Onkyo TX-RZ810 BiAmp No Longer Working

WileyMarmot

Novice Member
Hello,

I have an Onkyo RZ 810 HT receiver that is approx. 4 years old. It’s hooked up to a 5.1 Klipsch Reference Premier speaker set with a Klipsch RP powered 12in sub. The 810 is mated to my Vizio wide screen TV and the Creative Labs sound card in my comp (gaming). I DO NOT currently have a DVD player as it died and has not been replaced. The room is AC cooled to approx. 74-75F, and the 810 sits in an entertainment cab. No space on the sides (17.1in 810 in an 18in opening), there’s 4.5ins of space above the 810, open cabinet front with ample vent/cabling holes in back. While gaming yesterday, 8/29/21, the 810 went into diagnostic mode. Coding: NG followed by abbreviations for all the spkrs and an I (indicating an over current issue). The Over current seems very unlikely as the equipment is plugged into a Phillips surge protector. After umpteen unsuccessful attempts to reset the 810—it finally reset to factory defaults. . I’ve had my front spkrs Bi Amped since day 2 of ownership. While performing a manual spkr set up, and an abbreviated accuEQroom calibration yesterday I noticed the Bi Amp option in both is now grayed out and unavailable, My guess is the amplifier in the Height/bi amp section of the receiver is toast, and caused the diagnostic mode activation yesterday. Any thoughts, opinions, suggestions? TY!
 
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alexvojacek

Standard Member
Please read my other post here:




Will paste the text here for you.

I wanted to post here for posterity. This AMP is great but has a fatal design flaw, I'm talking about TX-SR393 same as the first revisions of the TX-NR696. They do not have a FAN, but they require it to operate properly.

Mine worked fine for like 6 months. After that period I've started getting the AMP Diag mode and then the error show up was "Check Speaker Connection". Coming from a hardware reviews magazine with everything related to cooling and overclocking I instantly suspected that it was overheating.

Touching the top panel does seem hot but not hot enough to require a FAN, I'm suspecting that Onkyo thought about the same without testing it for long periods of time. I know they have the circuitry for the FAN because I can hear the switch clicking on when I turn up the volume to high levels, but since the FAN is not there, there is nothing to cool the circuit down.

I've used a couple of Noctua FANs, which are the best FANs in the market for this uses. I've purchased the NF-A12x25 PWM 5V revision with the USB adapter. I've used the big hole for the power cable to output the cables for both FANs and used the USB connector for both FANs who will take less than half of the max output wattage that the Amplifier accepts.

As soon as the AMP is on, both FANs will come on, using the USB power.

I cannot state enough how much cool the AMP is now. Measuring temperature with an infrared meter shows that before FAN installment, the circuitry around the decoders (HDMI board) was averanging 50 degrees celcius (with a 24 degrees celcius ambient temp). And the AMP section was around 47 degrees.

With 2 x 120mm Noctua FANS running in low power mode (AMP is dead silent, since these FANs are designed by a company absolutely devoted to performance in a silent environment). The temperature is now at 38 degrees on the decoder PCB and just 34 degrees celcius on the AMP.

Suffice to say that my observations and intuition were correct. I can now turn up the volume as much as I want and the AMP Diag mode warning never showed up again, not even once.

My new Onkyo TX-NR696 is gonna get the Noctua treatment now.

If you are interested in how I did it, I can post pictures. Since Noctua provides the holders for the FANs in silicon material, they can be inserted using the holes already in place without having to drill anything. Since the USB adapter and cables can fit through the power cable hole, you don't have to hole anything and since the USB output is more than enough for both FANs at full speed, there is no risk involved at all.

They should equip their equipment with Noctua FANs.

My new TX-NR696 is now equiped with a FAN (they seem to upgrade the current amps with a FAN, quietly without raising suspicion that overheating IS INDEED an issue) but I do not agree with their current implementation. The FAN only turns on when AMP is quite high in power output and anything mid to low leaves the AMP generating heat to no end.

Sorry Onkyo but I'm gonna remove your new FAN and replace it with the new Noctua duet.

More people should be aware that current AMPs generate heat past the safety limit, not having a FAN and not having any error does not mean the AMP is working below specs. I know that electronics are sensitive to heat and companies are not taking this seriously. They may not be PCs but I have the evidence all over the place. These AMPs needs a permanent FAN. Anything below 700 RPM speed is dead silent and could extend the lifespam of the AMP several years, or even a decade.




Recommend that you reset the AMP and if it comes alive again, do not use it until you do what I've stated. If you need help in doing it, I can prepare a tutorial for you.
 

WileyMarmot

Novice Member
Thanks for the reply! What your post states may well be the case for me. I've got the receiver working; EXCEPT for the height/bi amp amp. Looks like it's toast to me. Bi Amp is grayed out and not available as an option in either AccuEQRoom set up or the initial set up menus. I've disconnected the bi amp speaker leads from the back of my speakers; capped off the bare wire portion; put the jumpers back on my speakers, and am running them in normal Front L & R mode. As the rest of the receiver is working fine; I'm just going to live with it for now. Especially as I've spoken with two of the larger online discount AV vendors in Vegas and both don't have jack for AVRs in inventory due to the "chip shortage".

I liked your solution to the issue! Much tidier than mine; I've placed a small floor fan a couple of feet from the receiver and set it on low. I appreciate the tip on the newer Onkyos having an internal cooling fan, and I always wondered what the "intermittent click" I've been hearing while gaming was. LIkely that is the "fanless fan switch" you mentioned in your post. If and when I get a replacement AVR---I'll darn well be sure to check to see that it features an internal cooling fan before purchase!

Thanks again! Wiley
 

alexvojacek

Standard Member
The external solution may end up toasting your amp for good. The problem with all these amps is that the integrated circuits and chips on the inside do not have any type of heatsinks, so, heat buildup could potentially fry them too.

I would open the case and put a fan there. It's terribly cheap compared to what you loose if the AMP breaks for good.

I've tried external solutions but, best case scenario it will lower the internal temperature by 3 to 4 degrees whereas doing it from the inside will lower it more than 12 degrees celcius.
 

alexvojacek

Standard Member
Here is your solution.
Purchase 1 or 2 of these:
Amazon product
Then hook them up with this adapter
Amazon product
On the USB from your AMP.

Being 12V fans, when you run them in 5V you will make them work at 600RPM (almost zero noise). Two of these in tandem will turn you AMP into the coldest place on your house. You have to make sure to mount them with the included silicon connectors. I will provide pictures of how to do this, will take them during this weekend when I mod the NR696 of mine, also going to remove the default FAN included as Onkyo only turns it on when on high load, which means your AMP will keep building heat, which is NOT a good thing in the long run.

Just make sure to mount them not on top of the radiators for the AMP, but on top of the PCB that connects all the HDMI outputs, that's the most sensitive part on the whole AMP.

These FANs are rated at 0.14A at full speed (2000 RPM). You will run them at 600, which is less than 0.08A, well below max output for the USB external connector on your AMP. The total load for both FANs does not exceed 0.16A which is ludicrous. You could potentially power 4 of these without even reaching the load limit on that USB.

In my experience, only 1 FAN blowing air OUT of the case on top of the HDMI PCB is more than enough (close to the PSU, left block). But if you want to be sure to have the AMP forever, mount 2 of these in straight line, along the HDMI PCB.

After mounting them, try and touch the case after extensive usage, you will be hard pressed to find any heat at all.
 
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alexvojacek

Standard Member
Also, just note that these FANs are the Top of the Line compared to any FAN on the market. You will absolute love them on first sight. They are rated for more hours of operantions than your own AMP. I have a couple of those running on a PC since years on end and put them on servers, running 24/7 and I still do not find the need to replace them, they are as solid and durable as nothing else on the market.

They also have premium quality materials and are completely isolated so you will not interfere with the AMP nor they will generate any interference on it. These are FANs designed to cool Ultra High End Gaming PCs and rated to last for decades.
 
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WileyMarmot

Novice Member
Thanks! I'm familiar with the brand name.

I've been using high end gaming desk tops for years (which I"ve got the sound outputted to the Onkyo as noted above); though I'm no builder, I've upgraded many components and am not afraid to tinker with things I can handle, e.g. fans, GFX cards, sound cards, RAM sticks, etc.

Don't know as I'll do the fan thing for the 810; given it looks like the bi amp feature (which I really liked) is toast. "BUT" your solution sounds killer (and far more elegant than my current solution) for whatever AVR replacement I end up with (I've been leaning towards the SR696 excepting the shortage of them at anything other than MSRP right now). The two online vendors I prefer in Vegas have them priced at $580.; if it gets to be after the first of the year, or the 810 dies further---I'll likely just pay retail on Amazon or Ebay for a 696, if any are available at the time. Thanks for the mounting location tip (over the HDMI PCB)! I would not have guessed that as the critical component.
 

alexvojacek

Standard Member
Thanks! I'm familiar with the brand name.

I've been using high end gaming desk tops for years (which I"ve got the sound outputted to the Onkyo as noted above); though I'm no builder, I've upgraded many components and am not afraid to tinker with things I can handle, e.g. fans, GFX cards, sound cards, RAM sticks, etc.

Don't know as I'll do the fan thing for the 810; given it looks like the bi amp feature (which I really liked) is toast. "BUT" your solution sounds killer (and far more elegant than my current solution) for whatever AVR replacement I end up with (I've been leaning towards the SR696 excepting the shortage of them at anything other than MSRP right now). The two online vendors I prefer in Vegas have them priced at $580.; if it gets to be after the first of the year, or the 810 dies further---I'll likely just pay retail on Amazon or Ebay for a 696, if any are available at the time. Thanks for the mounting location tip (over the HDMI PCB)! I would not have guessed that as the critical component.

You're welcome. It's the thing that overheats the most, plus, since those FANs are pretty efficient gathering heat from the outer edges, this means it will also take heat out from the power radiators, which will stay well below 40 degrees celcius, which you know is superb.

Will post pictures of my modding as soon as I finish it, will mod the 696, hopefully tomorrow.
 

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