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New Sub - Things To Take into Account In My Odd Living Room

Discussion in 'Subwoofers' started by smashedpumpkin, Mar 18, 2017.

  1. smashedpumpkin

    smashedpumpkin
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    I recently bought a second hand sub and it arrived damaged, im now waiting on it being uplifted as i got a full refund.

    Now im going for a new sub so i want to know what things i need to consider given the shape of my room. Should i get a FF or DF sub? Should my room size or shape come into consideration when choosing my next sub. I have a carpeted floor and concrete base.

    I had a BK xls200 in the past and loved it so i would not mind anther BK, what is the best i can buy for £400 to £450?

    This is my living room, its rectangular but it has a short support wall at each side. room is 5.3m by 3.2m.


    [​IMG]print screen windows
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2017
  2. Violator

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    FF or DF is really a preference thing, shouldn't make much difference to sound. Only time it 'might' is if you're on a suspended floor.

    That budget could get you a mono, or a 2nd hand mono+. Or an XLS400.

    What's it for? Movies, music or both?
     
  3. smashedpumpkin

    smashedpumpkin
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    I actually prefer DF as there is less chance of it getting damaged. My floor is concrete underneath my carpet so thats fine.

    I need it to really produce room filling quality bass on movies and then also perform great with music at high levels, i dont often crank it way with music up but i want it to be able to cope should i get the notion.
     
  4. Violator

    Violator
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    I'd look at the XLS400 in that case. Great with music but can also deliver excellent results with movies too.
     
  5. pabloh20

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    I would agree with Violator if you are looking at the BK range.

    I got an XXLS400-DF a few weeks ago and have been really impressed for both movies and music. After I had set it up for music, I then started looking through my music collection for songs with good bass just so I could hear how good it sounded. Always good when new toys brings a grin to your face! I have mine connected high level for music in my setup.

    My room is about 4mx4m, so probably similar in size/volume to yours and it produces more than enough bass to fill my room, without even trying, to be honest.
     
  6. smashedpumpkin

    smashedpumpkin
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    Sounds great from the great reviews and its not a great deal more for the second hand sub i bought. The Monolith is just slightly more, does it not perform as well?

    Did you consider the Monolith or were the reviews just so good for the xxls400? Why did you use the high level inputs or do you use a sub cable from your avr too? Its good it fills your room with good bass, thats what i need.
     
  7. Violator

    Violator
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    There's a difference between the two. The mono is ported, the xls400 is sealed. This means the mono can go a bit lower, but can be described at times as a little 'slow' with music, simply due to the design. A sealed unit with a good amount of power behind it will give you excellent music reproduction and very good movie reproduction.

    Depends what you put priority on.
     
  8. MemX

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    Technically speaking, the sealed will go lower than the ported - it's just that the ported will have more output at the port's tuning point ;) (and then will be cut off below that point.)

    I have ready many times that ported is not 'slower' than sealed, but in my experience I found that going sealed did tighten things up. I think the shift in phase at the port's tuning point, combined with the effects of the room, can make ported trickier to EQ, but in theory they should sound the same! I would second the proposal that a large and/or powerful sealed would be the better option, though ;)
     
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  9. smashedpumpkin

    smashedpumpkin
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    My priority would be the music and then the movies. ;)

    Ok souds good, it sounds like the xls400 is the one for me. I Now have to consider what finish to go for, i wont be going for one that bumps the price up though. I will go over the reviews for the xl400 and if it all sounds good ill probably place and order.

    Ok thanks mate for sharing the good info, i shall follow the advice given by you and the other helpful chaps and go for a sealed DF sub. I just need to go over the reviews again and make sure it sounds right for me. Are all the review sites reliable for hifi or is some considered being a bit too kind with the reviews, i remember this was the opinion of whathifi years ago.
     
  10. Violator

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    I'd take the many satisfied people we have on here with XLS400s as a pretty good measurement :) There's a big thread on here BK XXLS400 Thread dedicated to the 400 that's well worth a read (some of it anyway :)), plus for the money you'll find it very hard to beat BK in terms of value and performance.
     
  11. Trojan

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  12. pabloh20

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    I did, I was debating between the 2 of them for a number of days, but decided for my needs in my room the xxls400 was (hopefully) more than sufficient. As it has turned out, fortunately my decision was correct, for me and my situation, at least.

    So what turned me more towards the xxls400 was mainly room constraints, so basically my sub has to go in the corner and the space between the sub, the walls, the sofa and front speaker is not the greatest. The xxls400 is exactly the same size as the Rel Q50 I was replacing, the monolith obviously much bigger. I decided in the end, that as I was happy with my Rel, only replacing it as it was going faulty, that the xxls400 would be better suited. Knowing what I do now, from using the xxls400, is that for my ears and my room, I think I would have had trouble taming the monolith!

    I have the sub connected with low level from AVR (with an anti mode) and high level to my naim amp. So, I have my naim amp on the pre-outs from my AVR driving the front speakers. So when I listen to music, it is purely through the naim, not the AVR, so just having the sub connected on the sub out on the AVR doesn't work for me, hence the high level connection to the speaker terminals on the naim amp.

    With regards to fulling the room with good bass, I would say the xxls400 is definitely a step up from my old Rel with regards to sound quality and heft/thump, whatever you want to call it. It sounds appreciably better, even after this short time, for movies and music, so it is definitely 'good' bass to my ears. As a guide line (I do lean to wards understated bass) my AVR set the sub with the antimode on and sub volume at 9 o clock as -1db in the audyssey set up and this ties in with my readings via spl, I currently have it set at -10db on my AVR, so I would say there is plenty of headroom!

    Sorry for the long reply.
     
  13. smashedpumpkin

    smashedpumpkin
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    Violater - Many thanks for the reply, it looks like everyone is happy with their xxls400 sub. The reviews are very good too and it sound just right for the music/movies balance that i need. I have ordered my sub from Bk and in cherry colour. Nothing on the website indicates how long delivery will take..

    Trojan - many thanks for the link to ebay, the gloss black you linked to is not much cheaper than the £450 price for a standard finish, gloss back is more expensive new anyway, i would have settled for the black xxls400 they have but its a FF model, no use, i need DF, what a pity. I have ordered my new sub DF in cherry finish.

    Pabloh - No worries regarding the long reply, i appreciate the fact you and other guys take the time to reply and help, it was good to read your thoughts on your xxls400, in turn i have ordered the xxls400 DF in cherry, i cant wait to get in my living room, how long did yours take to arrive, there is no mention of delivery times on the website.

    I will probably end up with my sub connected up in the same way via the avr and power amp. My avr has stereo mode but the sub does not function in that mode, i have to use AFD which activates stereo mode and the sub. Do you think there is any quality loss using the high level inputs? You sound delighted anyway with your sub and im sure i will be too, i was very fond of my old xxls200, bring back the BK ;) .
     
  14. Violator

    Violator
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    @smashedpumpkin Delivery can take a couple of weeks, especially with a non-generic finish. They're all built to order pretty much. Worth the wait mind :)
     
  15. pabloh20

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    I am absolutely delighted with my sub, I guess it shows :) However, again, it was purely down to the advice of people on this forum that I was even looking at BK subs in the first place, amongst others.

    I'll have a check when I get home to see how long it was between ordering and delivery, but I think it may have been close to 3 weeks. I did ask for the auto on/off feature, so not sure if that takes a bit longer, then again I didn't get a more exotic finish either, just plain old black. Mine is pretty much hidden and black fits in with the colour scheme, anyway, thankfully.

    I don't think there is any quality loss using the high level inputs, but I can't really set up a comparable listening test with my equipment, to be honest. I can play music just through the AVR, but it just doesn't compare quality wise to the naim amp anyway, so would be hard to tell. The only thing I can really say, since I use the high level for playing music, is it has impressed me more with music than I was expecting, if that helps, in a roundabout way?
     
  16. smashedpumpkin

    smashedpumpkin
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    I never knew about this wait, the website conveniently does not mention this, i have called them today and they should have it delivered by thurs or fri next week, yipee, its not too long to wait.

    Wow 3 weeks is a long time, they told me today mine should be ready by next thurs or fri. I never know there was not an auto on off, did you have to pay more for this feature and how did you request it? I ordered cherry, i would have liked walnut but i was not going to pay another £55 for the pleasure..

    It is free to try the high level inputs so why not if it sounds good to me then its a big thumbs up, it saves having to use this AFD mode on my avr so i can use the sub, i can just set the avr to stereo for the front preouts.

    Roll on next thurs or fri :)
     
  17. pabloh20

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    I had read on the forums here that it sometimes take up to a month, because they basically hand-make them to order, I think it does state that on the website, somewhere. They are only a small business (comparatively), by all accounts, so I was prepared for the wait. Mine came quicker than I was expecting, so I was happy, it's worth the wait anyway! :)

    Again, I had seen on the forum that people had requested the auto on/off, so I asked before I ordered it and was told to put it on the comments section if ordering it online. It didn't cost anything extra and seems to work fine for me.

    Yep, definitely give it a go, they give you cables with sub, so should be fairly easy for you to give it a try when you get it. I had always thought the high level was the better connection, but I have no idea why I thought that, I have never tested the theory, maybe the neutrik connection just looked higher quality :D
     
  18. smashedpumpkin

    smashedpumpkin
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    From what i have always believed is that the low level rca input is the better choice. I think it provides a distortion free signal, maybe its less fussy for a subwoofer. You dont normally hear of people using the speaker outputs to connect their equipment, they use the preouts and rca cable.

    I tried to call to request an auto on/off switch but it was engaged, i sent them an email instead. You would think a sub at that price, it would be standard. Thanks for the heads up re the switch. ;)
     
  19. pabloh20

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    As I say, I don't really know why I thought the high level was the better connection, I think Rel used to tout it on their subs many years ago when I got mine. I had a quick search and there is a post on here about high level/low level connections -

    FAQ - High Level and Low Level Inputs

    It doesn't seem to suggest that either one connection or the other is better quality, not that I can find anyway.

    I think they started putting the auto on/off on the newer P12-300SB, but it has not made it as standard on any of their other subs yet, as far as I know. Maybe when they do an update to other subs, they will put it on. I think there have been some issues with other manufacturers implementations of the feature, so not everyone seems to want it either.
     
  20. smashedpumpkin

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    Interesting reading in the faq, thanks for posting the link. Now i know why i should use the high level input when using the speakers for stereo.

    It just seems easy to assume that if the amp is powered on that it will burn more electricity, it would give me a warm glow knowing it was in standby when it was not in use. Its not the end of the world though.
     
  21. smashedpumpkin

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    I got a call from Olive at BK on Wednesday, she was confirming the delivery details for Thursday. The sub arrived safe and sound on the Thursday but due to diy commitments i did not get time to open my box, i work weekends but hopefully i can get time to open it tomorrow.
     

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