1. Join Now

    AVForums.com uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

New Pioneer Elite line: a "big" downgrade in power??

Discussion in 'AV Receivers & Amplifiers' started by Llanowar, Sep 19, 2005.

Tags:
  1. Llanowar

    Llanowar
    Standard Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2005
    Messages:
    387
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Amsterdam
    Ratings:
    +0
    I've just been eagerly waiting for the new pioneer elite line receiver....and i'm finally checking the whole spec list from pioneer. The elite line has had great reviews and comments from users over the last two years. The new pioneer 1015 has actually already won the Eisa awards 2005-2006 so i was really looking forward for the new model the vsx-ax4avi-s (follow up of the ax5).

    The new model has 2 hmdi ins, bi-amp possibility, two i-links, advanced MCACC with roomcorrection and phase control and is stated at 7x 150 watt (DIN).

    So all looks great eh?
    But when i compare the ax5 with the new ax4 (spec sheet of the new series is here: http://www.pioneer-eur.com/files/brochures/05_HE_FULL/05_HE_Full_EN_part2.pdf page 46)
    the ax5 is 21.2kg, the ax4 16.1kg (that's a 25% decrease!) and on top of that the power power consumption of the ax5 is 600 watts compared to the 460 watts the ax4 uses.

    Now, some of this could be due to new techonologies...but i find it very hard to believe that counts for all personally. If i read this on the american forums(the 74 is the american version of the ax4): http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=569072&page=1&pp=30 it kinda confirms what i thought, the capacitors are smaller on the new model.

    Now i'm really interested to see the first real numbers and tests...cause if this is true, pioneer has stabbed themselves in the back a bit. Their (elite) receivers build up the reputation of having very big power supplies and great dynamics, but with the denon 3806 coming (which has increased in power) and the yamaha 2600 and 4600 they might have a harder time proving their bold wattage numbers (which i know don't say much, but it's 30 watts a channel higher than the ax5 is stated)....which i really want to believe cause i really like the pioneer elite receivers and this one has all the functions i could ask for...

    Sooooo..anyone heard a bit more about these new models to share some more info?

    edit: some extra numbers from sounds and vision magazine...not too impressive in my eyes either

    Output at clipping (1 kHz into 8/4 ohms)
    1 channel driven: 172/296 W (22.4/24.7 dBW)*
    5 channels driven (8 ohms): 61 W (17.9 dBW)*
    6 channels driven (8 ohms): 52 W (17.1 dBW)*
     
  2. tazpc

    tazpc
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2002
    Messages:
    252
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    21
    Location:
    NORTH BUCKS
    Ratings:
    +4
    This is available from the US support site.
    interesting reading. :)
     
  3. alphabet

    alphabet
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Must agree with you that the quoted output figures are not impressive at all seeing that it is only measured at 1KHz!

    I have seen(and heard) cheaper(read less expensive) receivers that have higher confirmed output levels at 20Hz to 20KHz.
     
  4. Llanowar

    Llanowar
    Standard Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2005
    Messages:
    387
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Amsterdam
    Ratings:
    +0
    I read a bit more in the thread, this is a reaction of a pioneer rep:

    The lighter weight is due to an amplifier redesign from Mosfet to Class AB Bipolar.
    ..

    I am sure you will be happy with any of the receivers you are look at.

    Chris Walker

    It seems like the room correction is great too, and the sound a lot better... really got my interest back now luckily enough :)
     
  5. Nabs

    Nabs
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2004
    Messages:
    756
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Ratings:
    +10
    He is a comment from pioneer regarding the units:

    Response (RJFCS) - 11/11/2005 10:53 AM
    Hi,

    Thanks for your email.

    The electronic design of the VSA-AX4AVi is similar but not the same as the VSA-AX5Ai, the output stage uses different MOSFET transistors to increase the power output whilst not increasing the heat output, enabling the use of a lighter heat sink.
    In absolute terms the amp section of the AX5 is better but not allot different in real life, they both do a very good job and audio quality at this level is a subjective thing anyway.

    The construction of the chaise is also changed and this, in combination with a lighter weight but more efficient power supply, is the reason for the weight differences between these 2 units.

    We do not have plans at this point for an AV amp to fit between the AX4AVi and the AX10Ai in the European model range.

    If you have a good local dealer they may be able to demonstrate the differences and similarities between these two units.

    Regards.
    Customer Relations
    PIONEER GB LIMITED
     

Share This Page

Loading...