Onkyo TX-SR576 hum

Southpaaw

Standard Member
I bought my first AV Receiver second hand from this forum all was great with it.

Since hooking HDMI cables to it instead of the Coax cables i have started to pick up on a humming sound in Theatre Dimensional (T-D) setting which gets less noticable when switching the DynamicEQ off which is kinda annoying because i actually like the sound coming from movies with it on but quieter scenes i get this annoying hum.

I went back to use to Coaxial cables and the hum is still there but just not as loud.

any idea what is causing this and is there any easy fixes i could do myself?
 

Mark.Yudkin

Distinguished Member
The hum is likely a ground loop, and if so has nothing to with the HDMI cabling or amplifier modes you use. In fact, it probably has nothing to do with the TX-SR576 either. The clue to resolving is finding out exactly what it is that causes the problem, and this can get messy. So before I get you to rip everythig appart in an attempt to find the proverbial needle in the haystack, let's start with the most common cases, in the hopes that it can save you a lot of frustrating replugging. The good news is that once you've found the cause, the fix is generally simple. I'll walk you through it.

In this order:

1) If you have a PC (Mac, laptop, etc) conected, remove it. Does that help?

2) Remove all TV feeds (cable, sky, satellite, freeview) from all components, so that you are unable to watch or record TV. Does that help?

3) Disconnect the subwoofer. Does that help?

4) If you've gotten this far, start by getting the cursing over with. When you've calmed down enough, disconnect every single cable going from anywhere to anywhere so that all you have îs a great big mess on the floor and an annoyed wife. Reassure your wife that you'll clean up the mess and reconnect just the stereo speakers to the amp, the amp to the power point and turn on. Does it hum? If not, slowly add one component, one cable at a time, until the hum reappears. When it does, start disconnecting previously reconnected cabling until you've worked out the minimal connectivity necessary to provoke the hum. Then post the complete connectivity in all its details, omitting nothing.
 

Southpaaw

Standard Member
well the first cable i removed was from the HDMI output and the hum has stopped instantly with a slight hiss at max volume. everything else is fine same hiss at max volume.
 

Mark.Yudkin

Distinguished Member
well the first cable i removed was from the HDMI output and the hum has stopped instantly with a slight hiss at max volume. everything else is fine same hiss at max volume.
If you're happy running this way, then the case is solved. If you need HDMI connectivity, then try following my suggestions to obtain a diagnosis of the underlying cause.
 

Southpaaw

Standard Member
PC - HDMI-1 = Hums
PS3 - HDMI-2 = Hums
Xbox - HDMI-3 = Hums

If i Unplug the HDMI cable that goes from the AVR to TV the hum goes away. Tone of the hum seems to change if i display an image on the TV screen

Id rather have the HDMI as i watch all my films from the PC or PS3
 

satwelsh

Standard Member
I had the same with my onkyo 606, I solved it by connecting a length of wire from the case of the av to the screw holding the plug socket on the wall and grounding the av hum stopped.
 

Mark.Yudkin

Distinguished Member
PC - HDMI-1 = Hums
PS3 - HDMI-2 = Hums
Xbox - HDMI-3 = Hums

If i Unplug the HDMI cable that goes from the AVR to TV the hum goes away. Tone of the hum seems to change if i display an image on the TV screen

Id rather have the HDMI as i watch all my films from the PC or PS3
You already said the HDMI cable was involved in post #1 and I responded that it was likely a red herring.

Currently all I know for certain is that something is causing a hum somehow. It might be satwelsh's problem, who knows? It could be anything. Trouble is you don't want to provide even the slightest clue that might be permit me to more useful than simply to sympathize with your case.

Please answer my questions from post #2. They are designed to yield useful details about the cause and hence the resolution.
 

Southpaaw

Standard Member
I will try and explain it a bit better.

My setup is a two screen setup for the PC, small TFT screen as my main screen when i play audio through the HDMI cable to the AVR from pc (TV off at this point) i get no hum/buzzing through the speakers on any setting.

When it comes to playing movies i turn to the tv for this but when the tv goes on this is when the hum/buzzing sound comes through the speakers, which leaves me to think its the HDMI output socket thats maybe causing it.

I have done all that you mention in post #2 which reveals no hum/buzz sound through the speakers until the tv is on, i have even moved through the 4 HDMI socket on the tv but still getting the hum/buzz sound.

TV/Freeview is played through TV speakers.
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
I will try and explain it a bit better.

My setup is a two screen setup for the PC, small TFT screen as my main screen when i play audio through the HDMI cable to the AVR from pc (TV off at this point) i get no hum/buzzing through the speakers on any setting.

When it comes to playing movies i turn to the tv for this but when the tv goes on this is when the hum/buzzing sound comes through the speakers, which leaves me to think its the HDMI output socket thats maybe causing it.

I have done all that you mention in post #2 which reveals no hum/buzz sound through the speakers until the tv is on, i have even moved through the 4 HDMI socket on the tv but still getting the hum/buzz sound.

TV/Freeview is played through TV speakers.

Is there an RF coax/antenna feed going into your TV? Try removing this and see what the result is.
 

Southpaaw

Standard Member
Removed the Antenna and it made no difference, i should also mention this hum/buzz doesnt happen in any other mode Stereo, Direct, etc it only happens in Theatre Dimension mode (T-D)
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
Removed the Antenna and it made no difference, i should also mention this hum/buzz doesnt happen in any other mode Stereo, Direct, etc it only happens in Theatre Dimension mode (T-D)

What about the power supply? How are all your components plugged into the mains, are they sharing a multi gang or do they have their own outlets on the wall? TRy plugging them all into a shared multi gang/mains trailer rather than have them use individual mains outlets.
 

Mark.Yudkin

Distinguished Member
I will try and explain it a bit better.

My setup is a two screen setup for the PC, small TFT screen as my main screen when i play audio through the HDMI cable to the AVR from pc (TV off at this point) i get no hum/buzzing through the speakers on any setting.

When it comes to playing movies i turn to the tv for this but when the tv goes on this is when the hum/buzzing sound comes through the speakers, which leaves me to think its the HDMI output socket thats maybe causing it.

I have done all that you mention in post #2 which reveals no hum/buzz sound through the speakers until the tv is on, i have even moved through the 4 HDMI socket on the tv but still getting the hum/buzz sound.

TV/Freeview is played through TV speakers.
Doctor, I feel bad.
What's wrong?
I feel bad.
What hurts?
I feel bad.
Where?
I feel bad.

That's how this thread is going. We know you feel bad and a video of your feeling bad doesn't tell us anything either. However, persistent refusal to answer questions targetted at finding out what's wrong does make diagnosis impossible. The point of the questions is to determine the cause of your feeling bad, not to provoke a repetition of what we already know.

I have done all that you mention in post #2 which reveals no hum/buzz sound through the speakers until the tv is on
Are you saying that the following configuration causes a hum:
- Amp with no connections except to front speakers, power to wall socket and HDMI to TV
- TV with no connections except to amp via HDMI and power to wall socket
- Absolutely nothing else is connected in any way to anything whatsoever, without exception.

If so, connect the TV and Amp to the same wall socket using a power strip and try again.
 
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Southpaaw

Standard Member
Amp with no connections except to front speakers, power to wall socket and HDMI to TV - no hum (freeview is build into tv with no audio out to amp)

Amp with no connections at all - no hum

Amp with Connections to Xbox, PC or PS3 via HDMI to TV via HDMI - hums, its only happening when its theres a picture displayed on the tv through the amp, ive connected 1 HDMI at a time but hums every time tv displays from the feed.

TV and Amp are connected to a multigang socket
 
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Mark.Yudkin

Distinguished Member
Amp with no connections except to front speakers, power to wall socket and HDMI to TV - no hum (freeview is build into tv with no audio out to amp)

Amp with no connections at all - no hum

Amp with Connections to Xbox, PC or PS3 via HDMI to TV via HDMI - hums, its only happening when its theres a picture displayed on the tv through the amp, ive connected 1 HDMI at a time but hums every time tv displays from the feed.

TV and Amp are connected to a multigang socket
For the hum with Xbox, PC and PS3 - the hum is for all of these sources individually, when only one of the devices is connected to the amp and nothing else, the other two devices are completely disconnected, and the TV is connected only to the amp and not to anything else? Moroever, the Xbox, PS3 or PC is plugged into the same multigang socket and there are no devices other than the TV and the (Xbox or PC or PS3) connected to anything else, including subwoofer?

Note that I do not mean just that the HDMI is only connected to one device, but that there are absolutely no connections of any sort anywhere.
 

Southpaaw

Standard Member
Tv's only connections are to the Amp via HDMI and antenna for the internal freeview with wired internet connection, im not running a subwoofer.

PS3, XBOX360, PC are all plugged into a multigang socket but when im just recieving music through the amp its fine, once im recieving a picture on the tv thats when the humming begins.
 

Mark.Yudkin

Distinguished Member
Tv's only connections are to the Amp via HDMI and antenna for the internal freeview with wired internet connection, im not running a subwoofer.
Please read what we say. How can we help if you persistently refuse to do anything we ask you to (see posts 2 and 9)? Unplug all antenna and internet connections, then advise what happens.
 

Southpaaw

Standard Member
Im not refusing to do the things you are suggesting sorry if you think that but Antenna and Internet cable were removed when i replied in post #10.

Everying thing from the tv has been removed except HDMI cable and the hum still exists.
 

Mark.Yudkin

Distinguished Member
Im not refusing to do the things you are suggesting sorry if you think that but Antenna and Internet cable were removed when i replied in post #10.

Everying thing from the tv has been removed except HDMI cable and the hum still exists.
Everything from the TV, or everything from everything? We need a bare system, having just amp, TV, HDMI between the amp and TV, plus front speakers. Amp and TV plugged into same wall socket (power strip OK, but no power conditioner). No other connections whatsoever, no matter how unimportant they may appear.

If there is still a hum, replace the HDMI cable with the one you used between the PS3 and the amp. This is to check if the current cable has a broken ground wire connection.
 

Southpaaw

Standard Member
I mean everything apart from an input from PC because when there is no input to the amp there is just silence with a blank screen on the tv saying "No Signal".

TV connected to Amp by HDMI, Amp connected to Front Speakers = No Hum (no Antenna or Internet connected)

TV connected to Amp via HDMI, Amp Connected to Front Speakers and Xbox360 via HDMI1 = Hum

Same again using HDMI2 and HDMI3 ports = Hum

Changed the standard HDMI to new QED cables and still no different.
 

Mark.Yudkin

Distinguished Member
I mean everything apart from an input from PC ...
The very first thing I said in Post 2 was remove the PC. PCs are notorious as a source of ground loop hums, and therefore the very first thing I asked you to do was test whether the PC was implicated. Even if it doesn't solve the hum, it remains crucial to ensure that the PC remains totally out of the equation, as then there's probably another cause in addition to the PC. As I indicated in post 3, we can address the PC problem afterwards.
... because when there is no input to the amp there is just silence with a blank screen on the tv saying "No Signal".

TV connected to Amp by HDMI, Amp connected to Front Speakers = No Hum (no Antenna or Internet connected).
I also said in post 2 "so that you are unable to watch or record TV". It is absolutely irrelevant if the TV shows a blank screen, saying no signal. You're not trying to watch TV, you're trying to determine the cause of a hum through the speakers. If there's "just silence", there there is no hum - a very important positive result that helps us immensely with the diagnosis (for example, it tells us that the Onkyo is not broken). This is the sort of response I had expected to see in post 3!

Post back when you're ready to follow instructions to the letter, without the slightest deviation, no matter how minuscule or apparently irrelevant. Otherwise I'm going to give up in hopeless despair, and this will be my last response. Over to you: you can respond to post 2, point by point in detail, or hope to find somebody with more patience than I have.
 
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Southpaaw

Standard Member
TV connected to Amp by HDMI, Amp connected to Front Speakers = No Hum (no Antenna or Internet connected)

Also thought the PC would have been ruled out as a problem because it also happens with PS3 and XBox?

Also as ive said The Hum is not present when im just getting Audio from PC through amp. Is the PC Still possible cause or can we rule this out?
 
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Mark.Yudkin

Distinguished Member
Also thought the PC would have been ruled out as a problem because it also happens with PS3 and XBox?

Also as ive said The Hum is not present when im just getting Audio from PC through amp. Is the PC Still possible cause or can we rule this out?
We can rule out nothing, we can diagnose nothing, we can say nothing, we don't have the faintest clue as to anything, since you refuse point blank to give me even the tiniest little bit of information to work. I can't even venture a totally wild guess as to a possible cause. The only thing we can state from
TV connected to Amp by HDMI, Amp connected to Front Speakers = No Hum (no Antenna or Internet connected)
is that you do probably have a ground loop rather than a faulty amp or TV. 22 posts for something we could have known after 3, except that we could have known a lot more after 3 if you'd wanted.

Frankly, I don't know why I'm bothering to respond at all. I already said I wouldn't if you persisted in not answering questions, and you're still not answering them. So, unless you answer all of the questions from post 2, I will not respond any further. If you do answer each of the questions in turn (where "in this order" means cumulative, not alternative: you do not reconnect any items from a previous question when continuing to the next one), I'll either be able to say what it is, or at least to have a very good idea of what to ask to yield a final diagnosis, and hence a resolution.
 
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Southpaaw

Standard Member
OK so starting from the point where the buzz occurs (av reciever showing pc display on tv)

1) If you have a PC (Mac, laptop, etc) conected, remove it. Does that help? - YES!

2) Remove all TV feeds (cable, sky, satellite, freeview) from all components, so that you are unable to watch or record TV. Does that help? - YES!

3) Disconnect the subwoofer. Does that help? - No Sub

4) If you've gotten this far, start by getting the cursing over with. When you've calmed down enough, disconnect every single cable going from anywhere to anywhere so that all you have îs a great big mess on the floor and an annoyed wife. Reassure your wife that you'll clean up the mess and reconnect just the stereo speakers to the amp, the amp to the power point and turn on. Does it hum? If not, slowly add one component, one cable at a time, until the hum reappears. When it does, start disconnecting previously reconnected cabling until you've worked out the minimal connectivity necessary to provoke the hum. Then post the complete connectivity in all its details, omitting nothing.

1) AMP - no connectivity except Power to Multi Gang power source - No hum.
2) Speakers Connected to Amp - High pitch whining sound but not the hum from before.
3) TV HDMI cable connected to Amp - Same whining sound but no hum
4) TV powered on - Same whining sound but no hum.
5) Xbox HDMI connected to Amp - Same whining no hum.
6) Power Xbox on - hums like before
7) Turn Xbox off - Back to the whining sound

Step 5,6,7 were repeated for PC and PS3 with same results.

not sure if this help but muting the amp cuts out any noise, muting tv or pc make no difference.

I hope this is more what you were after from me, i will put it down to tiredness from silly christmas hours.

I even took a picture of the "mess on the floor" as proof everything was disconnected and i even did some tidying of the wires.

Before i put everything back neat and tidy i will wait for you to confirm this is what you were wanting from me.
 

Mark.Yudkin

Distinguished Member
Good start, but I'm a little confused now.
1) If you have a PC (Mac, laptop, etc) connected, remove it. Does that help? - YES!
2) Remove all TV feeds (cable, sky, satellite, freeview) from all components, so that you are unable to watch or record TV. Does that help? - YES!
etc...
From 1, it appears that removing the PC removes the hum. But then why does removing TV feeds help - there's already no hum after removing the PC. Moroever, what do you mean by:
6) Power Xbox on - hums like before
...
Step 5,6,7 were repeated for PC and PS3 with same results.
which states that there is a hum, although the PC you removed in step 1 already completely resolved the hum?

Anyway, I'll assume that since you have clearly stated that removing the PC fixes the hum, all we need to do is address the PC. That is, the TV, Xbox and PS3 do not hum if there is no PC connected - the hum is caused solely and exclusively by the PC.

If this is not what you meant, say so NOW, by reanswering all of the questions, starting from a completely connected humming setup, carrying out each step cumulatively.

---

As for the whining - that is something completely different from the hum and is not ground loop related. Rather is is an instrinsic, native property of various audio simulation modes, especially those involved in "widening" sound stages or increasing numbers of channels (e.g. stereo to surround)., The effects can be minimized by tweaking the parameters for the modes causing the problem, or avoided by not using the "add a whine" modes in the first place. In any case, it's a different problem, so let's please ignore it here, by running the amp in standard modes (e.g. without "Theare Dimension" or similar whine-inducers). You can always open another question for unusable mode issues once the hum has been resolved.

---

Fixing PC-induced ground loops is well nigh impossible unless you can totally isolate the systems.

If you only need audio from the PC, connect it to the Onkyo using an optical cable, rather than coax or HDMI. This is the cheapest and easiest solution.

If you need video and therefore must use HDMI, try plugging the PC into the same wall socket as the amp, and removing any non-wireless internet connections (we can sort that out later). This can sometimes help - does it?

Ohterwise, the only way to isolate the PC and use HDMI connectivity is to run HDMI over fibre. You'll need to buy one of these. This is not cheap, and it therefore makes sense to try other approaches first.
 
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