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NEWS: Onkyo and Pioneer to join Sound United

dante01

Distinguished Member
Not at all sure as to what Sound United has to gain by this? Onkyo don't actually own the rights to anything they themselves developed apart from their rather poor AccuEQ room EQ correction. Onkyo are often eager to report themselves as being "the first" to do something, but this usually turned out to be the first to incorporate or adopt tech developed by other manufacturers who are more often than not their competitors who they've then had to pay a license fee to. Maybe it was the Pioneer part of the deal Sound United were after?

What's that old saying about too many cooks and their effect upon the broth?
 

jakimp

Well-known Member
denon/ Marantz and onkyo/pioneer both already seemed to be selling products that bore a marked similarity to each other - wont this be even worse?

badge engineering like VAG group where same stuff appears in audi, VW, seat and skoda vehicles?

concern that innovation and competition in this sector much reduced?
 

stblob

Well-known Member
So, the same product with a different badge. Make for an easy choice, just choose the badge that suits you best.
 

fayeanddavid

Distinguished Member
denon/ Marantz and onkyo/pioneer both already seemed to be selling products that bore a marked similarity to each other - wont this be even worse?

badge engineering like VAG group where same stuff appears in audi, VW, seat and skoda vehicles?

concern that innovation and competition in this sector much reduced?
My concern would be a cartel monopoly, and could become technically sterile.

Don't see much in it for the consumer I'm afraid, more for dividends and share prices
 

Abacus

Well-known Member
Less competition usually means less innovation and higher prices, so not good for the consumer.

Bill
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
Consolidation under the umbrella of a larger and more powerful outside concern appears to be the way things are going now. I think the smaller and more specialist manufacturers have benefitted the most from this kind of arrangement and probably wouldn't still be in existence without it as extolled within this article:

Merger mania: good for the consumer electronics business?
.
I'm not so sure as to why Sound United would want several outfits all competing with one another in the same marketplace at the same price points? The purchase doesn't diversify their portfolio and actually makes it more a matter of which brand they kill off?
 

Cliff

Distinguished Member
Doesn't this indicate that the market has shrunk and there is not enough room for all these big names? Are we a dying breed who will not settle for less than a big AV receiver in the home?
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
Doesn't this indicate that the market has shrunk and there is not enough room for all these big names? Are we a dying breed who will not settle for less than a big AV receiver in the home?
AV receivers irrespective of their size are a declining market. Consumers are more likely to buy a soundbar or wireless speakers than they are an AV receiver.
 

Dunners

Active Member
It’s all about sound bars these days in it?
100 percent.
The only place where AV receivers get hype is on forums like these, which, frankly are niche.
It's fair to say that high spec AVR's are a niche within a niche, that in turn, lives inside a niche.

The Ponkyo merger saw the absolute dilution of both brands with Onkyo picking up Class D amplification, what can only be said to be the same room EQ with a different badge... while Pioneer got the Onkyo remote, GUI and streaming capabilities. All while brands produced amps with the same chassis and different front panels...
Pioneer car has been flicked off.
Pioneer DJ is now some other company all together.
Onkyo licensed its headphones / soundbar know-how and name to some TV companies.

It's not what it is... but the average joe in the High Street has certainly heard of Pioneer while very few have ever heard of Onkyo, Marantz, Boston, Classe, Def Tech etc.

The fact that Ponkyo hasn't been financially viable for a long time means that the proposed buy out does gives it a fighting chance of survival.
 

fayeanddavid

Distinguished Member

Chester

Well-known Member
Asset stripping maybe? Pioneer does a lot of products outside of AV and HiFi. They're still big in DJ land, and In-Car (although that's a market that is in more dire straits than AV!).

As for Onkyo, who knows. Used to make good bang-for-buck receivers, but they tended to favour fighting for the lead in the race to the bottom. But it's been for such a long time and isn't sustainable.
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
Asset stripping maybe? Pioneer does a lot of products outside of AV and HiFi. They're still big in DJ land, and In-Car (although that's a market that is in more dire straits than AV!).
The purchase doesn't include the Pioneer divisions that Onkyo hadn't bought or taken control of. The car audio, DJing and just about everythingthing else apart from their AV receivers didn't belong to Onkyo so Sound United wont own those aspects of Pioneer either.


Pioneer's home entertainment group has entered the next phase of its development with the news that it has formally become a subsidiary of Onkyo.

The move was outlined last year when Pioneer agreed to sell its AV business to Onkyo and the two companies announced they would join forces to integrate their AV divisions.

Under the terms of the deal Pioneer has taken a 14.95 per cent stake in Onkyo and become Onkyo's third largest shareholder, with Gibson Guitar remaining the second largest shareholder in Onkyo with a 21 per cent stake.

Gibson has been buying up well-known audio brands, forming an alliance with Onkyo back in 2012 and subsequently buying TEAC and Woox Innovations, previously the AV division of Philips.
…According to Twice, all staff from Pioneer Electronics USA have been transferred to the new Pioneer Home Entertainment (PHE) subsidiary. PHE includes Pioneer's home cinema amplifiers, Blu-ray players and other AV products, but not its DJ or in-car audio products.
Pioneer completes move to become a subsidiary of Onkyo


So Sound United don't own Pioneer outright, just the elements sold off to Onkyo.
 
The purchase doesn't include the Pioneer divisions that Onkyo hadn't bought or taken control of. The car audio, DJing and just about everythingthing else apart from their AV receivers didn't belong to Onkyo so Sound United wont own those aspects of Pioneer either.






Pioneer completes move to become a subsidiary of Onkyo


So Sound United don't own Pioneer outright, just the elements sold off to Onkyo.
I think they did own the top 3 Pioneer amps. The Sc-lx701, 801 and the 901. Not sure about 503 downwards though Pioneer seemed to be releasing them, because they have changed every year whereas the top models haven’t changed for 3-4 years. So that’s why I think they sold them off and the Pioneer 4K Blu-Ray players were Onkyo/Pioneer players.
 

gibbsy

Moderator
Pioneer 4K Blu-Ray players were Onkyo/Pioneer players
The LX500/800 are Pioneer only products. Onkyo don't produce a high end 4K player.
 
The LX500/800 are Pioneer only products. Onkyo don't produce a high end 4K player.
Hey mate, just worked out the Pure Blu-ray audio mode you don’t have to turn your TV off you can just put it on a different HDMI like the Sky one and watch TV with no volume and listen to the amp and speakers and have a picture too. No point buying a player just for pure audio mode now.
 

gibbsy

Moderator
No point buying a player just for pure audio mode now
I have a stand alone SACD player mated to a Rega Elicit-R for music. The LX500 is for film only although it does get occasionally used for 5.1 SACD. Much prefer my music in stereo.
 
Might sell my Oppo now and just buy a cheap 4K Blu Ray player mind you just bought a new TV which has HDR 10+ on and the Oppo I have just updated for that so will check that out first. How are you getting on with HDR 10+ on your Panasonic OLed?
 

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