NEWS: Denon and Marantz AVRs made after May 2021 are HDMI 2.1 bug free

golden phoenix

Distinguished Member
It's clear the dacs have been changed. So marantz and denon have to tow the line that it doesn't effect sound quality. Let's hope there right for any possible new owners
 

Slinkywizard

Well-known Member
The absolute worst thing about this updated situation is the misplaced apostrophe in [each brands'].

'Each' puts the noun into the singular. You can say each one, but you can't say each two. Should be [each brand's].

When I read this I involuntarily puked. And when I thought about it further my head burst into flames.

(this entire post is a joke, take-everything-at-face-value fans)
 
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Dobbyisfree

Well-known Member
Yes, they've missed the 'each' aspect of it and think it's "Denon and Marantz".

Don't worry @Slinkywizard they're English isn't great. Let's hope their strengths are biased towards DAC installation. :)
 

Andy Bassett

Standard Member
Staff member
The absolute worst thing about this updated situation is the misplaced apostrophe in [each brands'].

'Each' puts the noun into the singular. You can say each one, but you can't say each two. Should be [each brand's].

When I read this I involuntarily puked. And when I thought about it further my head to burst into flames.

(this entire post is a joke, take-everything-at-face-value fans)
Unfortunately, the factory that manufactures the correct punctuation has suffered a major fire so the original apostrophes have been replaced. These replacements have been checked by the Denon and Marantz Grammar Masters and are guaranteed to provide the same message that the original sentence was designed to deliver.

I could of course ask Sound United for a comment about its statement... but I think that way madness lies.
 

Slinkywizard

Well-known Member
Unfortunately, the factory that manufactures the correct punctuation has suffered a major fire so the original apostrophes have been replaced. These replacements have been checked by the Denon and Marantz Grammar Masters and are guaranteed to provide the same message that the original sentence was designed to deliver.

I could of course ask Sound United for a comment about its statement... but I think that way madness lies.
Damn you Andy, your post is funnier than mine.
 

THX1138UK

Well-known Member
Seems strange that they wouldn’t at least add a ‘B’ to the end of the model number to provide the distinction between units that have the original flawed chipset and units with the fixed chipset.

Regards,
James.
 

Dobbyisfree

Well-known Member
They could add a T for corrected Hdmi then an A for dialogue bleed issue and then another T for the alternative DACs. :)
 

Galaxy

Member
These replacements have been checked by the Denon and Marantz Grammar Masters and are guaranteed to provide the same message that the original sentence was designed to deliver.
The Grammar Masters have had little to do since they stopped production of the Gramaphones.
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
Biggest HDMI 2.1 bug is still to be fixed. Only one 2.1 port on most devices.


Not really an issue though is it. How many sources include it or actually need it? Even if you had more than one source, simply connect them directly to the TV and then use eARC to pass the associated audio through and out to an AV receiver. The AV receiver needn't technically have any HDMI version 2.1 inputs if equipped with eARC.

The main (only) sources utilising HDMI version 2.1 have been games consoles or gameing PCs. No serious gamer is going to want to add latency to the video signal by passing it through an AV receiver anyway.

There's also the fact that if insisting upon outputting games at 4K 120Hz then the current games consoles haven't the video processing to still be able to give you other features such as ray tracing at the same time.
 
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Raitziger

Member
Not really an issue though is it. How many sources include it or actually need it? Even if you had more than one source, simply connect them directly to the TV and then use eARC t
It is not simply as TV might not have enough and eARC seems to be more or less mess anyways to get working right.

Also there is no latency when AVR is on passthrough mode.
 

Joe C

Well-known Member
It is not simply as TV might not have enough and eARC seems to be more or less mess anyways to get working right.

And a lot of recent tv’s have annoyingly dropped the ability to pass through DTS
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
It is not simply as TV might not have enough and eARC seems to be more or less mess anyways to get working right.

Also there is no latency when AVR is on passthrough mode.


So why aren't you moaning about the TV not having enough compliant inputs? Are you suggesting that an AV receiver is a requisite of owning and using a games console?

There's about 30ms of delay incurred on the video signal passiung through any and all AV receivers. As suggested, it is why serious gamers do not pass the video through an AV receiver and connect their cosoles directly to the display. An AV receiver is effectively an HDMI repeter and not simply passing the video through it. There are also other circuits associated with adding onscreen graphics and menus which are still in effect even if not engaging video processing.
 
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Raitziger

Member
So why aren't you moaning about the TV not having enough compliant inputs? Are you suggesting that an AV receiver is a requisite of owning and using a games console?

There's about 30ms of latency incurred on the video signal passiung through any and all AV receivers. As suggested, it is why serious gamers do not pass the video through an AV receiver and connect their cosoles directly to the display.
I have never noticed additional lag with Onkyo and direct setting. Audio is coming ARC back but AVR used for signal source routing only.
 

Raitziger

Member
You probably wont notice it, but pro gamers apparently do?
Well I don't know. I don't think pros even use HT equipment and TVs to play anyway. People have however noticed that if they use advanced format over eARC there is noticeable lag in audio(console straight in TV) and Xbox gamers wont like to use Dolby Atmos etc for this reason.
 

fritzilla

Standard Member
... Are you suggesting that an AV receiver is a requisite of owning and using a games console?

There's about 30ms of delay incurred on the video signal passiung through any and all AV receivers. As suggested, it is why serious gamers do not pass the video through an AV receiver and connect their cosoles directly to the display. ...
Actually, yes, and AV receiver is required if you want to have full immersive sound and NOT have audio out of sync issues that arise with ARC.

Serious gamers that enjoy both graphics fidelity and sound are not able to use eARC/ARC. Problems include:
  • Limited audio formats (only Dolby Digital and LCPM 2 channel)
  • The audio sync is atrocious, about 200ms (the lowest with Dolby Digital). It's worse if using Atmos.
I would take an input lag of 30 ms over 200ms of out of sync sound, where the words are not synced with the lips. (and this sync is not fixed by lip sync adjustments, because they only go the one way).

Yes, I agree with Raitziger, having only one HDMI port that's 2.1 (and having the bug) is really unnacceptable knowing that there will be at least two game machines (Xbox and PS5) not to mention people connect PCs. So day zero, there's a need for at least two if not three.
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
An AV receiver is not a requirement for either a games console or any source. An AV receiver is an additional item of equipment used to facilitate audio processing and amplification. You can use all games consoles without owning or using an AV receiver. Many people do just that and do not own an AV receiver.

As to HDMI version 2.1, I don't give a hoot and I'll hazzard that the vast majority of home theatre enthusiasts don't either? It is of little if any importance and gamers are a very small proportion of this market sector.

To tell you the truth, I'm sick of hearing about HDMI version 2.1. I'm also amazed as to why so much importance is being put upon it?
 
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Sunshinewelly

Distinguished Member
I have 3 hdmi 2.1 sources so need a receiver with 3 such inputs. I don't want to run 3 long hdmi runs to my display so having hdmi inputs is very important
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
I have 3 hdmi 2.1 sources so need a receiver with 3 such inputs. I don't want to run 3 long hdmi runs to my display so having hdmi inputs is very important


At this point in time then you'd be very limited as to your options. You'd basically be limited to Yamaha AVRs and more than likely only one of their top 3 new Aventage models?

The A2 model and the models below this have 3 HDMI version 2.1 8K compliant input, but Yamaha have only implimented chipsets with a very limited bandwidth within these lower tier model. The'd be only able to convey 24Gbps max.

The A4, A6 and the A8 models will have 7 fully compliant HDMI 2.1 40Gbps compliant inputs as well as 2 mirrored and 1 third HDMI zone output that are also 40Gbps compliant. You cannot actually buy one yet though.

There's also the fact that all of these Yamaha models are not and will not ship with their HDMI version 2.1 capabilities as yet enabled. They will require a firmware update at some future point in time so aren't as yet HDMI version 2.1 compliant.
 

THX1138UK

Well-known Member
And a lot of recent tv’s have annoyingly dropped the ability to pass through DTS

Just curious, but as none of the streaming services use DTS audio, what problem does the TV not having DTS passthrough cause you?

Regards,
James.
 

rccarguy2

Well-known Member
Just curious, but as none of the streaming services use DTS audio, what problem does the TV not having DTS passthrough cause you?

Regards,
JamesForor

My video sources (BD,dvd, Kodi) are plugged into TV then from the TV audio is sent out to ge AVE pre (currently optical, but soon e-arc hdmi)

So having TV pass all formats is useful. TV and sources are opposite side of the room to the racking
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
Just curious, but as none of the streaming services use DTS audio, what problem does the TV not having DTS passthrough cause you?

Regards,
James.


If you were connecting a games console directly to the TV then it would make it impossible to bitstream DTS, DTS-HD MA and or DTS:X encoded audio out to an LG TV and pass it through for output to an AV receiver via eARC.

You'd also no longer be able to play or access SD DTS encoded audio if using the TV's own integral media player.

The solution relative to external sources would be to configure them to do the decoding of DTS sources and output this as multichannel PCM.

If using sources that can play and or access DTS:X connected directly to the TV then you'd not be able to passthrough DTS:X metadata because you cannot bitstream the DTS-HD MA audio DTS:X metadata is packaged with.


It is only LG that have ceased support for DTS.
 

THX1138UK

Well-known Member
My video sources (BD,dvd, Kodi) are plugged into TV then from the TV audio is sent out to ge AVE pre (currently optical, but soon e-arc hdmi)

So having TV pass all formats is useful. TV and sources are opposite side of the room to the racking

Ah right - understood. I use an AVR to achieve the same.

Regards,
James.
 

Joe C

Well-known Member
It is only LG that have ceased support for DTS.
Panasonic don't support it either - seems it's only Sony that definitely still do (I don't know about Philips)
 

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