NEWS: Trinnov Altitude platform updates due for 2021

MagnumXL

Active Member
Despite a challenging 2020, Trinnov recently introduced two features that still remain unavailable elsewhere including DTS:X Pro.....

I'm not sure when that quote was taken, but D&M have supported DTS:X Pro for awhile now on the Denon 8500 13ch AVR and Marantz 13ch AVPs.
 

alebonau

Well-known Member
I'm not sure when that quote was taken, but D&M have supported DTS:X Pro for awhile now on the Denon 8500 13ch AVR and Marantz 13ch AVPs.
correct ... I've been running DTS-X pro ever since i got my marantz av8805 processor early this year and have not had one issue yet ! works seamlessly and been very impressed... am running 7.1.6 with front height rear height and a Ts (VOG) and Ch - centre height speaker. the setup is excellent for upmixing any DTS-HDMA or DTS-X mix am also using it for PCM mixes off which there is a LOT on likes of Netflix and its doing a great job for all that.
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
I'm not sure when that quote was taken, but D&M have supported DTS:X Pro for awhile now on the Denon 8500 13ch AVR and Marantz 13ch AVPs.

correct ... I've been running DTS-X pro ever since i got my marantz av8805 processor early this year and have not had one issue yet ! works seamlessly and been very impressed... am running 7.1.6 with front height rear height and a Ts (VOG) and Ch - centre height speaker. the setup is excellent for upmixing any DTS-HDMA or DTS-X mix am also using it for PCM mixes off which there is a LOT on likes of Netflix and its doing a great job for all that.

I think the part was missing was DTSX pro above 13 channels. I believe this is still an issue for all other processors at the moment.
 

alebonau

Well-known Member
I think the part was missing was DTSX pro above 13 channels. I believe this is still an issue for all other processors at the moment.
that makes total sense MB :) wouldn't make sense otherwise :)

"the official release of IMAX Enhanced for the Altitude components will be coming in the coming months,"

As it will for many other Arcam derived pre pro and avr models and Denon/Marantz too . Its interesting to see Trinnov eventually catching up ; note the date on this missive..:)

might be some slight time lag there only cwt ? yes something sound united provided about 2 and bit years ago as an update to its flagships ?


"Sound United has announced a firmware update that will make the Denon AVR-X8500 AV receiver and Marantz AV8805 AV preamp/processor the first AV components equipped with IMAX Enhanced technology."

mine i only bought earlier this year and just came standard with Imax enhanced. havent had a chance to experience it as yet, not tried any movies with it :D

I saw a youtube of phil jones explaining the setup adjustments in the web interface... and why the iMac enhanced is there in first place
 

MagnumXL

Active Member
I think the part was missing was DTSX pro above 13 channels. I believe this is still an issue for all other processors at the moment.

What's that got to do with it? The existing D&M models have it for as many channels as they support. If Trinnov wants to brag about offering 32+ channels, they don't need to bring up DTS:X Pro to do it.

Frankly, I wish someone would compete with them. I'd love to connect my 17.1 speaker system to true rendering for all channels instead of "Scatmos" and "Matrix" decoding (although the lack of top middle and front wide support in many Atmos soundtracks give me pause since I need Top Middle to fill the gap for such a long room), but I could buy a nice new car for what the Trinnov Altitude 32 costs. Frankly, you're clearly paying for the name and software and lack of direct competition at that level since the actual hardware is ancient by computer standards and they haven't dropped the price by one iota since 2014. They might as well call themselves Apple, IMO. I simply can't justify that cost, especially for just 17.1 channels.

Meanwhile, the Altitude 16 is two channels short for my needs and now that there are a couple of competing 15.1 AVPs at 1/3 the price, I'd still end up elsewhere (e.g. Monoprice).

Trinnov is for people that can afford a Porsche just to show it off. I'm happy with my hybrid system for now and hopefully by the time an 18-channel AVP is available from someone like Monoprice, the lack of front wide and top middle support will be less of an issue. Too bad Dolby can't use DSU to fill in the gaps for such soundtracks like Neural X does for DTS:X Pro. That's a real issue for larger rooms, IMO. I'd just keep "Scatmos extraction for Top Middle and get a Monoprice now, but it doesn't support surround#2 speakers as an alternative so I wouldn't be that much better off. I could get a Denon 8500 instead for even less.
 

alebonau

Well-known Member
not sure i agree with the assessment of the trinnov there, also I dont think its trinnov's fault but i wish atmos supported the Ts and Ch speakers like dts-X pro and auro3D does... its far better use of 7.1.6 than top middles...and still a phantom centre above you and not having support for a centre height...
 
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mb3195

Distinguished Member
What's that got to do with it? The existing D&M models have it for as many channels as they support. If Trinnov wants to brag about offering 32+ channels, they don't need to bring up DTS:X Pro to do it.

Frankly, I wish someone would compete with them. I'd love to connect my 17.1 speaker system to true rendering for all channels instead of "Scatmos" and "Matrix" decoding (although the lack of top middle and front wide support in many Atmos soundtracks give me pause since I need Top Middle to fill the gap for such a long room), but I could buy a nice new car for what the Trinnov Altitude 32 costs. Frankly, you're clearly paying for the name and software and lack of direct competition at that level since the actual hardware is ancient by computer standards and they haven't dropped the price by one iota since 2014. They might as well call themselves Apple, IMO. I simply can't justify that cost, especially for just 17.1 channels.

Meanwhile, the Altitude 16 is two channels short for my needs and now that there are a couple of competing 15.1 AVPs at 1/3 the price, I'd still end up elsewhere (e.g. Monoprice).

Trinnov is for people that can afford a Porsche just to show it off. I'm happy with my hybrid system for now and hopefully by the time an 18-channel AVP is available from someone like Monoprice, the lack of front wide and top middle support will be less of an issue. Too bad Dolby can't use DSU to fill in the gaps for such soundtracks like Neural X does for DTS:X Pro. That's a real issue for larger rooms, IMO. I'd just keep "Scatmos extraction for Top Middle and get a Monoprice now, but it doesn't support surround#2 speakers as an alternative so I wouldn't be that much better off. I could get a Denon 8500 instead for even less.
Chill out!!

I was just pointing out that at the moment no chip based version can do more than 13 channels for dtsx pro.

Your post spouts a serious amount of jealousy towards trinnov. I’m glad you’re happy with your system, but it won’t hold a candle to a trinnov I’m afraid.
 

MagnumXL

Active Member
Chill out!!

I was just pointing out that at the moment no chip based version can do more than 13 channels for dtsx pro.

Your post spouts a serious amount of jealousy towards trinnov. I’m glad you’re happy with your system, but it won’t hold a candle to a trinnov I’m afraid.

And your post spouts a serious amount of pomposity and condescension, let alone ignorance seeing how you've never heard my system. And just because I express an opinion unrelated to your claim, I fail to see how that translates into supposed hysterics that I would need to "chill out".

I like Trinnov just fine, but it's in the luxury category and thus hard to financially justify. There is no reason others could not have taken a similar general computing route other than the high cost of developing the decoding software.

Trinnov has certain technological benefits, to be sure, but that in no way absolutely ensures it will actually sound "better" at the MLP in actual usage (pretty hard to beat +/- 2.5dB response, for example and discrete is not audibly different from even arrays at the MLP). Most of the benefits of discrete rendered output would be for off-axis seating, for example (more impressive for showing off to friends than my own usage).

Nor does a Trinnov or any other discrete render automatically solve the issue of many lacking Atmos soundtracks (such as Disney) failing to use objects so that top middle, wides and other locations function as they should, quite the opposite in fact. My top middle speakers work perfectly fine with Disney soundtracks, for example. They would not with the system mine can't "hold a candle to." It might overcome with remapping, but I'm not sure how that would compare audibly to a proper object render.

Since you seem more interested in insulting my system than actual discussion, I'll leave it at that.
 
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sdrucker

Standard Member
I have no idea what improvements Trinnov is making with the Optimizer, but I can see post-calibration optimization of speaker/sub crossover splice beyond the recent pulse button, more flexible exclusion curves at the speaker rather than just the global level, refreshing remapping's advanced settings so that there's toggling for front and surround heights separate from front and surround floor speakers, and post-calibration measurements of speaker+sub amplitude as something I'd put on my wish list.

I also wouldn't mind more options for remapping configurations to reflect the Trinnov loudspeaker guide recommendations in their white paper (i.e. for a single row of seats vs. two or three rows, or for the narrow vs. wider layout recommendations in the guide).

Oh, and a routine to optimize the summated sub response based on multiple subs and minimizing seat to seat variation for multiple positions. Something like what's currently possible with the standalone Multi-Sub Optimizer software, with an algorithm solving for level, delay and other settings like PEQ filters at the summated sub level (among other things).
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
And your post spouts a serious amount of pomposity and condescension, let alone ignorance seeing how you've never heard my system. And just because I express an opinion unrelated to your claim, I fail to see how that translates into supposed hysterics that I would need to "chill out".

I like Trinnov just fine, but it's in the luxury category and thus hard to financially justify. There is no reason others could not have taken a similar general computing route other than the high cost of developing the decoding software.

Trinnov has certain technological benefits, to be sure, but that in no way absolutely ensures it will actually sound "better" at the MLP in actual usage (pretty hard to beat +/- 2.5dB response, for example and discrete is not audibly different from even arrays at the MLP). Most of the benefits of discrete rendered output would be for off-axis seating, for example (more impressive for showing off to friends than my own usage).

Nor does a Trinnov or any other discrete render automatically solve the issue of many lacking Atmos soundtracks (such as Disney) failing to use objects so that top middle, wides and other locations function as they should, quite the opposite in fact. My top middle speakers work perfectly fine with Disney soundtracks, for example. They would not with the system mine can't "hold a candle to." It might overcome with remapping, but I'm not sure how that would compare audibly to a proper object render.

Since you seem more interested in insulting my system than actual discussion, I'll leave it at that.
At no point did I insult your system. You were the one insulting both trinnov and Porsche owners in your original post, saying they only had one so they could show off? If this isn’t condescending towards Trinnov and Porsche owners, then what is?

However, your setup sounds incredible what you’ve done and I’m sure it sounds excellent.

But fact is, the trinnov is a massive step up from any D&M product. I really like the D&M stuff, my second favourite processor I’ve used in my room was a Marantz 8805.

Even if your room already sounds amazing (and I’m sure it does) The trinnov is on a completely different level though, and no, it’s not just because of the cost. You would most certainly get a significant bump in performance with one. This doesn’t mean my room sounds better than yours, your room might already sound better than mine (I can’t judge as you said), but it will still increase performance further in any room when compared to a D&M product, it just simply a much better processor.

And finally, the trinnov is the only processor will let you upmix an Atmos track utilising Neural X up to 30.2 channels - so yes, you can use the top middle speakers/wides in an Atmos track where the metadata is missing (so long as you have the right settings), so not sure where you got this point from?
 
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alebonau

Well-known Member
And finally, the trinnov is the only processor out there that will let you upmix an Atmos track utilising Neural X to maximise channel count - so yes, you can use the top middle speakers/wides in an Atmos track where the metadata is missing (so long as you have the right settings), so not sure where you got this point from?
hi MB, while agree with your sentiment, the above statement is not quite right sorry...

the Trinnov is not the only processor out there that can do what you are stating there, marantz av8805 will let you upmix an atmos track with neural - X to maximise channel count ...

see below screen shot from my av8805... where selected neural - x to maximise channel count on "The Shallows" on 4k uhd blu-ray which is an awesome sound track as it is and its atmos track can be upmixed with the av8805 using neural - X (and my Ch and Ts speakers) to maximise channel count if you so feel :)

F961B7D0-41C6-4685-9DA0-920661A6ECE4_1_201_a.jpeg
 
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cwt

Standard Member
might be some slight time lag there only cwt ? yes something sound united provided about 2 and bit years ago as an update to its flagships ?
Its par for the course Al for any ce to flag whats coming up but its easy to be caught out when r&d doesnt match reality for release time and you get ce;s like sound united coming to the party in a timely manner ..
If they didnt keep punters on the hook so to speak with whats coming they may stray to the opposition :) Storm audio;s big mk2 announcements a case in point..
Personally I would never require the absolute input flexibility of a storm or altitude when so many titles are static mapped to 7.1.4 and it would be depressing to see my altitude tell me the lack of objects in a particular title :confused:
Ide rather something more intuitive to set up rather than a plethora of options making you second guess your choices [or should it be your calibrators choices :D ]

edit ; dolby had to do a quick about turn with cross dsp processing when audioholics kicked up a stink ; crippling what we are used to having when upmixing and having silly rules on proprietary dsp modes..
Dolby to Restrict Non-Native Upmixing on Atmos Based Products
 
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mb3195

Distinguished Member
hi MB, while agree with your sentiment, the above statement is not quite right sorry...
the Trinnov is not the only processor out there that can do what you are stating there, marantz av8805 will let you upmix an atmos track with neural - X to maximise channel count ...

see below screen shot from my av8805... where selected neural - x to maximise channel count on "The Shallows" on 4k uhd blu-ray which is an awesome sound track as it is and its atmos track can be upmixed with the av8805 using neural - X to maximise channel count if you so feel :)

View attachment 1476044
Ok cool, I couldn’t remember if it did that or not, obviously it does !! I’ll edit my post 😎
 

alebonau

Well-known Member
hi MB, while agree with your sentiment, the above statement is not quite right sorry...

Ok cool, I couldn’t remember if it did that or not, obviously it does !! I’ll edit my post 😎
was an update i think along the ways, if memory serves me right it took a little while to get over dolby's speed humps.. but they got there..

not to suggest your processor doesnt do an excellent job over what ever the marantz av8805 can manage doing the same :)
 

jfinnie

Distinguished Member
And finally, the trinnov is the only processor out there that will let you upmix an Atmos track utilising Neural X to maximise channel count - so yes, you can use the top middle speakers/wides in an Atmos track where the metadata is missing (so long as you have the right settings), so not sure where you got this point from?
I'm pretty sure The Monoprice HTP1 also appears to allow any-to-any upmixer selection. I'll have to try it later though to be sure.
Talking rubbish, HTP1 doesn't allow this.
 
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mb3195

Distinguished Member
I'm pretty sure The Monoprice HTP1 also appears to allow any-to-any upmixer selection. I'll have to try it later though to be sure.
See my re-edited post mate. Up to 30.2 channels.
 

sammy the squid

Distinguished Member
What's that got to do with it? The existing D&M models have it for as many channels as they support. If Trinnov wants to brag about offering 32+ channels, they don't need to bring up DTS:X Pro to do it.

Frankly, I wish someone would compete with them. I'd love to connect my 17.1 speaker system to true rendering for all channels instead of "Scatmos" and "Matrix" decoding (although the lack of top middle and front wide support in many Atmos soundtracks give me pause since I need Top Middle to fill the gap for such a long room), but I could buy a nice new car for what the Trinnov Altitude 32 costs. Frankly, you're clearly paying for the name and software and lack of direct competition at that level since the actual hardware is ancient by computer standards and they haven't dropped the price by one iota since 2014. They might as well call themselves Apple, IMO. I simply can't justify that cost, especially for just 17.1 channels.

Meanwhile, the Altitude 16 is two channels short for my needs and now that there are a couple of competing 15.1 AVPs at 1/3 the price, I'd still end up elsewhere (e.g. Monoprice).

Trinnov is for people that can afford a Porsche just to show it off. I'm happy with my hybrid system for now and hopefully by the time an 18-channel AVP is available from someone like Monoprice, the lack of front wide and top middle support will be less of an issue. Too bad Dolby can't use DSU to fill in the gaps for such soundtracks like Neural X does for DTS:X Pro. That's a real issue for larger rooms, IMO. I'd just keep "Scatmos extraction for Top Middle and get a Monoprice now, but it doesn't support surround#2 speakers as an alternative so I wouldn't be that much better off. I could get a Denon 8500 instead for even less.

ouch! Will beg to differ with your assessment that it’s for people that can afford a Porsche that need to show off.

the Altitude 16 and 32 are niche products for those that have particular requirements. It’s got sod all to do with showing off.
 

Sloppy Bob

Distinguished Member
You can drive down the street in your Porsche towing a sign.

"I've got a Trinnov Altitude Audio Processor as well"

That'll really get them jealous.
 

Paleape

Novice Member
Aftually the StormAudio MK2 ISP processors can do up to 24 channels of DTS:X Pro and Atmos.

Chill out!!

I was just pointing out that at the moment no chip based version can do more than 13 channels for dtsx pro.

Your post spouts a serious amount of jealousy towards trinnov. I’m glad you’re happy with your system, but it won’t hold a candle to a trinnov I’m afraid.
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
You can drive down the street in your Porsche towing a sign.

"I've got a Trinnov Altitude Audio Processor as well"

That'll really get them jealous.

I dare not mention my next car is a Taycan 🤣🤣🤣
 

MagnumXL

Active Member
At no point did I insult your system. You were the one insulting both trinnov and Porsche owners in your original post, saying they only had one so they could show off? If this isn’t condescending towards Trinnov and Porsche owners, then what is?

Your car can't hold a candle to mine doesn't sound like an insult to you? I guess we differ on what "hold a candle to" infers....

I'm condescending towards Porsche? You've got me all wrong. I want a Porsche too. I simply can't justify the cost, especially in an area where I could only use it 3 seasons whereas an AWD car I can use year round. I bought a poor man's sports car before (WRX) that I could compare to going D&M with some mods like Scatmos. You can get a WRX to perform pretty darn well with some mods and maybe even faster than certain models (certainly it can go faster and drive better than a stock Boxster with some mods), but it'll never be a Porsche, let alone a Ferrari (looks, interior and especially the NAME). I'd love a Trinnov too, but I can't justify the cost of that either. I could pay off my remaining mortgage amount for the price of two Altitude 32s.


However, your setup sounds incredible what you’ve done and I’m sure it sounds excellent.

But fact is, the trinnov is a massive step up from any D&M product. I really like the D&M stuff, my second favourite processor I’ve used in my room was a Marantz 8805.

Even if your room already sounds amazing (and I’m sure it does) The trinnov is on a completely different level though, and no, it’s not just because of the cost. You would most certainly get a significant bump in performance with one.

I'm not sure exactly what you're getting at in terms of "performance" beyond the channel count capability or their particular room correction system, but if you're referring to audiophile-like sound quality claims, you lost me already as I never bought into single-ended triode "sound" etc. Or do you think Trinnov's room correction system is better than DIRAC that Monoprice is using?

How do you think a Trinnov would stack up against a Monoprice with DIRAC with the same speaker configuration (e.g. 9.1.6)? What would make it better than the Monoprice, specifically?

This doesn’t mean my room sounds better than yours, your room might already sound better than mine (I can’t judge as you said), but it will still increase performance further in any room when compared to a D&M product, it just simply a much better processor.

And finally, the trinnov is the only processor will let you upmix an Atmos track utilising Neural X up to 30.2 channels - so yes, you can use the top middle speakers/wides in an Atmos track where the metadata is missing (so long as you have the right settings), so not sure where you got this point from?

It won't upmix an actual "Atmos" render. It upmixes the BASE 7.1 track only with Neural X. That's not exactly the same thing, now is it. You're losing all the precise rendering locations for a "guess" on Neural X's part. I love Neural X as it can do amazing things, but it's not flawless.

It would be awesome if it could upmix actual Atmos to use the rest of the speakers, especially on a Disney print-through (locked) soundtrack, but upmixing the 7.1 base track is the most it can do. You might have better luck with the remapping feature of the Trinnov in a large room or duplicating surrounds (array) to fill the gaps.

ouch! Will beg to differ with your assessment that it’s for people that can afford a Porsche that need to show off.

the Altitude 16 and 32 are niche products for those that have particular requirements. It’s got sod all to do with showing off.

Particular requirements? What's the Altitude 16 have that the Monoprice HTP-1 doesn't have at 1/3 the price? You can argue about the "need" for 32-channels on the Altitude 32, but beyond that I fail to see where more than subjective opinion about what's necessary/better sounding/friendlier/longer lasting, etc. Yes, that object viewer for Atmos is cool, but hardly necessary to watch a movie.

As for showing off... That's not the vibe I got on AVS' Trinnov forum/threads when I was routinely asked what I was doing there if I didn't own one and wasn't planning on buying one any time soon. I'm ignored by most people in that thread now, even when I'm just asking questions about how it renders the Dolby helicopter demo with heights + tops in the same system. Zero responses. I asked someone in this thread here over there what album he was referring to when he made a claim about how awesome it sounded. Silence. Maybe showing off isn't the right word. Maybe it's more like snobbery. Whatever it is, I didn't like the attitude/vibes I got from the owners there. (i.e. You're not rich enough/one of us so leave already).
 

steelman1991

Well-known Member
As for showing off... That's not the vibe I got on AVS' Trinnov forum/threads when I was routinely asked what I was doing there if I didn't own one and wasn't planning on buying one any time soon. I'm ignored by most people in that thread now, even when I'm just asking questions about how it renders the Dolby helicopter demo with heights + tops in the same system. Zero responses. I asked someone in this thread here over there what album he was referring to when he made a claim about how awesome it sounded. Silence. Maybe showing off isn't the right word. Maybe it's more like snobbery. Whatever it is, I didn't like the attitude/vibes I got from the owners there. (i.e. You're not rich enough/one of us so leave already).
Really? Do you wonder why you’re “ignored” by most in that thread 🤔. I reckon the same will happen here 🤦‍♂️.
 

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