove to be a better fit for improved PQ.

I may try using that 500 nits setting myself with the likes of Tenet UHD and see if there is any difference. Logically there shouldn't be as my Oled can reach a measured 800 nits but you never know. I remember when I watched Tenet I wasn't too happy with the PQ and had to do a bit of fiddling with the Panasonic picture controls. Even though it is low nits I found the picture overall too dark, especially the face and hair of John David Washington
 
Has anyone had issues running Flash Gordon on a 820? I'm looking at getting the deluxe set but am worried about the disc issues I've been hearing about.
 
Useful info especially for those with older or lower nits TVs. With the specs of your TV it's not obvious that the much lower nits display type setting would prove to be a better fit for improved PQ.

I may try using that 500 nits setting myself with the likes of Tenet UHD and see if there is any difference. Logically there shouldn't be as my Oled can reach a measured 800 nits but you never know. I remember when I watched Tenet I wasn't too happy with the PQ and had to do a bit of fiddling with the Panasonic picture controls. Even though it is low nits I found the picture overall too dark, especially the face and hair of John David Washington
I just assumed the 'issues' in Tenet were intended. I saw exactly the same things in Washington's face.
Given the tv is 500 nit max but seems to assume a 1000 nit range and tone map accordingly, it is giving issues with HDR10+ too.
10+ was supposed to match the image with the set's capabilities and therefore improve image.
I've found it is assuming a 1000 nit level and so slightly blowing out the top end. Consequently the HDR10 base with the optimizer looks more natural.
 
I just assumed the 'issues' in Tenet were intended. I saw exactly the same things in Washington's face.
Given the tv is 500 nit max but seems to assume a 1000 nit range and tone map accordingly, it is giving issues with HDR10+ too.
10+ was supposed to match the image with the set's capabilities and therefore improve image.
I've found it is assuming a 1000 nit level and so slightly blowing out the top end. Consequently the HDR10 base with the optimizer looks more natural.
That's Dolby Vision. HDR10+ is as dumb to the display's capabilities as vanilla HDR10 is.

The format doesn't assume anything about the luminance levels of the content either. The content is graded and appropriate metadata added to inform the display device of the luminance aspects and the TV's tone mapping strategy should do the rest. That being the case, your comments suggest your EX750 isn't handling HDR10+ content as it should, at least with specific metadata it receives. Although, you've clearly got the player's HDR Optimiser to work for you, to mitigate that shortcoming.

Paul
 
I just assumed the 'issues' in Tenet were intended. I saw exactly the same things in Washington's face.
Given the tv is 500 nit max but seems to assume a 1000 nit range and tone map accordingly, it is giving issues with HDR10+ too.
Maybe Nolan took the criticism of the Interstellar UHD black levels being grey to heart and with Tenet instead plumped for black crush as the intended look. "Complain about my black levels would you?, I'll show you. I can do black. Take a look at these black levels. Happy now?" :eek:
 
That's Dolby Vision. HDR10+ is as dumb to the display's capabilities as vanilla HDR10 is.

The format doesn't assume anything about the luminance levels of the content either. The content is graded and appropriate metadata added to inform the display device of the luminance aspects and the TV's tone mapping strategy should do the rest. That being the case, your comments suggest your EX750 isn't handling HDR10+ content as it should, at least with specific metadata it receives. Although, you've clearly got the player's HDR Optimiser to work for you, to mitigate that shortcoming.

Paul
One HDR 10+ title looks great - Alien. Others like the Cornetto Trilogy look ok. Whilst others like Jaws and Dawn of the Dead look best with it off.
And they all look fine at 10 with the optimizer.
It's an early set with many quirks 0:)
 
One HDR 10+ title looks great - Alien. Others like the Cornetto Trilogy look ok. Whilst others like Jaws and Dawn of the Dead look best with it off.
And they all look fine at 10 with the optimizer.
It's an early set with many quirks 0:)
Making what you have work, is most of the fun. 🤓

As we've seen with the Tenet disc metadata, what's being delivered to the consumer is far from what it should be and that's been the case since HDR10 inception (pun intended....). So doesn't look to be getting any better, any time soon. The TV, any TV, really does deserves better to work with.

Paul
 
Maybe Nolan took the criticism of the Interstellar UHD black levels being grey to heart and with Tenet instead plumped for black crush as the intended look. "Complain about my black levels would you?, I'll show you. I can do black. Take a look at these black levels. Happy now?" :eek:
Nolan is a bit weird. Uses mega IMAX kit that should render the most realistic image. Then he swathes his image in cyan, in Dunkirk.
Not that this is the most objectionable element of that movie imo.
 
Don't dynamic formats like HDR10+ and DV "override" the HDR Optimizer anyway (i.e. the Optimizer isn't available)?
 
Does anyone else have issues with the Youtube app on the 820 ? Mine frequently crashes and I have to either restart it from the apps menu or reboot the player completely.
 
Hi! Recently purchased the UB420. It is hooked up to an Anthem MRX520 (2.1 setup), and from there to a Panasonic OLED.
I am having issues with sound dropping out when skipping chapters and pressing play after a pause. The sound comes up fine at first.
Digital output is set as Bitstream. PCM works as it should. Have tried the movie 1917, both the 4K and BD versions and they act the same. I am moving the player to a cinema room with Atmos soon - so need it to work with Bitstream.
Anyone know what causes this?
 
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Hi! Recently purchased the UB420. It is hooked up to an Anthem MRX520 (2.1 setup), and from there to a Panasonic OLED.
I am having issues with sound dropping out when skipping chapters and pressing play after a pause. The sound comes up fine at first.
Digital output is set as Bitstream. PCM works as it should. Have tried the movie 1917, both the 4K and BD versions and they act the same. I am moving the player to a cinema room with Atmos soon - so need it to work with Bitstream.
Anyone know what causes this?
HDMI lead perhaps. You will need a certified 4K one. How long is the run?
 
2m cable run should be OK. Is it clear of other cables? Amazon Basics cables are worth a go.
 
2m cable run should be OK. Is it clear of other cables? Amazon Basics cables are worth a go.
Yes, it is clear of other cables. I have also used the same cable with other 4k and Full-HD sources. I am starting to wonder if it is a TrueHD issue of some kind.
 
Hi, I have the 820. For audio it is just connected via optical to my dac then onto a 2 channel set up.
Could anyone please advise how to change the High Clarity modes. I've read that there are several but I only have off, with video and without. I've read that there are several High clarity modes.
Thank you.
 
Hi, I have the 820. For audio it is just connected via optical to my dac then onto a 2 channel set up.
Could anyone please advise how to change the High Clarity modes. I've read that there are several but I only have off, with video and without. I've read that there are several High clarity modes.
Thank you.
That is all there is. On/Off, With/Without video.
Maybe you are thinking of the Sound effects, remaster, and Digital Tube Sound. When playing back a disc, press Option on the remote and go to sound. You can then choose from the menus displayed.
See page 28 of the UB820 manual.
 
Awesome. Thank you. Got that and will check the modes out. I must download the manual. There wasn't one in the box. Just a set up guide. Going back to the high clarity option, does it provide any benefit for cd playback? Thanks again
 

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