New Sub - size restricted - Help

Discussion in 'Subwoofers' started by kwacker9, Feb 12, 2014.

  1. kwacker9

    kwacker9
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    ~HI, still new to this.

    Looking to get a new sub to replace my Active Pioneer S-W40S, mainly used for movies & is a small sub, I've recently upgraded my fronts to Mission 702e & now feel that the sub isn't doing much/anything.

    The limitation I have is where I can put it, so I am restricted to a sub of around 500mm high x 200mm Wide & 450mm deep.

    Looking around I can't seem to find one that fits

    Wanting something around 100w with as low as possible 20hz, it will be running off a Onkyo SR608, with a Tannoy Mxc.

    any/all help appreciated
     
  2. MemX

    MemX
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    Those dimensions really are quite tiny in width, only 8" - you may only have something like the XLS200 (or whatever it's called) from BK that would fit off-the-shelf, and I'm not sure it would hit 20Hz with any authority simply due to its size.


    If you were open to DIY (or AIY - Assemble It Yourself) and could house a separate amp (or perhaps even build a plate amp in) you could use 1" MDF to give external dimensions of 20" high x 8" wide x 18" deep, which would give internal dimensions of 18" x 6" x 16" (roughly) which would give 1 cubic foot of internal space to play with.

    If you mounted one of the ultra-slim 12" subwoofers from Stereo Integrity in one of the 18" x 20" side panels:
    Stereo Integrity | SI BM mkIII
    BM mkIV production

    the internal box volume would be a little larger than recommended but that would allow you to use less power to achieve good output and also good extension.

    I don't think anyone's modelled that driver yet, but at 14mm XMax that gives you over an inch of peak-to-peak cone travel, which should produce decent output. :)
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2014
  3. kwacker9

    kwacker9
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    Thanks - yes very restrictive on space, but appreciate your reply and suggestion of a self build, this isn't something I've considered, if I fail to find a Pre-built it may have to be the way to go!....will check out the BK you mentioned too.

    Cheers
     
  4. MemX

    MemX
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    Have a look at the Ken Kreisel DXD808 as well - I'm not sure of the size but it is pretty small, and is well rated by owners. I believe they are c.£1000 but someone on here was trying to arrange a Group Buy, which would have brought them down to c.£833 :)
     
  5. MemX

    MemX
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  6. kwacker9

    kwacker9
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    Cheers MemX - but even at c.£833 it is too rich for my blood :thumbsdow, I wouldn't put myself down as a self builder & really don't have the knowledge or time, I do take my hat off to those that do however :smashin:.


    I may have to look a bit more mainstream(Yamaha YST205!?) or see if I can gain a few more inches to fit it in, 300mm looks to be the smallest sub for the specs.
     
  7. kwacker9

    kwacker9
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    I've found an Onkyo Powered Subwoofer (SKW-538) with the following specs:

    Type: Bass-reflex
    Input sensitivity/impedance 410 mV / 20 kΩ
    Rated output Power (IEC): 80 watts minimum continuous power,
    4 ohms, driven at 100 Hz with a maximum total harmonic distortion of 1%
    Frequency response: 27 Hz to 150 Hz
    Cabinet capacity: 24 L
    Dimensions (W×H×D)211 mm×425 mm×391 mm(incl. projection)
    Weight: 8.1 kg
    Drivers unit:16 cm Cone×1

    thoughts ?
     
  8. gylonso

    gylonso
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    You could look at the Q acoustic 7000 series (7070Si) subwoofer which just about meets your size requirements. I believe the orientation of the sub isn't important, particularly as the driver is internal.

    Speaker Specifications
    Enclosure TypeInfinite Baffle
    Enclosure MaterialMDF
    LF Units8" High-Excursion Driver
    Power Handling150W Class-D
    Frequency35Hz - 200Hz
    Overall Dimensions (H x W x D)320 x 460 x 198(mm)
    Weight13.8 Kg


    The old version of this sub, which you might still be able to get hold of, is a little bigger, but a 250mm driver and 250W.

    Review on this site
    Q Acoustics Q7000S Subwoofer review | AVForums

    Amplifier power (watts)250 watts pure analogue design built in.
    Connections2 x speaker level inputs (via 4mm banana plug/binding post)
    Stereo line level input (via 2 x RCA/phono)
    Drivers250mm (10") Ultra long throw

    Frequency response (Hz)30 - 220
    H x W x D (mm) 370 x 510 x 215
    Weight (kg) 18
     
  9. kwacker9

    kwacker9
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    Cool will check out the review & prices - size does look about right too!, Would I be correct in thinking smaller volume subs cannot get down to 20hz?.
     
  10. MemX

    MemX
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    It's not impossible but check out Hoffman's Iron Law - you have three criteria and you will only ever meet two of them, you just have to pick which two :p lol

    Small (box size), deep (output range), efficient (low power) :)
     
  11. kwacker9

    kwacker9
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    I did say I was new to this ;) - which are the better two ?.
     
  12. lokyc

    lokyc
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    I think first of all, we need to know what your full system is, budget and expectations.

    Budget can be based on affordability and willingness to spend. Sometimes people think they can't hear the difference. Believe me, if you throw money at the right products, its easy to tell. Probably easier.

    As sub is something worth investing in as they add many things to your listening. You can upgrade other stuff later. I upgraded my sub last as I didn't believe in that advice. So I stand corrected now.

    Bigger is generally better. But the devil's in the detail. Whether the sub provides any detail or just a muffled rumble. Integration is another factor to consider.
     
  13. kwacker9

    kwacker9
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    WIki lesson on Hoffman's law - thanks for the guidance :lesson:, I have been trying to get speakers with good/better sensitivity :).
     
  14. kwacker9

    kwacker9
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    Moving from Onkyo SR307 to SR608 Amp this weekend, Mission 702e front, Tannoy MxC center, Eltax Dx50 rear (soon to be replaced - with ??), Pioneer S-W40S sub, I am trying to do it on a budget, primarily looking at classifieds etc - Sub around £100 unless it is thought to be pointless at this price point as you have suggested already !?, As for my expectations - I have already been impressed with the upgrade to the Missions :) so would like to complete experience with a more noticeable sub, My room isn't lightly furnished or setup friendly & don't believe I would benefit in a top end system.
     
  15. lokyc

    lokyc
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    Sorry for late reply. Was reading on phone and had problems posting.

    Its not so much you wouldn't benefit from top end, its just it wouldn't be properly matched, and unless you're looking to upgrade the rest, its pointless at this stage.

    At around the £100 mark, there is the Tannoy SFX, and I think a Yam or something. But in reality these subs perform around the same level as HTIB.

    You have decent speakers. I would suggest you give the BK Gemini a go, and if you can stretch it, the XLS200. They do periodically pop up on the classifieds and are around your budget. I sold my XLS200 for around £150. This is the level you should be aiming for to feel that its money well spent.
     
  16. Iain42

    Iain42
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    Habitat 1 from REL. I believe that you can wall mount or floor mount, and can be wireless, so that might give you some more options.
    25 x 16 x 4.5 in., (635 x 406 x 114 mm)
     
  17. lokyc

    lokyc
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    The REL is, ahem, £1.3k. Hoffman's law needs to include cost.

    at that price, I would go for a KK DXD808.
     
  18. kwacker9

    kwacker9
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    Not thinking of upgrading the rest, well not at this stage anyhow!, think I'll keep a keen eye on the classifieds for a BK, will see what the diff is between the Gemini & XLS200.....would consider stretching a bit ...

    Thanks :)
     
  19. kwacker9

    kwacker9
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    Yeah - way beyond for the REL, Not seen much on the KK DXD808... Will add it to my search.

    Cheers.
     
  20. kwacker9

    kwacker9
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    Ok, what is the thought of having a front floor standing speaker on top of a Sub, Is this a bad idea?.

    I could get a bigger sub this way.
     
  21. MemX

    MemX
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    No reason why you couldn't put a speaker on top of a sub - the sub should be inert enough to not move or have wall-flex, so you shouldn't have any issues with the speaker moving. You may want to put something between them to prevent any possible damage to their finishes, though.
     
  22. kwacker9

    kwacker9
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    OK, that may be a good way forward for me, I can now re-check the available space I have & amend the sub list :).
     
  23. kwacker9

    kwacker9
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    OK, managed to get hold of a Wharfdale diamond SW150, before I set about re-configuring my lounge, - My last sub only had an RCA + Volume, could do with a little guidance on the Sub as I am now confronted with:
    .Crossover frequency (35-85Hz)
    .Volume (0-10)
    .phase 0/180
    .Auto power on/off

    I believe I should be using the left line input (white RCA) to connect to the AV sub pre out, it is possible to also connect the second AV sub pre out to the right line input- but unsure of hte benfit if any!?.
    Setup as follows
    Onkyo SR608
    Center Tannoy Mxc
    Front Mission 702e
    Surround B&W LM1's
    + the Sw150

    thanks.
     
  24. mojogoes

    mojogoes
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    I thought that you've more or less sorted the setup out now bar the shouting.
     
  25. kwacker9

    kwacker9
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    Ye
    Yep, that should be about it - for now anyway :clap: - not sure why I'd be shouting however !? :thumbsdow
     
  26. mojogoes

    mojogoes
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  27. MemX

    MemX
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    I think it's a turn of phrase, kwacker ;)
     
  28. mojogoes

    mojogoes
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    That it is mucker!!:rotfl:
     
  29. kwacker9

    kwacker9
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