New Lyngdorf TDAI-1120 Streaming amp

This ("Must resist the urge to now upgrade the speakers!") is exactly the dilemma I'm in... :rolleyes:
Apart from Lyngdorf's own kit, what are people's thoughts? My taste in music is more or less everything(!): mainly rock/indie pop, but also dance through to jazz to classical...
You should at least try the Lyngdorf FR1.......they are very good in my opinion and often overlooked.
 
This ("Must resist the urge to now upgrade the speakers!") is exactly the dilemma I'm in... :rolleyes:
Apart from Lyngdorf's own kit, what are people's thoughts? My taste in music is more or less everything(!): mainly rock/indie pop, but also dance through to jazz to classical...
What speakers have you got now? I'm on an ageing pair of Rurak Talisman 2 floor standers. They sound so much better with the 1120 but am looking at speakers from Dynaudio and Dali.
 
Currently have B&W 684s (the 'smaller' floorstanders). The Lyngdorf replaced a Cyrus ONE.

The sound is great, however I appreciate the Lyngdorf can do so much more - judging by some of the kit being quoted by others in this tread - and also as my 'musical appreciation' increases as I listen to the 1120 more and more...
 
Currently have B&W 684s (the 'smaller' floorstanders). The Lyngdorf replaced a Cyrus ONE.

The sound is great, however I appreciate the Lyngdorf can do so much more - judging by some of the kit being quoted by others in this tread - and also as my 'musical appreciation' increases as I listen to the 1120 more and more...


I'm looking to spend at around £1,000 - £1,500, and SH on eBay is an option...
 
I'm looking to spend at around £1,000 - £1,500, and SH on eBay is an option...



Or if bookshelves are your thing.


These are the ones you're after. They'll easily outperform KEF R3 for music and film and a big step up from the B&Ws :smashin:
 
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Thanks for the suggestions!

The KEF R3 recommendation reminds me to say that one ‘problem’ I have with the current B&Ws that although the overall soundstage is quite wide, there is a very specific and narrow sweetspot where everything really clicks/is in focus 100%. If you move your head literally a couple of inches, it’s not quite as focused... I have the speakers toed-in (to align around a foot behind my head), but note the listening spot is close to a rear wall.

Also, music use-only, in a ‘family room’ that opens into to a kitchen diner. I have a separate AV set-up in the front room for movies.
 
Thanks for the suggestions!

The KEF R3 recommendation reminds me to say that one ‘problem’ I have with the current B&Ws that although the overall soundstage is quite wide, there is a very specific and narrow sweetspot where everything really clicks/is in focus 100%. If you move your head literally a couple of inches, it’s not quite as focused... I have the speakers toed-in (to align around a foot behind my head), but note the listening spot is close to a rear wall.

Also, music use-only, in a ‘family room’ that opens into to a kitchen diner. I have a separate AV set-up in the front room for movies.

There is very little to be done with a rear wall close behind the listening position.

Room correction makes it better. But all the RCs I’ve used (RP, ARC, Dirac and the AntiMode DualCore) all performed much better with the mlp at least four feet clear of the rear wall. It’s the killer position alas.

I assume it has something to do with the hardly at all distance attenuated reflections interfering with the direct waves.

It is possible to do a little with it by judicious use of absorbing material, but the maths is a bit difficult.

And it simply doesn’t work at all if you’re too close.
 
There is very little to be done with a rear wall close behind the listening position.

Room correction makes it better. But all the RCs I’ve used (RP, ARC, Dirac and the AntiMode DualCore) all performed much better with the mlp at least four feet clear of the rear wall. It’s the killer position alas.

I assume it has something to do with the hardly at all distance attenuated reflections interfering with the direct waves.

It is possible to do a little with it by judicious use of absorbing material, but the maths is a bit difficult.

And it simply doesn’t work at all if you’re too close.
A position that I suspect all too many people are in unfortunately. In many a UK lounge it simply isn’t realistic for your chair/sofa to be anywhere other than against a wall. My lounge is 4*4m.

I always found that being so close to the wall flattened the soundstage and boosted bass, muddling the midrange. Leaning even a foot forward made everything sound significantly better. Personally I found that RP made a marked improvement not only to the frequency response, but also to the perception of soundstage depth. If I lean forward now, there is only a slight improvement to soundstage depth.
 
A position that I suspect all too many people are in unfortunately. In many a UK lounge it simply isn’t realistic for your chair/sofa to be anywhere other than against a wall. My lounge is 4*4m.

I always found that being so close to the wall flattened the soundstage and boosted bass, muddling the midrange. Leaning even a foot forward made everything sound significantly better. Personally I found that RP made a marked improvement not only to the frequency response, but also to the perception of soundstage depth. If I lean forward now, there is only a slight improvement to soundstage depth.

Yep, agree with both observations: room sizes/layouts in the UK and leaning-in/forward sounding better.
And also that RoomPerfect improves matters significantly. In my case, bass blooming and definition in particular.
 
KEF R3. There's nothing they do wrong. You won't believe how loud and deep they go with the TDAI-1120.
Is it only a matter of time before they do an R3 Meta? Based on reviews, not personal experience, of the LS50 that could be a hell of a speaker!
 
Is it only a matter of time before they do an R3 Meta? Based on reviews, not personal experience, of the LS50 that could be a hell of a speaker!
It certainly is, but I wouldn't expect the R series to be next on the list for the adaption of MAT. Except for the new LS50 Meta collection (as they now call it) the updated R series is the latest addition to KEF's range. So I'd rather expect MAT to show up in the Reference series or even new Blades. These have had relatively long market life so far.

Just looking at the price, even the small Reference 1 looks like overkill for the TDAI-1120. But I'd still love to here this combination. Even more so with a MAT tweeter and next gen. Uni-Q ...
 
Thanks for the suggestions!

The KEF R3 recommendation reminds me to say that one ‘problem’ I have with the current B&Ws that although the overall soundstage is quite wide, there is a very specific and narrow sweetspot where everything really clicks/is in focus 100%. If you move your head literally a couple of inches, it’s not quite as focused... I have the speakers toed-in (to align around a foot behind my head), but note the listening spot is close to a rear wall.

Also, music use-only, in a ‘family room’ that opens into to a kitchen diner. I have a separate AV set-up in the front room for movies.
The UniQ design of the KEFs gives a very wide dispersion and they are very good off axis. They are capable of a wide 'sweetspot'.
 
Took delivery of a new unit today, all set up with 98% RoomPerfect and breathing new life into my crusty KEF Q7s (I'd echo the opinion above about the UniQ's wide sweetspot) and REL Strata 5, which have never sounded better. I'm also experiencing a few issues I hope someone can help me with.

1) I'm currently trying to get the Lyngdorf to play nicely with my Arcam AVR550 in home theater mode. I have done as others suggest and set fronts to large, centre and rears to small, and subwoofer to none, so all below 80Hz info + LFE finds its way to the sub via the Lyngdorf. This works fine. Due to the low voltage from the Arcam's pre-out, however, I'm having to set the analogue sensitivity on the Lyngdorf to 18db to match the levels of the centre and surrounds. In connecting the two units via good quality Chord interconnects, I seem to have created a new ground loop that I've isolated to the TV aerial into the wall - it stops altogether if I remove the cable from the wall but is very noticeable with an 18db gain on top. All my devices are plugged into the same multi-socket, and the aerial cable itself seems of good quality, so I'm not sure what to do about this. Any ideas?

2) It's not crucial to my enjoyment, but I'd like to keep a light touch of Dirac on the centre and surrounds. Does anyone with this type of setup know how to turn off Dirac on the fronts entirely so that their EQ is exclusively RoomPerfect?

3) Ok so this one is super niche. I have a PS5 that is connected directly to my LG C9 to take advantage of HDMI 2.1. It feeds audio back to the AVR550 via ARC, which has always worked fine for me. Because the Arcam doesn't support eARC, I have to set the PS5 to output Bitstream (DD or DTS) rather than Linear PCM to get 5.1. This worked with the Arcam on its own, but now I've brought the Lyngdorf into the equation, it only wants to output stereo. I can't quite work it out, but I suspect it's because the Arcam can't do both jobs of converting the Bitstream to analogue and isolating the FL / FR analogue signals at the same time to send them back to the Lyngdorf. I can of course get full Linear PCM 5.1 if I connect the PS5 to the Arcam, but because its ports are only HDMI 2.0b, there are some picture limitations (albeit ones that aren't that noticeable to me right now). So unless anyone can see a way around this, I'll take best sound over best picture for now.
 
Just another update on my 1120 experience - especially for those that have made helpful suggestions previously.

To be honest I have been pretty underwhelmed with the results I have been getting from this new amp - yes, the bass integration is excellent (far better result than with my antimode which, of course, only tamed the sub as a separate entity) but I was just not getting the wow factor and it was all sounding a bit lifeless and non-musical compared to my previous Rega Brio.

I tried various configurations of crossovers (or none for the mains), filter slopes and various toe-ins for the mains - some gave a slight improvement whilst others were pretty dire! So much so, that I have been putting off further tweaks for a few days and considering the "moving on" of the Lyngdorf and going back to my previous system!

I had a few free hours today so I thought I would have another go and decided to move the Aria 926s again. Only sideways 50mm on either side - increasing the speaker spacing by about 100mm - thinking that's not going to do much. Then I concentrated again on the toe-in and found a setting I was happy with for the sound stage width as well as the centre vocals - which can be a problem in my room - I think the slightly asymmetric left side wall can cause a problem - there is an under-stair alcove adjoining the L/H corner of the front wall so the speakers are not equidistant from the side walls.

I also moved my MLP chair back by about 250mm - can't go too far as I would not be able to reach my beer on the coffee table! Entered the new measurements to the transducers and did an RP calibration.

The calibration completed - 98% in 7 readings (I did a couple of extra ones just as "belt and braces").

So, with minimal expectations, I sat down and played some music - and, I am very pleased to say, this time it did actually PLAY SOME MUSIC! Hooray!

I think I have finally got it - sound-stage, depth, dynamics, vocals, timing, energy and MUSICAL. I put on some Cat Stevens tracks which sounded excellent on my old system but terribly dull and lifeless on the Lyngdorf hitherto - WOW, absolutely immersive and superb definition of his voice and all the instruments etc.

But, I kept feeling there was something not quite right, almost an occasional "out of phase effect" but could not really understand exactly what was going on.

Still had a very enjoyable couple of hours playing some favourite tracks - some sounded quite different (enjoyably so), presumably without the effects of the room having such an influence on the sound - and it does go loud without you realising - the Brio had an ear discomfort limit which I could not exceed, this one will go much, much louder so be careful.

Then, shortly before I had to power down to resume normal domestic routines :D I decided to check my measurements, just in case. Ah, I had somehow made an error on the sub distance so the system thought it was about 120mm further away than it actually was!

I have now entered the correct value and had a quick listen - the peculiar "phase" effect has now disappeared, I think, but the overall sound seems to be the same, thankfully.

Presumably I will now need to re-calibrate with RP - I just hope that does not muck it all up again. That will have to wait until tomorrow (oops, today, I just looked at the clock).

So the moral of all this, as far as I am concerned, is the much touted "stick your speakers tight on the front wall and your sub in the middle (or corner in my case) - run RP and your good to go" is absolute small sphericals!

As I have discovered, you can realise the potential with an awful lot of tweaking, trial an error and, hopefully, logical thought processes!

At this moment in time I am very hopeful that I might have a Rega Brio, CA CXN and Antimode 8033S II going spare, but I am not going to get the boxes out of the loft just yet!
 
Took delivery of a new unit today, all set up with 98% RoomPerfect and breathing new life into my crusty KEF Q7s (I'd echo the opinion above about the UniQ's wide sweetspot) and REL Strata 5, which have never sounded better. I'm also experiencing a few issues I hope someone can help me with.

1) I'm currently trying to get the Lyngdorf to play nicely with my Arcam AVR550 in home theater mode. I have done as others suggest and set fronts to large, centre and rears to small, and subwoofer to none, so all below 80Hz info + LFE finds its way to the sub via the Lyngdorf. This works fine. Due to the low voltage from the Arcam's pre-out, however, I'm having to set the analogue sensitivity on the Lyngdorf to 18db to match the levels of the centre and surrounds. In connecting the two units via good quality Chord interconnects, I seem to have created a new ground loop that I've isolated to the TV aerial into the wall - it stops altogether if I remove the cable from the wall but is very noticeable with an 18db gain on top. All my devices are plugged into the same multi-socket, and the aerial cable itself seems of good quality, so I'm not sure what to do about this. Any ideas?

2) It's not crucial to my enjoyment, but I'd like to keep a light touch of Dirac on the centre and surrounds. Does anyone with this type of setup know how to turn off Dirac on the fronts entirely so that their EQ is exclusively RoomPerfect?

3) Ok so this one is super niche. I have a PS5 that is connected directly to my LG C9 to take advantage of HDMI 2.1. It feeds audio back to the AVR550 via ARC, which has always worked fine for me. Because the Arcam doesn't support eARC, I have to set the PS5 to output Bitstream (DD or DTS) rather than Linear PCM to get 5.1. This worked with the Arcam on its own, but now I've brought the Lyngdorf into the equation, it only wants to output stereo. I can't quite work it out, but I suspect it's because the Arcam can't do both jobs of converting the Bitstream to analogue and isolating the FL / FR analogue signals at the same time to send them back to the Lyngdorf. I can of course get full Linear PCM 5.1 if I connect the PS5 to the Arcam, but because its ports are only HDMI 2.0b, there are some picture limitations (albeit ones that aren't that noticeable to me right now). So unless anyone can see a way around this, I'll take best sound over best picture for now.
For the ground loop, do you have any other interconnects you can try? Although I don’t particularly understand it, I think if the interconnect has a screen which is connected to the plugs at both ends, than can allow the ground loop to occur. An unscreened interconnect or one where the screen is floating at one end may resolve the issue. It’s got nothing to do with quality, it’s all about electrical paths to ground.

With Dirac, yes, you should find that in the main target curve screen the speakers are split out into groups. I think on mine by default it’s FL/R, C, SL/SR and Sub. So you should be able to select just FL/FR and deselect the others and remove any correction, then flip it around and apply whatever target curve you want to the others.

If you haven’t done a Dirac calibration for a while then it could be worth downloading the latest software and doing that. Take the measurements with RP applied on the 1120.

The last problem is very odd. It should make no difference whatsoever to the Arcam whether it’s driving a pair of speakers from its own speaker terminals, or via the pre-outs and an external power amp. In fact I’m not sure how it even knows the difference. I would just double check the sound format setting on TV and amp in case something got changed in all the swapping things about. It almost sounds like the TV is set to output stereo PCM.
 
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Presumably I will now need to re-calibrate with RP - I just hope that does not muck it all up again.

I don’t think you do. The whole point of you entering distances is because RP doesn‘t measure them. So when it’s emitting the constant test tone, a few MS misalignment between subs and mains shouldn‘t be audible to the mic as they’re essentially outputting the same constant thing.
So the moral of all this, as far as I am concerned, is the much touted "stick your speakers tight on the front wall and your sub in the middle (or corner in my case) - run RP and your good to go" is absolute small sphericals!
To be fair that advice seems to work in most situations, and I read someone else’s experience on the forum recently which was the exact opposite to yours (was underwhelmed after keeping speakers in original ’best’ position, tried pushing up against the wall and was blown away by the improvement). It does go to show there’s no ’one size fits all’ where it comes to Hi-Fi and it’s worth experimenting to see what works best for your system, your room and your ears.
 
@woodbar - you should recalibrate. You can just measure a new focus position. Easy to switch back if you don’t like it as much.
 
Took delivery of a new unit today, all set up with 98% RoomPerfect and breathing new life into my crusty KEF Q7s (I'd echo the opinion above about the UniQ's wide sweetspot) and REL Strata 5, which have never sounded better. I'm also experiencing a few issues I hope someone can help me with.

1) I'm currently trying to get the Lyngdorf to play nicely with my Arcam AVR550 in home theater mode. I have done as others suggest and set fronts to large, centre and rears to small, and subwoofer to none, so all below 80Hz info + LFE finds its way to the sub via the Lyngdorf. This works fine. Due to the low voltage from the Arcam's pre-out, however, I'm having to set the analogue sensitivity on the Lyngdorf to 18db to match the levels of the centre and surrounds. In connecting the two units via good quality Chord interconnects, I seem to have created a new ground loop that I've isolated to the TV aerial into the wall - it stops altogether if I remove the cable from the wall but is very noticeable with an 18db gain on top. All my devices are plugged into the same multi-socket, and the aerial cable itself seems of good quality, so I'm not sure what to do about this. Any ideas?

2) It's not crucial to my enjoyment, but I'd like to keep a light touch of Dirac on the centre and surrounds. Does anyone with this type of setup know how to turn off Dirac on the fronts entirely so that their EQ is exclusively RoomPerfect?

3) Ok so this one is super niche. I have a PS5 that is connected directly to my LG C9 to take advantage of HDMI 2.1. It feeds audio back to the AVR550 via ARC, which has always worked fine for me. Because the Arcam doesn't support eARC, I have to set the PS5 to output Bitstream (DD or DTS) rather than Linear PCM to get 5.1. This worked with the Arcam on its own, but now I've brought the Lyngdorf into the equation, it only wants to output stereo. I can't quite work it out, but I suspect it's because the Arcam can't do both jobs of converting the Bitstream to analogue and isolating the FL / FR analogue signals at the same time to send them back to the Lyngdorf. I can of course get full Linear PCM 5.1 if I connect the PS5 to the Arcam, but because its ports are only HDMI 2.0b, there are some picture limitations (albeit ones that aren't that noticeable to me right now). So unless anyone can see a way around this, I'll take best sound over best picture for now.

I currently have my Arcam AVR850 connected to my Lyngdorf TDAi-3400 in a similar fashion to you and using Chord interconnects. As you rightly state, the relatively low output from the Arcam pre-amps necessitates an increase in the analogue input sensitivity of the Lyngdorfs. On the 3400, I had to increase mine to +10dB. I also have all my equipment connected to a Belkin multi-socket device.

1. I don't have my aerial currently connected to my TV as I don't need it, but I did try it when I got my new TV and didn't encounter any hum issues, so not sure what is causing the ground loop issue in your case. I'm guessing that you don't have Virgin or Sky and are only using Freeview. Is that correct?
Must you use the aerial?

2. I tried Dirac in combination with RP but really didn't like it. I suspect the combination of two entirely different RC systems causes all manner of phase issues. I don't believe that you can switch off any channels in the way that you can with Denon units, but I'm happy to be educated otherwise. To be honest, I've been perfectly happy with the sound I get with just RP and Dirac switched off completely on my Arcam. I cross over at 80Hz, so bass related issues on all speakers are realistically handled by RP any way.

3. Doesn't sound right to me. I wouldn't expect the Lyngdorf to have any negative effects on what sound modes you can use. However as I'm not a gamer, I can't help with that one. Sorry.

Hope this helps.
 
. I don't have my aerial currently connected to my TV as I don't need it, but I did try it when I got my new TV and didn't encounter any hum issues, so not sure what is causing the ground loop issue in your case. I'm guessing that you don't have Virgin or Sky and are only using Freeview. Is that correct?
Must you use the aerial?
@Matt V I'm not are why I didn't think of it originally, but Steve just reminded me, that you can get an in-line ground loop isolator for your aerial cable.

Amazon product ASIN B002MQJQG4
You can probably find one for the right socket types or buy adaptors.
 
@woodbar, good to hear that you've made progress. I doubt there is any RC software out there where you can just plonk things down and get great results. You need to position things as best as possible in the space allowed. For example, Lyngdorf say that you should put your speakers as close to the front wall as possible to get the best results. I've heard this work very well in demos, but in my room with my speakers, it doesn't sound as good as when my speakers are 30 cm away from the front wall. So "rules" are meant to be broken. :)

Moving your speakers and MLP (Focus) has likely just changed your frequency response slightly, likely resulting in removing a null or two, giving RP more to work with. Have you tried the room simulation included with REW? If not, it might be worth trying it to see what basic layout gives the best looking bass response before running RP.

Once you settle on the distances you want, it's probably best to re-run RP completely (save your current settings first though to ensure you can go back to them if necessary). That way you can be sure of a "clean set up".

Just my thoughts based on personal experience and from the results others have achieved.
 
I currently have my Arcam AVR850 connected to my Lyngdorf TDAi-3400 in a similar fashion to you and using Chord interconnects. As you rightly state, the relatively low output from the Arcam pre-amps necessitates an increase in the analogue input sensitivity of the Lyngdorfs. On the 3400, I had to increase mine to +10dB. I also have all my equipment connected to a Belkin multi-socket device.

1. I don't have my aerial currently connected to my TV as I don't need it, but I did try it when I got my new TV and didn't encounter any hum issues, so not sure what is causing the ground loop issue in your case. I'm guessing that you don't have Virgin or Sky and are only using Freeview. Is that correct?
Must you use the aerial?

2. I tried Dirac in combination with RP but really didn't like it. I suspect the combination of two entirely different RC systems causes all manner of phase issues. I don't believe that you can switch off any channels in the way that you can with Denon units, but I'm happy to be educated otherwise. To be honest, I've been perfectly happy with the sound I get with just RP and Dirac switched off completely on my Arcam. I cross over at 80Hz, so bass related issues on all speakers are realistically handled by RP any way.

3. Doesn't sound right to me. I wouldn't expect the Lyngdorf to have any negative effects on what sound modes you can use. However as I'm not a gamer, I can't help with that one. Sorry.

Hope this helps.

Can I ask do you have the upgraded analogue input upgrade and is the Arcam feeding into that? I just wondered if that would make any difference to feeding the standard analogue input.
The reason I’m asking is that I have an Arcam AVR550 and considering the 2170 or 3400 and wondered if this upgrade would be at all beneficial for feed an avr into?
 
Can I ask do you have the upgraded analogue input upgrade and is the Arcam feeding into that? I just wondered if that would make any difference to feeding the standard analogue input.
The reason I’m asking is that I have an Arcam AVR550 and considering the 2170 or 3400 and wondered if this upgrade would be at all beneficial for feed an avr into?

Just the standard analogue input on my 3400 as the upgraded one is really for a turntable as far as I know and I no longer have one. Only upgrade on my 3400 is the HDMI module.
 
Just the standard analogue input on my 3400 as the upgraded one is really for a turntable as far as I know and I no longer have one. Only upgrade on my 3400 is the HDMI module.

Ok thanks.

If anyone else reading this can confirm that the analogue upgrade is only really a benefit for a turntable that would be great as I don’t have one either.
 
Ok thanks.

If anyone else reading this can confirm that the analogue upgrade is only really a benefit for a turntable that would be great as I don’t have one either.

Reach out to Rob Sinden at Gecko (UK distributor). He will know for sure.
 

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