NEWS: Sony announces VPL-VW590 and VPL-VW790 native 4K home cinema projectors

alebonau

Well-known Member
^You are fortunate enough to see the effects of JVC’s DTM so can comment on it, I have only seen what a Lumagen brings to the table and it was mighty impressive, yes it’s expensive and might not be on everyone’s radar but like a good screen you might change your projector several times before you feel the need to replace the Lumagen.

a lumagen is a different discussion to what’s being discussed here I believe. Something everyone needs to weigh up for themselves. Depending needs and value brings vs cost. I am in that happy place I guess with enthralled with what have and can only look forward to next instalment and what brings :)

I’d certainly encourage folks to consider lumagen, I am quite sure step up for any projector including also what jvc build in or even likely even what they can update it to. Though am not sure I’d put in category of a good screen. My screen has seen 5 projectors over two brands over the years ... it’s oblivious to formats and standards and things that make projectors come and go ... unfortunately same I don’t think can be said of video processors ... being in signal path we have seen many of those come and go ! That said they do share one factor with screens and that’s depreciation :D 2nd hand screens can’t usually give them away ... video processors seem to fall in same category of pittance once superseded.. changes to signal path seem to come too often :D
 
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xar

Well-known Member
As much as I am interested in the subject, I am not sure this thread is going anywhere now. Seems to be a constant repeat of Sony owners saying I ‘love my Sony projector’ followed by JVC owners saying ‘but mine is better’, with a rehash of the same reasons using different words.

I have a 760es, and for about 8 weeks it was operating without a lumagen. I thought it looked outstanding. Then I got my lumagen calibrated and added to the chain, now it looks even more outstanding. And not in a subtle way. DTM and HDR performance is epic.

I demoed the N9 and the 760, and picked the 760 as I thought it looked better.

As for the lumagen argument, I can only say that any projector I have owned has benefitted massively from it being in the chain. The argument that it’s only good for DTM is nonsense. I owned 4 projectors before the Sony and none were 4K / hdr compatible, and they all benefitted.

I am not a videophile or an expert, I don’t know the specs or performance criteria, but I do watch a lot of content in my dedicated room, and what I have looks amazing.

I certainly wouldn’t upgrade my 760 for a 790, but I would probably pick the 790 over an N9 as I did with the 760, purely because I prefer the picture.
 

sammy the squid

Distinguished Member
As much as I am interested in the subject, I am not sure this thread is going anywhere now. Seems to be a constant repeat of Sony owners saying I ‘love my Sony projector’ followed by JVC owners saying ‘but mine is better’, with a rehash of the same reasons using different words.

I have a 760es, and for about 8 weeks it was operating without a lumagen. I thought it looked outstanding. Then I got my lumagen calibrated and added to the chain, now it looks even more outstanding. And not in a subtle way. DTM and HDR performance is epic.

I demoed the N9 and the 760, and picked the 760 as I thought it looked better.

As for the lumagen argument, I can only say that any projector I have owned has benefitted massively from it being in the chain. The argument that it’s only good for DTM is nonsense. I owned 4 projectors before the Sony and none were 4K / hdr compatible, and they all benefitted.

I am not a videophile or an expert, I don’t know the specs or performance criteria, but I do watch a lot of content in my dedicated room, and what I have looks amazing.

I certainly wouldn’t upgrade my 760 for a 790, but I would probably pick the 790 over an N9 as I did with the 760, purely because I prefer the picture.

DId you demo the 760 and N9 side by side or on the same sized screen?

Something that isn’t often mentioned, but interests me Is the lens quality.

I’d be interested in Your opinion between then n9 And 760, thanks.
 

alebonau

Well-known Member
I have a 760es, and for about 8 weeks it was operating without a lumagen. I thought it looked outstanding. Then I got my lumagen calibrated and added to the chain, now it looks even more outstanding. And not in a subtle way. DTM and HDR performance is epic.

if hav a 760ES I reckon a lumagen purchase should be mandatory :D

definitely a better option buying a lumagen for a 760ES than updating to the 790ES I would think :)

DTM and HDR is indeed epic ! I know someone else who picked up a cheap 760ES on clearance and partnered with a madvr envy rather than go the 790Es...
 

alebonau

Well-known Member
I’d be interested in Your opinion between then n9 And 760, thanks.

there are good reviews comparing 760ES and 790ES to n5/n7
by the russians


and the german comparison

both also include comparisons with the 270ES (note with both YouTube videos make sure to select subtitles if russian or german language is not your thing)
 
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alebonau

Well-known Member
Seriously? no manual iris in the 790? then the 590 is likely a better projector if you value non manipulated contrast, and proper gamma tracking.

yes seriously no manual iris on the 790...see Kris Deerings review of the 790ES/915Es note below,

"Another complaint I had with the 885ES was the lack of any iris support. The dynamic laser dimming system in that model did help with contrast, but it wasn't as effective as a dynamic iris, a feature included in Sony's lamp-based projectors. The iris/laser dimming solution provided in the 915ES does help its contrast performance a bit, but I would prefer to have a way to manually adjust the iris to set maximum light output rather than relying on the Laser Level setting. The reason: by stepping down the laser level to lower peak white level, you get a decrease in overall dynamic range since it doesn't also lower black level—something an iris control would do."

I know the 590Es has a dynamic iris but does the 590ES have a manual Iris ? to set peak luminance or does it only have lamp power as well ?

the odd one is the 270Es with nothing, no manual or dynamic iris. kind of bizarre at price it goes especially given projectors at lower price points seem to manage it. (jvc n5 and epson 9400). not sure i understand Sony's thinking with this. as a model it also missed out on the X1 for projector chip for some reason. definitely the forgotten member of the family :D
 
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Stridsvognen

Well-known Member
there are good reviews comparing 760ES and 790ES to n5/n7
by the russians


and the german comparison

both also include comparisons with the 270ES (note with both YouTube videos make sure to select subtitles if russian or german language is not your thing)
You have to give the Russians and Germans, they are just way more professional than anyone else, not so much bs.
 

xar

Well-known Member
DId you demo the 760 and N9 side by side or on the same sized screen?

Something that isn’t often mentioned, but interests me Is the lens quality.

I’d be interested in Your opinion between then n9 And 760, thanks.
Not side by side, but on the same screen on different occasions. I found the JVC to have better blacks and a more natural/organic image, but less HDR 'pop' and more image noise. Sony had more pop in HDR, looked cleaner, and I preferred the motion handling. As I prefer a clean image and am sensitive to motion, the Sony won it for me. The JVC was probably better in terms of image accuracy / quality (I can see why people say the Sony looks 'more digital'), but on the whole I preferred the Sony.

In terms of lens quality, I couldn't honestly say I would know what I was looking for. Both seemed to have a very sharp image.
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
As much as I am interested in the subject, I am not sure this thread is going anywhere now. Seems to be a constant repeat of Sony owners saying I ‘love my Sony projector’ followed by JVC owners saying ‘but mine is better’, with a rehash of the same reasons using different words.

I have a 760es, and for about 8 weeks it was operating without a lumagen. I thought it looked outstanding. Then I got my lumagen calibrated and added to the chain, now it looks even more outstanding. And not in a subtle way. DTM and HDR performance is epic.

I demoed the N9 and the 760, and picked the 760 as I thought it looked better.

As for the lumagen argument, I can only say that any projector I have owned has benefitted massively from it being in the chain. The argument that it’s only good for DTM is nonsense. I owned 4 projectors before the Sony and none were 4K / hdr compatible, and they all benefitted.

I am not a videophile or an expert, I don’t know the specs or performance criteria, but I do watch a lot of content in my dedicated room, and what I have looks amazing.

I certainly wouldn’t upgrade my 760 for a 790, but I would probably pick the 790 over an N9 as I did with the 760, purely because I prefer the picture.

All absolutely correct, although my experience was comparing the 760 to the N7.

No idea why some (1or 2 of you) JVC owners feel they need to justify their purchase so much, without ever seeing a Sony 760/790 or lumagen in action, but keep showing a Russian video which no one on here can understand. 🤷‍♂️

Each to their own, if you prefer your JVC (there is nothing wrong with that BTW) stick to the JVC owners thread.
 

Stridsvognen

Well-known Member
All absolutely correct, although my experience was comparing the 760 to the N7.

No idea why some (1or 2 of you) JVC owners feel they need to justify their purchase so much, without ever seeing a Sony 760/790 or lumagen in action, but keep showing a Russian video which no one on here can understand. 🤷‍♂️

Each to their own, if you prefer your JVC (there is nothing wrong with that BTW) stick to the JVC owners thread.
There was a google translated link somewhere of that russian review, very well done review.

So if i understand you correct your just trying to tell that SONY wont work well without a Lumagen?
 

CaroleBaskin

Active Member
@mb3195 As you've had several JVC models previously you seem like the man to ask....

I seem to be a bit sensitive to motion on most LCD projectors and found the Epson 9300/9400 a bit of a blurry mess in 24p content. As a result I jumped to the JVC side and found the motion to be much improved, however, it's still not great. I don't like to engage many motion settings on my x9500 for obvious reasons, but does the Sony range offer a step up in this area?

I'm always told the Sony side offer consistently better motion handling (just like their TV's), but wonder if this comes at any other cost to image quality with motion handling settings engaged? Is this something you ever experienced/noticed significantly when moving from the JVC?

Appreciate your thoughts, thanks.
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
There was a google translated link somewhere of that russian review, very well done review.

So if i understand you correct your just trying to tell that SONY wont work well without a Lumagen?

I would assume it’s still very good without a lumagen, but can’t deal with HDR as well as the DTM inbuilt on the JVC.

But in reality, I don’t know. I’ve never used it without a lumagen, why would I use it without it when I know how much it offers?

When I tested it against an N7, the lumagen was also in the chain. When I saw the N7 without a lumagen I wasn’t overly impressed with the image, it wasn’t as good to me as my old 7900+lumagen combo.

I honestly couldn’t be happier with the image I get, it is stunning, it actually took me around a month of viewing to get used to how clear and 3 dimensional the image is.
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
@mb3195 As you've had several JVC models previously you seem like the man to ask....

I seem to be a bit sensitive to motion on most LCD projectors and found the Epson 9300/9400 a bit of a blurry mess in 24p content. As a result I jumped to the JVC side and found the motion to be much improved, however, it's still not great. I don't like to engage many motion settings on my x9500 for obvious reasons, but does the Sony range offer a step up in this area?

I'm always told the Sony side offer consistently better motion handling (just like their TV's), but wonder if this comes at any other cost to image quality with motion handling settings engaged? Is this something you ever experienced/noticed significantly when moving from the JVC?

Appreciate your thoughts, thanks.

yes, that is one of the areas that I felt the Sony was noticeably better, absolutely no motion blur or soap opera effect.

The Sony chip has always been renowned in the market for offering the best motion, this including TVs.
 

Stridsvognen

Well-known Member
Insulting towards others (mild)
I would assume it’s still very good without a lumagen, but can’t deal with HDR as well as the DTM inbuilt on the JVC.

But in reality, I don’t know. I’ve never used it without a lumagen, why would I use it without it when I know how much it offers?

When I tested it against an N7, the lumagen was also in the chain.

I honestly couldn’t be happier with the image I get, it is stunning, it actually took me around a month of viewing to get used to how clear and 3 dimensional the image is.
I think you need to concider that some would prefer a 1 box do it all well, we all know DTM is a preference moodpoint, so if we put that aside, and look at the general tracking capabilities on the SONY vs JVC we can see in all the reviews that sony is quite a bit off, and they way they are off also lines up with how many see then in a demo, more pop, is a deliberate sales trick from SONYs side to go for the oversaturated look.

When trying to calibrate a sony on its own your not left with a nice warm feeling, same can be said about JVC, however if you have the time and know how, the JVC offers some ways to sort that out, and you can get a absolutely amazing tracking.

Knowing your preference im quite sure i could setup a demo where you would go with the JVC, a lot of these things are down to personal preferences not how accurate the display is.

The German review above also shows very well the differences, my German is a bit rusty but i get the picture, there is just something about the Germans, they are so much more ""ordnung muss sein"" Where American and British is just a much more careless and sloppy mentality, and that reflects a lot in these reviews.
 

Luminated67

Distinguished Member
I think I am sum things up for those still arguing which is best between JVC and Sony, if you are just buying a one box setup that does it all and offers an amazing picture the JVC is the number one choice and would be my personal pick because the stretch to having both a machine at this price and a Lumagen is frankly divorce material. If you already have a Lumegan or are techie enough to setup a HTPC with MadVR then either JVC or Sony should be on your radar, especially if you are sensitive to motion because Sony are great with this.
 

CaroleBaskin

Active Member
because the stretch to having both a machine at this price and a Lumagen is frankly divorce material.

Or, or... hear me out, a cancelled Disneyland Florida holiday.

there is just something about the Germans, they are so much more ""ordnung muss sein"" Where American and British is just a much more careless and sloppy mentality, and that reflects a lot in these reviews.

And that's enough internet for me today :laugh:
 

Stridsvognen

Well-known Member
I think I am sum things up for those still arguing which is best between JVC and Sony, if you are just buying a one box setup that does it all and offers an amazing picture the JVC is the number one choice and would be my personal pick because the stretch to having both a machine at this price and a Lumagen is frankly divorce material. If you already have a Lumegan or are techie enough to setup a HTPC with MadVR then either JVC or Sony should be on your radar, especially if you are sensitive to motion because Sony are great with this.
Ill have to disagree about the motion handling, i prefer JVC motion handling on the Nseries, and i prefer all motion enhancement off on both sony and JVC, i think the motion is also a preference thing, for sure non of them do it perfect, they do it in different ways, for me SONY motion is more annoying, and thats been the case on all the SONY projectors i owned compared to the JVC models of the time, has to say the old JVC models had horrible motion, and seems that lable has been sticking as a reason to go with SONY, i just think you can use that today, and ill say turn off all the crap motion controles, they do way more harm than good.
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
Ill have to disagree about the motion handling, i prefer JVC motion handling on the Nseries, and i prefer all motion enhancement off on both sony and JVC, i think the motion is also a preference thing, for sure non of them do it perfect, they do it in different ways, for me SONY motion is more annoying, and thats been the case on all the SONY projectors i owned compared to the JVC models of the time, has to say the old JVC models had horrible motion, and seems that lable has been sticking as a reason to go with SONY, i just think you can use that today, and ill say turn off all the crap motion controles, they do way more harm than good.

why don’t you leave this thread?

you’ve never seen a 760 or 790 but come across as the god of projectors!!

we get it, you HATE Sony. Probably the same way I hate Samsung!

People make choices, deal with it!

And finally. The Sony laser fans are also much less noticeable than the JVC equivalent. This may be a benefit to some.
 

mattmarsden

Active Member
There is definitely something about the picture that a laser makes that is possibly not measurable but needs to be seen to be appreciated.
 

Stridsvognen

Well-known Member
why don’t you leave this thread?

you’ve never seen a 760 or 790 but come across as the god of projectors!!

People make choices, deal with it!

And finally. The Sony laser fans are also much less noticeable than the JVC equivalent. This may be a benefit to some.
Sorry if i find your remarks about what i have and have not seen quite arrogant, why dont you ask me instead of swinging insults?

Could you please change the thread to only cover laser lamp based projectors so that this thread is closed for the poor UHP lamp projector owners. You might also like to exclude those who dont own a Lumagen in combination with a SONY laser?

Now i think about it, why is a 760 owner doing in a 590/790 thread, are you more important than other SONY owners for some speciffik reason?
 
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Luminated67

Distinguished Member
Or, or... hear me out, a cancelled Disneyland Florida holiday.



And that's enough internet for me today :laugh:

Mate I had three trips cancelled on me, my main Florida one with the family, our 30th anniversary one to NY with the wife and a trip to Manchester to see Queen in concert. :(

I know a lot of money saved but the wife has already allocated that money else where, a kick ass rockery, new driveway lights and new 3 x 3 seater sofas for the family room, like seriously f'all people will be coming to visit in a Pandemic so no need of the sofas and no one will see the rockery due to it and as for the lights on the driveway... that's what your headlights are for. :facepalm:

Women, can't live with them and will cost you even more to live without them. :laugh:
 

Luminated67

Distinguished Member
Sorry if i find your remarks about what i have and have not seen quite arrogant, why dont you ask me instead of swinging insults?

Could you please change the thread to only cover laser lamp based projectors so that this thread is closed for the poor UHP lamp projector owners. You might also like to exclude those who dont own a Lumagen in combination with a SONY laser?

Now i think about it, why is a 760 owner doing in a 590/790 thread, are you more important than other SONY owners for some speciffik reason?

I actually don't think he insulted you at all, most of us can have a peaceful debate on here but yours remarks always raise the tension and turns everything nasty. Your remarks about the mental state of Americans and British is a perfect example of this. :facepalm:

I wouldn't ask you to leave just think first before clicking the send button that's all. :smashin:
 

alebonau

Well-known Member
There was a google translated link somewhere of that russian review, very well done review.

I posted the google translated link above....infact link goes directly to the google translated page. it is very good. as is the german link.

both the russian and german YouTube have subtitles... can help anyone if it is difficult for them to find the feature to enable subtitles. but its there and both youtube videos in comparisons are very good. well worth watching if considering any fo the projectors being discussed here.

for anyone getting a bit antsy ! am not really sure of the need for angst in this thread. like the forum itself its only to share information, our own experiences and knowledge on topics. all folk have brains can decide for them selves sort wheat from chaff... :)
 
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alebonau

Well-known Member
Mate I had three trips cancelled on me, my main Florida one with the family, our 30th anniversary one to NY with the wife and a trip to Manchester to see Queen in concert. :(

we had our holiday early in the year cancelled as well. two concerts cancelled ! what a year ... ive made up for it in movie purchases though I reckon...its been an unbelievable year in movies coming out on 4k uhd and blu-rays... I think the studious maybe realise we are sitting at home and enjoying movies there :D
 

Luminated67

Distinguished Member
we had our holiday early in the year cancelled as well. two concerts cancelled ! what a year ... ive made up for it in movie purchases though I reckon...its been an unbelievable year in movies coming out on 4k uhd and blu-rays... I think the studious maybe realise we are sitting at home and enjoying movies there :D

I realise that studios make their money in cinemas rather than DVD/Bluray but in the current climate it might be a good idea to release the movies that have been delayed this year's release and send them straight to video, even added £5 per disc I think we would all pay it just to watch something new.
 

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