NEWS: Denon and Marantz issue hardware fix for AVR 4K/120 and 8K issue

Fillius

Well-known Member
After sending my X6700 via UPS (United Parcel Squashers) to get its DAC board replaced I wasn't looking forward to having to do it again for this issue...

But come on, is this really the proposed solution? It's huge and adds another possibly noisy power source into your system.

I'll order one of these boxes, but since my current TV doesn't support 4K120Hz I won't be using it for a while.
 

THX1138UK

Well-known Member
I have a Denon X4700, this fix is awful.. What am I supposed to do.

Provide a reason why the mitigation is not acceptable to you and ask your reseller for a refund or equivalent product that doesn't carry the same defect. If the reseller won't accept liability, then you could appeal directly to Denon.

I always find that a proper written letter, sent in the post gets far better results than emails when dealing with anything like this. It tends to land on the desk of someone who can actually do something about it...

Regards,
James.
 
Does anyone know if this affects Anthem's new lineup? I'll likely be doing eARC but I'd also like to know whatever I buy can work as it should.
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
Does anyone know if this affects Anthem's new lineup? I'll likely be doing eARC but I'd also like to know whatever I buy can work as it should.


I believe Anthem are using an entirely different chipset that isn't effected by the issues associated with the Denon, Marantz and Yamaha models.
 

Kotatsu Neko

Well-known Member
I'm glad I returned my SR6015. This fix looks like a total mess, more clutter, more cables, and an ugly break out box. They should have recalled the amps and issued replacements.

Frankly though the 4k/120 issue was the least of my 6015's issues. It crashed often and was beyond hopeless at switching between HDMI signals (mostly I would just get a black screen).

I'll wait for the new Pioneers due later this year, that is of course if they ever re-enter the UK market.
 

Kotatsu Neko

Well-known Member
I'll be discussing my options with RS tomorrow and if need be with Trading Standards. I wasn't aware of the problem at the point of purchase, I'm pretty sure RS were, they didn't inform me of the problem.


Once I was aware of it I was assured a fix would be coming, I wasn't expecting another box, another socket needed and having to shift stuff around to accommodate the new box.

At the point retailers continued selling knowing the units had a manufacturing fault, and weren't making buyers aware of it they are liable as far as I can see. If they had made buyers aware it's a different story, I wasn't.

I don't want another box, I bought an all-in-one unit so I could have less cables, not so I could have more forced on me.

I'd suggest people talk to their retailers and manufacturers about returning units, they have a fix but don't want to bear the cost of returns and repairs. If they didn't want that, they should have stopped sales of units when they were aware of the problem. My unit certainly didn't come with anything letting me know there was a manufacturing fault.

I returned mine to Richer Sounds. Interestingly the first guy I spoke to said it was outside of the return window but then the next time I called he was on holiday and the guy I spoke to then organised the return without issue.
 
Provide a reason why the mitigation is not acceptable to you and ask your reseller for a refund or equivalent product that doesn't carry the same defect. If the reseller won't accept liability, then you could appeal directly to Denon.

I always find that a proper written letter, sent in the post gets far better results than emails when dealing with anything like this. It tends to land on the desk of someone who can actually do something about it...

Regards,
James.
I find the opposite. A concise, to the point e mail addressed to the CEO will end up in his executive team's inbox, and response to e mail tends to get measured. And what gets measured gets done.

Using snail mail is going to be hit and miss - physical letters are far too easily "accidentally" dropped in the shredder. A good friend once told me:D.
 

alebonau

Well-known Member
In this day and age the public are the testers unfortunately!
doesnt have to be ...my marantz av8802a prior was fault less and same with my av8805... cant fault it... :D
 

Dorian

Active Member
I don't have a problem with a dongle if there's no software fix for this, but what I do have a problem with is the size of this thing, and the fact that it requires power.

What I'd like to know is if the line about this box delivering "corrected signals" is true, they are making it sound like the AVR is correct and the source is wrong. If this is the case (and I'm not sure it is) then there could be better/smaller third party solutions than this chunky box.
 

kinggo

Member
What I'd like to know is if the line about this box delivering "corrected signals" is true, they are making it sound like the AVR is correct and the source is wrong. If this is the case (and I'm not sure it is) then there could be better/smaller third party solutions than this chunky box.
sure......I mean, if ppl were testing those 2.1 capabilities with signals that fall under those specifications and it didn't work for all of them then how the source can be wrong? If they are sure that it is the source they would not move a finger for this.
And if you can adjust the source to output something else then why the box?
 

Mr Wolf

Active Member
Under the Consumer Rights Act 2015 a consumer has up to 6 years to bring a claim against a seller from which it bought a defective item.

If a claim is brought after 6 months the purchaser has to establish that the fault existed at the time of the purchase. In this case, as the manufacturer (Denon) has openly acknowledged that a product defect exists this is already established.

I think the real issue here though is that, after 30 days, a seller is entitled to resolve the defect with a repair or replacement product rather than a refund. The key legal question is therefore is an add-on box like this sufficient to constitute a repair of the product supplied? I would strongly argue that it is not sufficient as the AVRs should have been returned and re-chipped.

In short, if you're not happy with this box as a solution then you should contact the retailer you bought it from and request a proper repair or a full refund, quoting your rights under the CRA 2015.

Which? has a good basic guide to CRA 2015.


Full legislation is here.

 
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LicensedTaximan

Well-known Member
The name is almost as big as the unit, the SPK618 HDMI adapter. Thank goodness I staved off buying either the 8500 or the SR8015 a while ago. I would not be a happy man with that arrangement.

Apart from the reasons I gave on the other posts regarding me wanting to replace my present AV amp one of the others, which I hadn't mentioned, was to reduce my cabling at the back and with this you have extra cabling. One which goes into the unit and other one to plug the thing into a wall socket and then place it somewhere, probably where the sun very rarely makes an appearance. No thanks.

 

Fillius

Well-known Member
Under the Consumer Rights Act 2015 a consumer has up to 6 years to bring a claim against the seller that from which it bought a defective item.

If a claim is brought after 6 months the purchaser has to establish that the fault existed at the time of the purchase. In this case, as the manufacturer (Denon) has openly acknowledged that a product defect exists this is already established.

I think the real issue here though is that, after 30 days, a seller is entitled to resolve the defect with a repair or replacement product rather than a refund. The key legal question here is therefore is an add-on box like this sufficient to constitute a repair of the product supplied? I would strongly argue that it is not sufficient as the AVRs should have been returned and re-chipped.

In short, if you're not happy with this box as a solution then you should contact the retailer you bought it from and request a proper repair or a full refund, quoting your rights under the CRA 2015.

Which? has a good basic guide to CRA 2015.


Full legislation is here.

That's really helpful, I might try to go down this route then, especially since seeing this news:


One of the main reasons I chose the Denon over an Arcam or NAD receiver was because of the HDMI 2.1 support so I won't need to buy another AVR when I upgrade my TV.
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
The name is almost as big as the unit, the SPK618 HDMI adapter. Thank goodness I staved off buying either the 8500 or the SR8015 a while ago. I would not be a happy man with that arrangement.

Apart from the reasons I gave on the other posts regarding me wanting to replace my present AV amp one of the others, which I hadn't mentioned, was to reduce my cabling at the back and with this you have extra cabling. One which goes into the unit and other one to plug the thing into a wall socket and then place it somewhere, probably where the sun very rarely makes an appearance. No thanks.



They decided early in the development to drop the name Nigel and use SPK618 :lesson:
 
They decided early in the development to drop the name Nigel and use SPK618 :lesson:
You've been taking your humourous pills again mate :smashin:
 

Jay53

Active Member
Intrigued as to what this box is actually doing to the signal.

At first I thought maybe it was converting the signal and possibly chroma subsampling to for the limitations of the chip set in the AVR but that doesn't appear to be the case.

Watching the video posted by dante01 earlier at around 3mins they go through how to check. The first screen using Xbox shows 4k/120 8bit RGB which I would expect as xbox doesn't appear to use 10bit in the home screen / menus. However at 3:30 one of the Denon info screen shows it receiving 4k120 10bit RGB 40Gbs to the AVR so they maybe in an actual HDR game or video on the Xbox at that point. It then shows it outputting the same 4k/120 10bit RGB signal

This suggests the issue is not bandwidth if the receiver is getting and outputting a 4k120A RGB 40GBs signal?
 
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MosesMagnum

Standard Member
I returned mine to Richer Sounds. Interestingly the first guy I spoke to said it was outside of the return window but then the next time I called he was on holiday and the guy I spoke to then organised the return without issue.
Returned it within the 30 day period or outside it?
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
Intrigued as to what this box is actually doing to the signal.


The SPK618 apparently "corrects" anomalies with the source signal that are at the root of the problem. It is apparently an issue with the encoding of the source as facilitated by some devices such as the XBox series X that cause the issue. This is what Sound United are implying.

The SPK618 adapter takes an HDMI input signal from the gaming source and delivers the corrected HDMI data to the AVR, thus remedying the error and allowing a 4K/120Hz or 8K/60Hz signal to pass.

 

dion 6

Active Member
If you're not a gamer don't need support for 4k/120Hz HDR and 8k/60 HDR there might be some great deals on these avr's when the new models with the new chip come out
 

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