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NEWS: Sony Still Dominating Global Console Market

Discussion in 'Playstation - PS4 & Vita' started by Mark Hodgkinson, Mar 17, 2017.


    1. Mark Hodgkinson

      Mark Hodgkinson
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    2. raduv1

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      Switch will grow the market a whole lot more than the Scorpio will ever do if it garners support from 3rd party this time around. Scorpio will be the same as the Pro sales wise and the PS4 slim, Xbox one S will continue to be the main sales as prices drop for them this gen
       
    3. zt1903

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      Time will tell if Switch has any more staying power than the WiiU. I have my doubts as it seems to have some pricing issues - the base console price is kinda high for what it is, there aren't any decent bundles at this time and the games themselves are more expensive than PS4/XBO. They didn't seem to adjust WiiU pricing much over the it's short life and I fear that without addressing this it will do little more than sell to the core audience and then fizzle out.

      It remains to be seen what Scorpio actually is and what Microsoft are really trying to achieve with it. I'm sure it'll sell well at launch but I also suspect that it will be too little too late to have a meaningful impact on this generation. Without addressing the underlying issue of depth and variety in their first party offering then I think they'll continue to be at a disadvantage.
       
    4. OldSnake

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      From what I can see it is pretty obvious what MS want Scorpio to be.

      They want to be THE platform for the ultimate version of multiplat console games. And unless they do something totally wrong, it will be. Every DF article will have the Xbox family at the top, frame rates will be higher than pro, resolution will be higher than pro. AF will be higher than pro. Draw distance will be high than pro. Texture quality (due to mem increase) will be higher than pro.

      It will be the place to play the 'best version' of anything cross platform. No doubt. And be sure they are gonna crow that - a lot!!

      And that is all they can do.

      Let's not forget, this served Sony well for the first 18months of this gen. Sony are now clearly hitting their stride in terms of what they do best, high quality, varied exclusives. But there was a time when they had to ride on the back of being the place for the best multiplat games. It tied them over until their exclusives could hit market.

      MS cannot compete on that. But with Scorpio they have significantly better versions of cross play games and as we all know, that is where the big sales numbers come from.

      If MS can be the multi platform console for the next 18 months that will do them the world of good in terms of profit and install base.

      What the real challenge for MS is then becomes clear, they have to bolster first party. They won't have the most power multiplat console for much more than 18 months, so when Sony trot out PS5 they then need to fall back on exclusives. If they don't then the are, once again, going to be on the wrong side of both. Which as we know, doesn't go so well.

      As for 'meaningful impact' well, it will obviously have some. It will improve their install base, it will give them advantages over the competition which they can shout about. I would expect them to partner with third party and Scorpio launch to maximize the power advantage. Will this mean they run out the install base advantage of Sony, probably not. In fact I'd say a flat 'no'. But it'll help them massively going into the next cycle.

      The best console experience on multiplat games will draw people to their hardware, and as MS seem to have a very nice virtual machine going, when the next cycle comes, people can take their games with them. Also remember that Scorpio will have its own boost mode, so even on older games they'll see an uplift.
       
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      Last edited: Mar 22, 2017
    5. zt1903

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      Actually I don't think that is what they want to be, but it may have to be what they settle for.

      You deserve a longer answer to a well thought out post, will try find time later this weekend.
       
    6. OldSnake

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      If we're talking about the bigger picture 'what they (MS) really want to be' then no probably not.

      But if we are talking about the release of Scorpio specifically (which is what my post attempted to do) as a machine which is/should be a step for MS to drive toward that 'bigger, longer term, picture' then yes.

      Scorpio may be a case of 'what they are settling for for now' and they will settle for being THE multiplat platform which has the best versions. That is okay for now. I think they'll be happy to 'settle for that' and it'll help then without question.

      You don't a built a strong, broad, varied stable of exclusive games over night. Hahaha although you have to start at some point and it could easily to argued they don't seem to been taking steps to do so. Certainly from the outside.

      I do think it has to be part, a step in a bigger plan. And at some point they do need to step up first party.

      But anyway, not aiming to preempt what you have to say, just clarifying my previous post guess

      Always interesting to hear what other gamer think so I look forward to your thoughts.
       
      Last edited: Mar 25, 2017
    7. Sonic67

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      Bear in mind, a little while ago, some even thought home consoles had had their day and gaming's future was on phones and tablets.
       
    8. raduv1

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      I agree with everything you posted and as a gaming enthusiast it's a bold prospect . Trouble is I can't see it having a big impact sales wise unless it comes in at that £350 sweet spot day one. Base cheap One S and PS 4 will continue to be the major drivers in the home console space. The Scorpio and Pro will serve the enthusiast market. It will not change how Xbox is seen outside of US and UK, there in lies the problem for MS. Shame as the original Xbox was a great system of diverse games but never carried foward into the 360 era that was the go to place for MP only with great 1st, 3rd party support. That Bro USA , USA tag stuck to Xbox one and ultimately hurt it for world sales. Other games and Sony caught up and MS not having large 1st party support outside of existing franchises got side swiped.

      Many say the Xbox One was hobbled with the disaster reveal at E3 , and it certainly didn't help . Many also forget that MS effectively shut down first party development for the 360 towards the end of its life cycle whilst PS3 was getting some of the best games of that generation first party wise.
       
      Last edited: Apr 2, 2017
    9. OldSnake

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      Yup your point is fair. Not so much the Dude Bro stuff, not at all. But MS failure to nurture and start to build a diverse and deep 1p range (while they were on top last gen [360]) has hurt them.

      Also agree that I don't see Scorpio being a major sales driver outside the enthusiast market just like the Pro, again as you say. I cant see it being 350. I'd go for 399 day one myself - that'd be my guess. US is a huge market. UK biggest in the Euro region. I don't think MS care about JP. Well if they do they don't show it haha. But, get some traction in UK, build it through Euro. Regain grip on US - that's a nice start.

      However all that said, and while I enjoy a chat about the business side of things, first and foremost I'm a gamer. An enthusiast one at that. So while sales, market share, image etc may or may not be 'the trouble' I don't really care not one jot. I don't work for MS. Never have. I had no shares. So they can deal with those problems themselves.

      What I'll have is a console (Scorpio) which plays cross plat games and the best possible fidelity, and sitting next to it a PS Pro for Sony 1p. Sony can continue to have the best 1p - I'll play them all on their best hardware. I'll then play everything else on the Scorpio (i.e. The best hardware for it).

      So yeah, I totally get your point. But bottom line, that's not my problem or something o really worry about. I'm more interested in playing read dead 2, Destiny 2, and all the other big hitters as good as the console space can offer
       
    10. raduv1

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      Great post , I really do get your passion.

      Excuse me for going on about sales , they are important especially for us gamers.

      The big hitters you mentioned will all have exclusive content and timed DLC on PS4 because they are the market leader . As you can see that aspect is important to many gamers. The last Destiny had a year on the DLC on PS4 / XBOX One. With games going more and more to GAAS approach this only becomes more important for gamers who want it first.

      Red Dead Redemption 2 ( Sony )
      Destiny 2 ( Sony )
      COD ( Sony )
      Star Wars Battlefront II ( Sony )

      All of these will have Sony marketing and the exclusive content plus first dibs on DLC. It is quite important to to have the market to make these deals.

      I agree all four will look better on Scorpio and will be the best place to play them ( outside of PC ) hands down. This is though a thread about sales first and not tech. I love the tech that Scorpio will brings , will it turn the tide ? I think not.
       
    11. OldSnake

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      Thanks! Haha, TBH, some days passion is the only thing that gets you by - it's a mental industry lol

      Anyway, I get ya completely mate. And your bang on about the DLC deals Sony have lined up (they aren't daft eh ).

      I'll finish off this post tomorrow as I've been playing skyrim later than I thought and the Mrs is getting into one :/ so time to call it a day, but I agree, Scorpio isn't going to turn the tide to the point of catching up Sony sales. No in my view anyway.

      Ironically, it's what MS do when Scorpio is out, ie what they do with 1p etc, is the big unknown. They need to get 1p going, keep people attached to their ecosystem, because they won't have the best multi games, dlc or not, forever.

      anyhow will follow up tomorrow
       
    12. Cloysterpeteuk

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      It's taken me this long to work out what you meant by 1p, I was thinking just what the heck is a penny studio supposed to be?. Could you possibly use 1st instead?, very helpful for us thickies.
       
    13. Cha1ky

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      You got there in the end. All in your own. There's hope for you thickies yet.
       
    14. OldSnake

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      Okay now I have a little more time (haha you’ll be sorry I have!).

      No need to apologies for going on about sales, not at all. I in fact have a question for you on that subject.

      You say they ‘are important especially for us gamers’ – can I ask why you think that? Both current gen machines have sold enough to mean they’ll both get all the games; clearly both Sony and MS are not going anywhere and will be here for the long term beyond this cycle.

      So beyond some DLC tie-ins, which yes, I am sure are important to some (but that is a small %), why does the install base matter to a gamer? Isn’t it about gaming, friends, and fun?

      As I say, it is interesting to talk about that kind of stuff, but on a base level, does it really impact us as people who want to play great games?

      Now as for the DLC point, as I said, Sony knows what they are doing. They know Scorpio will offer demonstrable improvements on 3p (3rd Party ;)) games when it hits, so it makes good sense to tie in some DLC deals on the big hitters. If you can’t have the best looking, smoothest version, you might as well have some timed DLC to shout about. Good move.

      Having 2:1 market share does mean you have leverage, but make no mistake, Sony are paying for this with cash (money hatting, if you will, lol ;))

      BUT. Just because those deals are in place, doesn’t stop MS also partnering with Take Two, EA, Activation, et al. in other ways. It is massively in the interest of those publisher to partner with MS for the Scorpio version. Giving (aka Selling) 1st dibs to Sony on DLC doesn’t preclude them from doing something different with MS – Scorpio will have a number of angle which will separate it, and publisher will work with that, because bottom line, it means more sales of their game.

      On a personal note, a few exclusive raids, early access to map packs (a DLC model which is killing the PVP games anyway), some additional missions simply doesn’t, for me, cut or stack up against a version of the game which has better resolution, better framerate, better LOD, proper Hi def textures, better AI, better particle effects…no way. Of course everyone is different, but I would suggest a person would have to be a big fan of a franchise to put getting a map pack (which may be rubbish anyhow) above those kind of base improvements. From my POV as a gamer, I would take the Scorpio version and then wait the month or whatever for the DLC to come.

      Sony are just doing what they can/need to. MS will play to the strength Scorpio will give them.


      In terms of ‘turning the tide’ – I don’t believe that needs to be MS’s thinking.

      They need to make sure Scorpio reveals etc. go well, they need to have a clear message which isn’t muddled, they need to have a good E3, and they need to continue improving their offering (I am still not a fan of their dash). They need to partner with 3P and maximise this window they will have with Scorpio. They need to push the ‘no generation’ angle. They need to make it clear, if you buy a game on XB1/Scorpio, you’ll be able to take it with you to the next XB machine, whenever and whatever that might be. Sony cannot offer that with PS4 – PS5, barring some kind of almighty wizardry of software, will be a fresh start – it is simply the downside of having to the metal API which they do. MS need to push on with that and make it a big incentive to get people buying in to their eco system. Finally, they do, in my view, need to give more of a crap about 1P. It is not the bee all and end all as has been discussed, but, it is ‘a think’; it is not like they don’t have anything, because they do; Forza (best racing sim this gen, so far), Horizon (best open world racer available), Gears, Halo. But they do lack variety beyond those big hitters. The real odd thing is, when you look at the IP owned by MS, they have huge scope to mine, they have so many IPs just sitting doing nothing, classic ones at that; for me they need to see the value in those and do something with them.

      If they can address these points, then ‘turning the tide’ isn’t something then need to chase, it’ll happen naturally.

      Finally, on the sales point, will XB get close to Sony this cycle, I would be very surprised. Sony have a 2:1 lead, and will for sure do a price drop of base and Pro around Scorpio launch. And as we’ve already agreed, base models (especially as the price falls) is where the real big numbers come from. So no, I don’t think they will ‘beat them’ – but as I say, that is MS’s problem (if you can call I that). All I know is, as someone who loves gaming, things are looking very good :D
       

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