News & Discussion: Sony Dolby Vision update for Bravia TVs is apparently half-baked

Discussion in 'Sony TVs Forum' started by Mark Hodgkinson, Jan 18, 2018.


  • Page 1 of 13
    1. Jan 18, 2018 at 10:29 AM
      Mark Hodgkinson, Jan 18, 2018
      #1
      Mark Hodgkinson

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      Mark Hodgkinson, Jan 18, 2018
    2. Jan 18, 2018 at 10:50 AM
      TastySanchez, Jan 18, 2018
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      TastySanchez

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      What an absolute kick in the guts. If Sony were up front about limited Dolby Vision functionality with the update back in 2017 then it's up to the buyer and fair game however there was no indication that something as critical as HDMI support would be absent.

      Blatantly misleading or at least deliberately omitting key information on Sony's part until the last minute.
       
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      TastySanchez, Jan 18, 2018
    3. Jan 18, 2018 at 10:53 AM
      midknight, Jan 18, 2018
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      midknight

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      Sony's silence and attitude towards its (ever patient) customers is really bad - we have waited over a year for DV functionality - I for one purchased equipment that was DV capable to work with the TV and now Sony are trying to do DV light - something they have failed to mention at ANY point (to its customers and 3rd parties apparently).

      Personally it has really turned me off Sony as a brand and will most likely make me look elsewhere when it comes to TV upgrade time.
       
      midknight, Jan 18, 2018
    4. Jan 18, 2018 at 10:57 AM
      mark800, Jan 18, 2018
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      mark800

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      I purchased the Sony A1 on the basis of its announcement at CES LAST year that it would support Dolby Vision. Otherwise, I would have purchased an LG OLED. I feel that I have been misled. We have now had another CES and the situation is no clearer and the promised Dolby Vision support has not appeared. I feel that Sony should be sued for this. Manufacturers should not be allowed to promise things as part of their marketing when solutions are not forthcoming in a realistic timescale.
       
      mark800, Jan 18, 2018
    5. Jan 18, 2018 at 11:02 AM
      Norman, Jan 18, 2018
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      Norman

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      I totally agree, and although I'll probably keep my XE9305 I feel Sony should in some way compensate us for their very misleading advertising.

      EDIT: I wonder if the 2018 AF8 and XF90 get this half-baked DV too? Prospective buyers beware!!!
       
      Last edited: Jan 18, 2018
      Norman, Jan 18, 2018
    6. Jan 18, 2018 at 11:51 AM
      TastySanchez, Jan 18, 2018
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      TastySanchez

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      Exactly - I'll always take "firmware update promises" as potential bonus features from now on, never use it to bet on future proofing a purchase. Especially with Sony.

      Shame too because otherwise the xe93 is a fantastic panel.
       
      TastySanchez, Jan 18, 2018
    7. Jan 18, 2018 at 12:01 PM
      BRAKKUS1, Jan 18, 2018
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      BRAKKUS1

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      No wonder it took so long! Trying to work out, how the hell to get it working.......so much for X1 Extreme.

      Nightmare for you guys though.
       
      BRAKKUS1, Jan 18, 2018
    8. Jan 18, 2018 at 12:09 PM
      aberland, Jan 18, 2018
      #8
      aberland

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      They demonstrated DV working on zd9 or was it A1 with the new sony x700 player at CES a few days ago, I am sure they will get it to work again...
       
      aberland, Jan 18, 2018
    9. Jan 18, 2018 at 12:18 PM
      Jules, Jan 18, 2018
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      Jules

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      Goes to show how far ahead of the curve LG were.

      I was contemplating getting a ZD9, but no longer.... I have the Oppo, Apple TV 4K, and a Dolby Vision compatible AVR, so Dolby Vision now plays a big part in my Home Cinema.

      Its a real shame as I really like Sony's motion processing, but when manufacturers pull this kind of stunt it engages my stubborn 'play fair or lose anyway' streak.
       
      Jules, Jan 18, 2018
    10. Jan 18, 2018 at 12:24 PM
      lgans316, Jan 18, 2018
      #10
      lgans316

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      Looks like 4K UHD will implode if the Studios and manufacturers don't start supporting all HDR formats. They are not realising the mess they are causing to consumers. All this will do is hurt sales.
       
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      lgans316, Jan 18, 2018
    11. Jan 18, 2018 at 12:24 PM
      aberland, Jan 18, 2018
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      aberland

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      I have a 75" zd9 and its a excellent tv' and I will buy the x700 player when it gets awailanble to replace the samsung 4k player, I read somewhere that the oppo use older version of DV and that is why it dont work, when you get the new players with newest DV it will work.
       
      aberland, Jan 18, 2018
    12. Jan 18, 2018 at 12:31 PM
      punkymunky, Jan 18, 2018
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      punkymunky

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      It will work with Sony's own X700 in due course but the point is it probably won't ever work with any other branded device. Sony probably sold a lot of TVs based on this promise but who can prove that. I feel sorry for people who have invested in Apple TV 4k or similar devices who will likely never see the benefit of DV.
       
      punkymunky, Jan 18, 2018
    13. Jan 18, 2018 at 12:32 PM
      Jules, Jan 18, 2018
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      Jules

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      Sounds to me more like Oppo have implemented Dolby Vision the proper way, and Sony have asked Dolby to 'fudge it' for them.
      Sony's implementation might be more recent, but it sure doesn't sound like its better.

      Remember the times when Sony kept bringing out ther own version of stuff?.... Memory sticks instead of SD cards, ATRAC instead of MP3, Minidisc (actually that was a great format).

      This sounds to me like Sony returning to their old ways and attempting to force consumers into buying matching Sony equipment.

      Sony aren't the dominant force in consumer electronics that they once were, so if this is their idea it will backfire on them.
       
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      Jules, Jan 18, 2018
    14. Jan 18, 2018 at 12:33 PM
      aberland, Jan 18, 2018
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      aberland

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      I feel sorry for people investing in any apple product on a general basis :)
       
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      aberland, Jan 18, 2018
    15. Jan 18, 2018 at 12:35 PM
      Toon Army, Jan 18, 2018
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      Toon Army

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      I wonder if the Sony reps had their fingers crossed behind their backs when talking at CES last week? Utter shambles and this will have an adverse impact on their reputation.
       
      Toon Army, Jan 18, 2018
    16. Jan 18, 2018 at 12:51 PM
      Soundizer, Jan 18, 2018
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      Soundizer

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      Last edited: Jan 18, 2018
      Soundizer, Jan 18, 2018
    17. Jan 18, 2018 at 1:10 PM
      BRAKKUS1, Jan 18, 2018
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      BRAKKUS1

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      Dolby Vision gaming will be a no no too, granted there is only a couple of games but still, also we have no idea if it can support 60hz DV, which I bet it doesn't.
       
      BRAKKUS1, Jan 18, 2018
    18. Jan 18, 2018 at 1:38 PM
      Earthscope, Jan 18, 2018
      #18
      Earthscope

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      My best buddy in the US bought an A1 last year with the promise of DV working fully not a half baked implementation from Sony, so far. And he is spitting feathers about this.
      Maybe Sonys clunky Android operating system can't keep up with the full version of DV and this is why they have implemented it this way and pushing the buck back to Apple & Oppo to issue software updates to make their devices work with Sony over HDMI and push the majority of the processing handling onto those devices.
      There is nothing wrong with Oppo's version of DV.. And Oppo are always on the ball with software updates to keep up to date.
      I would not be buying a Sony player this year with yet another promise of a DV update, going on the state of things so far.

      What a cluster **** this has turned out be for Sony. And all current owners who were expecting a full working version of DV. After over a year of waiting...IMO
       
      Earthscope, Jan 18, 2018
    19. Jan 18, 2018 at 1:44 PM
      midknight, Jan 18, 2018
      #19
      midknight

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      When I bought my 75 ZD9 Dolby Vision wasn't a given for the set (and mine is a fantastic tv - best I have ever owned to be fair) BUT when it was announced it would be getting it I purchased a new AV Receiver that was DV comparable as well as the Oppo DV UHD player and Apple TV4K too - all expensive items and purchased on that promise of DV coming to the ZD9. Sony owes us an explanation IF they cannot get this playing nice with HDMI.

      The thing that makes me doubt the whole story that is being put out at the moment is firstly how come then the internal apps can play DV without issue and secondly why has Sony taken all mention of DV off the update if this is how its supposed to operate?

      Its a huge mess and Sony's silence in all this is deafening...
       
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      midknight, Jan 18, 2018
    20. Jan 18, 2018 at 1:49 PM
      dave1956a, Jan 18, 2018
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      dave1956a

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      dave1956a, Jan 18, 2018
    21. Jan 18, 2018 at 1:56 PM
      Norman, Jan 18, 2018
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      Norman

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      Norman, Jan 18, 2018
    22. Jan 18, 2018 at 2:15 PM
      dave1956a, Jan 18, 2018
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      dave1956a

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      did not know about that one
       
      dave1956a, Jan 18, 2018
    23. Jan 18, 2018 at 2:33 PM
      Clem_Dye, Jan 18, 2018
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      Clem_Dye

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      I would never buy a product tagged with a 'firmware update to follow' to enable feature x, etc. It sounds like a case of mis-selling to me, but getting to prove that is probably going to be difficult, especially if the kit has been in your possession for a while. What's more galling is that this stuff isn't cheap. Whilst LG might be on a roll just now with their picture quality, ISTR that LG are rubbish dealing audio passthrough using HDMI and so forth, so nothing's perfect. You can always guarantee one thing in the world of electronics: the next new models will fix the problems that exist in the current range, but will bring their own set of new broken/missing/promised new features that never arrive. As far as manufacturers are concerned, consumers are the lowest form of life to be bled dry at any and all opportunities. It does not pay to be an early adopter of new technology, which is why I still haven't jumped-in to the 4K arena yet.

      Clem
       
      Clem_Dye, Jan 18, 2018
    24. Jan 18, 2018 at 2:51 PM
      Jonnyb320, Jan 18, 2018
      #24
      Jonnyb320

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      Im just amazed Sony has nothing official to say about this. No explanation, no press release, nothing. It screws up one of their biggest firmware updates of the year and there's total silence.

      Its an utter shambles.
       
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      Jonnyb320, Jan 18, 2018
    25. Jan 18, 2018 at 2:56 PM
      Geoff_D, Jan 18, 2018
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      Looking back upon it now this isn't the most surprising development in the world considering that jury-rigging one system to fit another often results in compromises such as this, e.g. Denon's 1200/2200/3200 AVRs not being able to play lossy DTS:X while lossless is fine, or the PS3's 3D Blu-ray update not being able to crunch 3D and TrueHD audio at the same time while 3D and DTS-HD is fine.

      OPPO have said April for their updated firmware, but these are very early days and there's no telling when it'll arrive and how it'll affect the player which is apparently being pushed hard to run DV as it is, never mind a version that places more processing strain on the player. Sony's own DV player will work with it like at CES because it'll be running this special sauce profile, however even that firmware update for the X700 won't follow until the summer of this year so if you want to run DV from disc on these TVs - who'da thunk it? - then you'll be waiting several more months at least for the OPPO update and summer for the Sony player update.

      As for why the TV's apps can run DV despite needing this low latency version, my theory is that the software for the apps has been updated alongside the main firmware and that the streaming providers themselves have been working with Sony to install this new profile at their end, so when the service detects that the TV is using this profile it will switch to that version which does more pre-processing to the signal at the server end. Having USB playback of DV is a bit trickier to wrap my head around, but my theory there is that because USB is such a simple low-power interface the TV isn't having to actively decrypt the source on the fly (as it would do with streaming or HDMI) so it's freeing up enough juice to be able to apply the pre-processing before it hits the main DV processing engine.
       
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      Geoff_D, Jan 18, 2018
    26. Jan 18, 2018 at 3:13 PM
      algu01, Jan 18, 2018
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      algu01

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      My AVR-receiver just got DV-passthrough, I certainly hope it will be able to pass this new profile to my A1.

      But I assume passthrough is not affected by which profile is passed, right?
       
      algu01, Jan 18, 2018
    27. Jan 18, 2018 at 3:25 PM
      matthewricha, Jan 18, 2018
      #27
      matthewricha

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      I am properly annoyed about this, I too waited to invest in 4K to get all DV kit which I did last August at great expense and now I am so worried I splashed out a huge amount on a TV for it to possibly not be widely compatible with DV! For months I've been waiting to give my DV discs a spin and was on the verge of buying ATV for DV (glad I haven't yet) and still there is not a DV update.

      Something is not quite right though with whats being reported. If Sony knowingly implemented a new variant of DV profile, why pull the words DV from the firmware update release notes? Why not just explain that the TV needs the Players to have this DV profile to work? How can Sony take so long to implement DV and then screw it up so much? Seems like their processor is not man enough to process the full implementation of DV. If that is the case on what premise did they make the sales and technical assertion that the TV was DV compatible?

      I for one will be having a right go at sales representatives at the Bristol AV show in February even though it's not their fault!
       
      matthewricha, Jan 18, 2018
    28. Jan 18, 2018 at 3:31 PM
      Jules, Jan 18, 2018
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      Jules

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      Personally I wouldn't bank on it... at least not without a firmware update.

      HDR just got yet more confusing. If you aren't a member of these forums and a well informed enthusiast, how on earth would you know what to buy.

      'Yes Sir, this television supports Dolby Vision, HDR10 and HDR10+".
      "So when HDR broadcasts start I'm fine?"
      'Ah, ... you'll need Hybrid Log gamma for that'

      "Yes Sir, this TV does support Hybrid Log Gamma as well as all the other formats"
      "      Excellent, in that case I'll take it along with that Dolby Vision capable UHD Blu-ray player"
      'Ah, well actually Sir... since this TV is a Sony, you'll need a Sony UHD player to get Dolby Vision"
      "ok, does the Sony UHD Blu-ray player support HDR streaming from a NAS drive"
      "Actually Sir, you'd better off with this dedicated streamer for that"
      "ok, will that streamer work with this Sony TV in Dolby Vision"
      "Erm, No... in fact the only streamer that supports Dolby Vision is this Apple TV4K.. but you can't connect a NAS drive to that"

      "hmm, this is quite confusing isn't it Mr Salesperson?"
      "can I interest you in this lovely £50 HDMI cable that will be Dolby Vision ready?"
       
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      Last edited: Jan 18, 2018
      Jules, Jan 18, 2018
    29. Jan 18, 2018 at 3:48 PM
      midknight, Jan 18, 2018
      #29
      midknight

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      Sony need to make a statement on this and fast - its already ridiculous it took the 12 month to get the firmware done and now its looking like a further 4 months minimum. They never once said that they were doing DV Lite - the impression they gave was always full fat DV - so fed up with these big companies treating their customers with so little respect.

      At least our cousins across the pond seem to be creating quite a stink about it as lets face it Sony would care even less if this was a Europe only issue.
       
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      Last edited: Jan 18, 2018
      midknight, Jan 18, 2018
    30. Jan 18, 2018 at 3:51 PM
      spookster, Jan 18, 2018
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      spookster

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      Surely there's a fix for this before the 2018 models are released. Seems like a redundant statement to promote DV support if it isn't truly supported.

      I'm stating the obvious, I know.
       
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      spookster, Jan 18, 2018
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