PAL resolution and component cables

echelon

Novice Member
Sorry, this may have been answered in the huge "component cables" thread, but what's with all the fuss over having a 480p signal??

480p is an American NTSC format and vastly inferior to our own - through RGB the Wii will output 576i, which is 20% better resolution!!

Are you really willing to dump 20% of the screen lines just for a progressive signal? Presumably everyone's LCD can de-interlace pretty well anyway (i know mine can!).

I bought the expensive xbox HD-pack for my Xbox and though its great for outputting XBMC in 720p, but now the games run it 480p and they look TERRIBLE, all blurry and washed out! Hontestly the original Xbox composite cables looked better.
 

py6km

Well-known Member
I was advised that the component cable would provide far superior image quality.

What's the bundled lead - composite/scart ? If so, isn't that inferior becuase component is a high(er) definition capable connection?
 

radiokid

Standard Member
Is there any confirmation that PAL Wii games will run at 576i? I wouldnt have thought we would get anything other than 480i, maybe someone can confirm this?

As far as using component goes, even if you run an interlaced 480i (or 576i) signal through component the quality of the image will be very much better than composite (that the bundled Wii cable produces), RGB scart or S-video.
 

echelon

Novice Member
Is there any confirmation that PAL Wii games will run at 576i? I wouldnt have thought we would get anything other than 480i, maybe someone can confirm this?

As far as using component goes, even if you run an interlaced 480i (or 576i) signal through component the quality of the image will be very much better than composite (that the bundled Wii cable produces), RGB scart or S-video.
it couldn't output at 480i - that's not part of the PAL standard, and wouldnt be supported by all European TVs. It *has* to output at 576i if they want to sell it in Europe.

Either it'll output the full game at a slightly higher resolution, OR it'll output the game with black borders, to push the 576i picture down to 480. However, consoles havent done the black border thing since the SNES days.

Games consoles can afford to output slightly higher resolutions for us PAL gamers, cos they output at 50hz rather than 60hz, i.e. it draws 10 frames less per second.

Also RGB SCART isnt that far behind component, as picture quality goes. The only reason the American's are going apesh*t over the component cables is cos the best alternative output they have is S-video (which again is hugely inferior).

Anyway, its up to you if you want to throw out 20% of the resolution for a progessive signal.
 

Kirby

Active Member
PAL interlaced doesn't physically look better than ntsc progressive, progressive always looks sharper has less flickering and deeper colours. 576P on the other hand would look nicer on our tv's but it isn't going to be happening because of the extra work involved.
Personally I would say that RGB scart (which is a very outdated connection) looks no better really than an S-video connection, but on larger screen tv's the difference for component is clear.
 

chris1210

Novice Member
You can throw all the techy jargon at me all day long, but the fact is 480p looks considerably better than anything a Wii will produce through Composite or RGB.
 

Korum

Well-known Member
echelon, LOL,I've never read so much misinformation for a long time.

480p is an American NTSC format and vastly inferior to our own - through RGB the Wii will output 576i, which is 20% better resolution!!

You really do believe this statement don't you?

I bought the expensive xbox HD-pack for my Xbox and though its great for outputting XBMC in 720p, but now the games run it 480p and they look TERRIBLE, all blurry and washed out! Hontestly the original Xbox composite cables looked better.

Now you really are having a laugh, the xbox looked superb in 480p compared to it's dreadful composite cables, how on earth did you arrive at this conclusion-blurry & washed out colours? That sounds like composite to me

it couldn't output at 480i - that's not part of the PAL standard, and wouldnt be supported by all European TVs. It *has* to output at 576i if they want to sell it in Europe.

Rubbish,How do you explain all the PAL games which have '60hz only' on the box?

Either it'll output the full game at a slightly higher resolution, OR it'll output the game with black borders, to push the 576i picture down to 480. However, consoles havent done the black border thing since the SNES days.

Waht are you on about 'since the SNES days' this year the PS2 has produced some terrible PAL conversions,

Games consoles can afford to output slightly higher resolutions for us PAL gamers, cos they output at 50hz rather than 60hz, i.e. it draws 10 frames less per second.

OMG, You make this out to be a good thing

Also RGB SCART isnt that far behind component, as picture quality goes. The only reason the American's are going apesh*t over the component cables is cos the best alternative output they have is S-video (which again is hugely inferior).

S-video isn't hugely inferior, it's on a par with RGB.

Anyway, its up to you if you want to throw out 20% of the resolution for a progessive signal.

Yes Please
 

Jeff

Well-known Member
PAL compatibility is irrelevant for component, PAL is composite ONLY. :lesson:
 

pigdog237

Active Member

G a f f e r

Well-known Member
It all depends on what has the better de-interlacing chip.

If the Wii has de-interlacing that is handled better than a projector, then 576i will look better than 576p.

The reason is that no matter what you throw at an LCD panel, it will output a progressive signal 'cos that's how it works.
Give it 480i and what you see on the projector is 480p...up/downsampled to the native resolution of the panel.
Give it 576i, what you'll see is 576p..then down/upsampled to the native res of the panel.

So for instance I have a 720p native LCD projector.

I feed it 480i.....it shows me 720p
I feed it 576i.....it shows me 720p
I feed it 576p...it shows me 720p
800x600 pc input....it shows me 720p
etc etc etc

The difference is that I'm getting the projectors chip/processors to do the de-interlacing to 'p' and upsampling to '720' cos that's the native resolution of the panel

If i feed it 576p, then i still get 720p...but this time the projector is not de-interlacing (the source unit is)..the projector is only upsampling to native 720 lines.

So now lets say that the wii has a far superior de-interlacing chip in it.
If this were the case and I attach one to my projector, then:
480i -> Projector -> Projector de-interlaces -> projector upsamples -> I see 720p
would be worse than:
480p (de-interlaced by the better Wii chip) -> Projector -> Projector only upsamples -> I see 720p
because the Wii is doing the de-interlacing via it's better chip and the projector is not.

So it all depends on how good your display is compared to how good the Wii ends up being.

WRT cables. In order of worst to best it is:
Composite (aka Composh*te)
S-video
RGB Scart
Component
DVI-D/HDMI

Simply choose the BEST cable offered by source and attachable to the panel (in this case component...in a dvd players case maybe dvi-d/hdmi).......
.....then play games.

Leave the worrying about p or i or 576 or 321 or 4 8 15 16 23 42 to later :)

(in practice, with calibrations set up individually for NTSC region 1 dvd's or PAL region 2 dvd's from my dvd player....i find that both look ****ING FANTASTIC.....pin sharp and clear.
The biggest factor imo is the quality of cable rather than the region/tele system)
 

Gold Feet

Novice Member
Despite what Gaffer says, I still prefer the look of PAL games on my LCD than NTSC games, and as Ive said before I cant see the difference between 480i and 480p, saying that, some software looks worse than others, which Ive already heard repoted on the Wii.
Also, Composite is very good on my TV its a vast improvement from the 'composh*te' people talk about.
Component is only a bit better, but I cant imagine how s-video will slot in between the two the they are that close. If your TV has all the latest processing, I reckon S-video with PAL will look as good as NTSC with Component.
 

Jeff

Well-known Member
Component interlaced to
PAL and NTSC are composite video standards, the component standards are 625/50/2:1 and 525/59.94/2:1. If you feed a US device that outputs component to a UK TV the TV doesn't have to support NTSC, it just needs to support component @ 60hz.
 

mickeyb01

Novice Member
Which is the best resulution to use until my component lead arrives,480i at 60hz or 576i at 50 hz.
My tv is the goodmans 42" lcd capable of 1080p and both these settings seem to work ok but im not sure which is best.
 

shagaboopon

Well-known Member
On my LCD 576i looks better due to the higher resolution than 480i so I'll stick with that until my component cable arrives. Obviously it means running at 50Hz but I cannot see those 10 frames difference so it matters little to me.
 

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