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nooooooooo! Another DD v DTS thread!

Discussion in 'Movie Forum' started by nathan_silly, Sep 19, 2003.

  1. nathan_silly

    nathan_silly
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    :)

    Not quite. Since DVD's come with DD & DTS mixes I was wondering what format would you choose from a certain disc? ie, you might prefer DTS on Das Boot Superbit, but prefer DD on Shrek.

    Since I already own a DVD- and not likely to buy a dts only version.. I'm mainly talking about Superbit DVD's, Fox Special Editions, LOTR 4 discer, Shrek, etc etc.
     
  2. figrin_dan

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    I really can't be bothered to compare soundtracks on every single disc I buy. I just stick dts on and enjoy the film.
     
  3. Dimmy

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    DTS offers the best potential for sound quality.

    End of the debate :D
     
  4. Sigismund

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    Hi.

    Ronin Ultimate Edition - DTS gives a more-seperated and tighter-bass than the DD soundtrack, so DTS there.

    The Patriot Superbit - DTS again! Especially when Mel says, "This battle was over before it began."

    Twister - DTS

    U-571 - DTS

    Waterworld - DTS

    Saving Private Ryan - Er?!

    Die Another Day - I'll have to check this, but I think I prefer the DD mix! If memory serves me the DTS track seems a little ott.

    MIB Superbit - DTS

    Black Hawk Down Superbit - DTS

    It would be interesting to have a Blade 2 DTS track to compare to the DD one, don't you think? :D
     
  5. Daneel

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    The only film I pick DD over DTS on is The Fast and the Furious. The DTS track is just a little out of sync, but enough for me to notice it.
     
  6. puddleduck

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    Sigismund - There is a VERY thorought Blade 2 DTS vs. DD review over here:

    http://www.videophile.info/Graphs/Blade2/Blade2_01.htm

    I wish all DTS reviews were this thorough - most reviews just throw phrases such as "better seperation" and "more bass" up in the air and see where they land ;)
     
  7. FoxyMulder

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    Trouble with the Blade 2 comparisons is that i believe i read that the Dolby track was recorded 3db higher than the DTS track and is very noticeable during the nightclub scene.
     
  8. Marv

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    I always pick the dts ovewr the DD. Like they say DTS: "listen and be amazed"
     
  9. Family Guy

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    Dolby Digital every time...even though I think The Mask sounds better in dts. I just can't be arsed to go into the menu's and change it every time...
     
  10. FoxyMulder

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    Buy Cutthroat Island from Japan DTS is the default language so you won't need to go into the menus and the film starts automatically after a minute of inserting the disc.
     
  11. Dougie Styles

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    But who in their right mind would put Cutthroat Island anywhere near their DVD player?
     
  12. Family Guy

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    Absolute classic case of dts fanboyism - buying the DISC for the soundtrack and not the film...sorry mate, I WILL NEVER get sucked into buying a disc 'cos someone 'sez it sounds good - particularly a film with the reputation of something like Cutthroat Island...:thumbsdow
     
  13. FoxyMulder

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    I bought the film for THE FILM which i love, the american version was non anamorphic and the british version has pal speedup, DTS fanboy i doubt it otherwise i would buy Dances with Wolves from japan right now, i just think given the choice DTS sounds better 95% of the time.
     
  14. Smurfin

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    I actually like Cutthroat Island too
     
  15. rebel_scum

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    Can we stop it with this 'Pal speed up' boll*cks? YES, it runs 4% faster.HOWEVER, being that this is now the 21st century, there is something called PITCH CORRECTION, which nearly all major studios use. Only an infant,(or infant like mind), would think otherwise!! And for the record, Dts, sounds more natural than Dolby, although, there's the odd case of too much bass on some tracks, making them sound 'muddy'.
     
  16. Sigismund

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    ;) Yes, please stop this infantile Pal speed-up talk. ;)
     
  17. Marv

    Marv
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    Lets all face it dts sounds better(Yes i am a Fanboy)
     
  18. Smurfin

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    :rolleyes: :suicide:
     
  19. Family Guy

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    Oh, so it's official then...dts is better than Dolby Digital because rebel_scum says it is.
    :rolleyes:
     
  20. Sigismund

    Sigismund
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    It seems to me that the Dolby Digital versus DTS argument is, invariably, discussed using "faulty" reasoning. For instance how does one answer the question, which is "better" a BMW or a Merc? Well, it's not really a fair question...............without first giving a definition of "better"! I would have thought that most people would drive both vehicles in order to determine which they "preferred". Of course, that preference would be based upon that one driving experience.........which in turn depends upon their mood, road conditions at the time etc!

    So, re DD v DTS. Firstly one should decide the parameters for how we compare the two sound formats. Ultimately there are many thousands of people with subtly different tastes, not to mention vastly different setups! However, there are fewer people that have not only well setup equipment, but also experience in testing the different formats. Here on the AVForums we have THX 1138 who writes many reviews, most of which I have read and, to a degree, agree with. It seems that invariably DTS comes out slightly ahead in these reviews, as it seems to do in many other reviews written around the world!

    So, is DTS better? Perhaps! Do people seem to prefer DTS? On the whole it seems the answer may very well be YES! Which is why, I suspect, Nathan began this thread in the first place.............:) So come on peeps list your preferences and then we may KNOW which is better DD or DTS :devil:
     
  21. Family Guy

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    Which is true...dts does come out on top every time. But 99% of these discs are hard to come by and are very expensive. All of them are marked with the dts logo...and it seems to me that the reviewers are becoming biased towards dts.
    When was the last film reviewed that had only a Dolby Digital sound track? And how many films have been reviewed that have DD tracks only? Not many.
    Now, as an outsider who has no preference towards either format, I find that a little biased. I will always listen to the DD track of a movie because 9 times out of 10, it requires no setting up. When I do take the time to switch to the dts track, I have always found it to be "over the top" or "in your face". Whenever I bring this point up, I get shouted down.
    Now - look at it this way...what if only dolby Digital tracks were reviewed in the reviewers section...? Would people rush out and buy those? I think they would.
    Take the Dances With Wolves collectors edition. Imitation leather bag, 4 discs, directors cut, loads of extra's. Are the people that are buying this from cdjapan doing so for the extra's? NO!! They are doing so because it has a dts soundtrack - which THEY ARE TOLD is superior to the Dolby version.
    I have the R2 which has DD & dts - and I can tell NO DIFFERENCE between the 2!! So people are spending £60 on a set of DVD's - would they still do so if it didn't have a Dolby digital soundtrack?:confused:

    Here's a quote from the LOTR TTT review...
    MORE THAN ADEQUATE??? It bloody brilliant. And the review team have shot themselves in the foot here as well...when the 4 discer comes out with it's es soundtrack, will the DD track be marked down a point to enable the dts track to come out on top??
     
  22. Sigismund

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    Well, here on the AVForums that would be Bulletproof Monk on 16.9.03

    I disagree that 99% of DTS discs are hard to find! I have bought many DTS discs, easily and cheaply!

    I hope I haven't come accross as a DTS afectinoado! I always compare the two formats, usually rewinding a movie at what I believe to be relevent points, and it seems to me that DTS invariably hits the mark for me! There are exceptions, though! I recently bought Ronin UE R2 Japan, forgetting that I also ordered the R1 DD version also! I compared the DD and DTS tracks on the Japanese version and decided that the DTS track sounded better. This morning I received the R1 DD version and had a quick listen. It seems that the DD track on the R1 version is even better...................or at least, musch louder!!

    I hope I don't sound condesending, but if you can't be bothered to press a few buttons in order do listen to a DTS track, perhaps you're missing something! I do agree that the difference between DD and DTS appears quite small, sometimes. In contrast the difference can also be quite marked!

    Regarding Dances with Wolves..........THX 1138 has already addressed this point.................it's the "whole package" and not just the movie that people want with this full bit rate DTS release.

    Re TLOTR TTT I can't comment. But I have compared the tracks in TLOTR FOTR. Originally I thought the DD track was "fuller" and bassier. Now I think the DD track is a little "overblown" whilst the DTS track sounds very similar, but more of the good things and less of the "bad"!

    Anyway, I'm always learning about my set up..........so I reserve the right to change my mind in the future! ;)

    One final point..............it seems to me that the difference of opinion re DTS v DDis much greater than the difference in the actual sound!!
     
  23. puddleduck

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  24. Phil Hinton

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    These arguements are all valid for and against and at the end of the day most releases are not overly different. There are many cases when it comes down to your preference if the DD track is better or if the DTS track is better. But then you have to define what is better in your context.

    I am not a dts fanboy, as I have said many times in the past I am grateful that these days we have the choice. When I started out on this hobby 15 years ago dts and DD were just rumours and dreams for us home enthusiasts. We used to pay £900 for an LD player with just prologic audio and composite output, and up to £60 a Laserdisc!
    So putting things into context for Home Cinema enthusiasts and collectors, by todays standards we have never had it so good, and I would quite happily £60 on something that is rare and is a unique package, as would many other people. I don't agree with the arguement that if its expensive we shouldn't review it or feature it.

    As for the Lord of the Rings quote, why would Peter Jackson and his team spend the extra time and expense at remixing the film in descrete DTS-ES? By Army Bloke reconning they should just save themselves a couple of quid and not bother with providing us with a "specially made for the home mix" cos its difficult to hit two menus buttons? Oh well problem solved.;)

    There are differences with DTS and DD and in some cases the differences are massive. The common misconseption is that the DTS track is JUST Louder. Well yes, "but try turning the DD mix up on your amp and setting the LFE up and hey presto dts with DD" is the cry we always here from the detractors. Just not true. Yes it is mixed a little louder, but it is also mixed differently, sometimes complete effects are mixed in a different manner to that on the DD track. A good example is Jurassic Park Superbit, yes louder, but also contains a different mix and feel, making the experience completely different.

    Now I try my best to be objective, and i feel the accusations that myself and Matt are tainted by the red box are unwelcome and insulting. I would more than welcome someone to write a review on a recently release DVD containing both soundtracks and give an honest opinion. It will be interesting.

    You know Matt said the same to me when he joined the team, I think his words were, "So whats the deal, do we have to keep the suppliers happy like dts and movietyme, is there a conflict of interests" I simply said "No, write what you like theres no problem, just be truthful" Matt stated he sat firmly on the fence in the DTS vs Dolby debate and would never say one was better than the other just to keep a supplier happy, great I said, just like me, but you'll get accused of it. And we have, admittidly by the same people time and again, but hey.

    Yes it means it is very good (but then it's easy to misquote), and no it wont get marked down. But then again it is Matt who is reviewing the 4 disc version, so that will be interesting
     
  25. Dean

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    I remember that thread, and I kind of brought the 'THX' debate into the equation. Which sounds better: a dts 5.1 soundtrack or a THX mastered Dolby Digital 5.1 soundtrack. All my THX discs sounds as good, if not better, than impressive dts discs... I love em both but think that THX Dolby Digital is better.

    Check these links as well:

    http://www.dolby.com/thx/thxnew.html

    http://www.dolby.com/tech/mp.in.0103.DigitalVsDTS.pdf

    To summarise the report evaluation of DD Vs DTS resulted in DD 448 being better than DTS 754 and 1509:

    "While full-rate DTS greatly outperforms the half-rate mode, the studio sessions revealed that
    DTS full rate imparts subtle audible colorations compared to the source. These may be
    summarized as an emphasis in the 800 Hz to 1 kHz region; a dulling of the very top octave, a
    sense of compression on percussive transients, and an emphasis in the frequency region of 8-
    10 kHz. Listeners also described a loss of ambience or “air” and spatial dimensionality
    compared to the source. The LFE channel lost some of its punch and loudness apparently due
    to the rolloff characteristics of the low-pass filter. These types of alterations were not present
    in Dolby Digital at either data rate."

    Just thought this should balance the argument. :clap:
     
  26. Marv

    Marv
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    I really love DTS and always pick it over the DD track on a dvd. But my Dolby Digital Demo's wipe the floor with some DTS tracks.
     
  27. Sigismund

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    I have Jurassic Park II The Lost World & Jurrasic Park III (R2 Japanese Superbit titles), and Black Hawk Down (R3 Korean Superbit title), that I've yet to watch. If anybody would like me to write a review, with THX 1138's consent, please just let me know! :)

    Cheers,

    Sigs
     
  28. Family Guy

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    They've already been done. And dts came out top...I have Dark Water, a Japanese ghost story that has Dolby 5.1 and dts 5.1 (it actually says dts es 6.1 on the case but only came up 5.1 on my amp...:confused: )
    I've watched it this afternoon (in dts - was curious...) and it blew me away...brown parcels in the trousers type stuff.
    I'm willing to give it a totally unbiased second look in Dolby Digital tomorrow if you want...I would only review the movie though - the extra's have no subtitles.
     
  29. Phil Hinton

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    Go Ahead, and post it to this thread please.
     
  30. russraff

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    I could do one of the Bone Collector if you want (using half bitrate DTS) - just to add another independent view on the subject?

    Russell
     

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