New Epson 4k Lasers

panman40

Distinguished Member
Short update.

1: I'm just watching in a living room environment on a matt white 177cm wide screen. With a short throw....it is bright. I am running 55% power and it's 200NITS peak white.lol I might look see if i can get a filter of some sort to knock it down.

2: At this brightness i still think the Epson tone mapping is not great. Of course i am spoilt with the Lumagen i use but there is a massive difference in image quality using the Radiance...

3: The CMS is useless imho.

4: Greyscale and gamma dial in well with on board tools but i've tweaked with the Radiance i use.

5: Motion....well, now having spent time with this thing i agree that 24fps handling is not as good as my old HD350. If you turn on the motion processing of the LS11000 its much more watcheable (low)...until some 50Hz content comes along at which point it's hideous and is much better turned off.

I don't have time to grab any pics of measurements i'm afraid as i'm a bit busy but i thought i ought to chuck something out there to add to this thread....
Sounds like all that brightness would of been great for 3D!
 

Luminated67

Distinguished Member
Short update.

1: I'm just watching in a living room environment on a matt white 177cm wide screen. With a short throw....it is bright. I am running 55% power and it's 200NITS peak white.lol I might look see if i can get a filter of some sort to knock it down.
This is a tiny screen size, isn’t that just about 80”? Have you any idea as to what a 9400 would be putting out in Nits on that screen so as we have a rough gauge.
2: At this brightness i still think the Epson tone mapping is not great. Of course i am spoilt with the Lumagen i use but there is a massive difference in image quality using the Radiance...
I remember the Lumagen when you were over, amazing piece of kit 😍
3: The CMS is useless imho.

4: Greyscale and gamma dial in well with on board tools but i've tweaked with the Radiance i use.
Is it more adjustable than the 9400?
5: Motion....well, now having spent time with this thing i agree that 24fps handling is not as good as my old HD350. If you turn on the motion processing of the LS11000 its much more watcheable (low)...until some 50Hz content comes along at which point it's hideous and is much better turned off.
Again compared to the 9400 because I get the feeling most purchases will come from existing Epson customers.
I don't have time to grab any pics of measurements i'm afraid as i'm a bit busy but i thought i ought to chuck something out there to add to this thread....
Thanks
 

alebonau

Distinguished Member
good to see the above... cant open the 2nd link due to google translate not liking the cookies and sending in a loop...

interesting mention of measurements in the first link...

Screen Shot 2021-11-30 at 6.31.55 pm.png
Screen Shot 2021-11-30 at 6.31.04 pm.png

no surprise to see blue going way off with the laser epson...

after calibration it hits it appears the laser is behind the lamp ?

strange choice comparing with the sony 290Es ... why not the jvc n5 :D that would have been an interesting comparison in calibrated lumens...

otherwise looks like the sony bests this for contrast and "sharpness" which i think the reviewer confuses for detail ? certainly we get the same fire engine screen shot ... talking off smoother picture from the new eshift.
 

Luminated67

Distinguished Member
Second result translated to english
0CBE60DF-B392-47A8-BDDA-1E35C527CF33.jpeg
4BF0E1D6-D503-46D2-B5F9-C69E1893AE77.jpeg
4E1E9073-84FC-453B-8C7C-5B63EB8EBFFB.jpeg
E5AF9E4F-985E-4851-B892-26C5698AC533.jpeg
C1860A5E-C661-420E-B28F-2E7F61E4E29B.jpeg
F43972C5-7BDD-4862-8D6E-1E1E16FB815E.jpeg
05AF225F-8DE0-49A5-8F7C-E3A55EB1C195.jpeg
F5375221-640B-4DF7-ACA5-1D5C1E47B9A7.jpeg

ls11000_farbraum.jpg

A004E7A0-2225-41E2-8781-FD13062D81C9.jpeg
C8D371AB-E62D-49EC-A3DD-2E530E4B52EF.jpeg

ausschnitt.jpg

Why is the image from the Epson askew compared to the original, most odd and surely would have some effect on image quality?
C76EAEC4-FFCC-43CA-B643-40783BB6DAC8.jpeg
3CED12D8-5468-461A-BC13-B0C700D195BF.jpeg
23945E4E-44FD-496B-A1E6-412C58D35C5A.jpeg

I think I have them in the right order LOL
 
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Harold88

Member
strange choice comparing with the sony 290Es ...

From what I read so far I belive that the guys from heimkino have a prefference for Sony.

For those who want a living room laser projector, there is hardly any reason to buy a DLP anymore. If the prices settle down a bit, projectors like LG 810 or JVC NZ3, will probably remain on the dealer's shelf as they can't compete even with LS 11000 in contrast and black levels let alone LS 12000.
 
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Luminated67

Distinguished Member
From what I read so far I belive that the guys from heimkino have a prefference for Sony.

For those who want a living room laser projector, there is hardly any reason to buy a DLP anymore. If the prices settle down a bit, projectors like LG 810 or JVC NZ3, will probably remain on the dealer's shelf as they can't compete even with LS 11000 in contrast and black levels let alone LS 12000.
Also you are forgetting the most obvious reason for getting either of the two LS models, their game console handling capabilities.
 

Luminated67

Distinguished Member

IWC Dopplel

Distinguished Member
Looking at the results of the 11,000 it looks like a living room, not cinema room PJ. The contrast is very low, given the old LS calibrated is near 25k, (some showed lower results) I don't think the 12,000 will in any way compare to the old 10,000 or 10,500 PJ's
 

Alaric

Well-known Member
after calibration it hits it appears the laser is behind the lamp ?

Maybe. Depending on the settings used on both PJs and what you want to compromise from a calibration. I mean if you compare the filter mode of the 9400 it will be far less bright but more accurate and if you use natural then the Epson will be brighter, but probably less accurate.
Dynamic to Dynamic would be interesting, but you have a green or blue cast with those.


strange choice comparing with the sony 290Es ... why not the jvc n5 :D that would have been an interesting comparison in calibrated lumens...

otherwise looks like the sony bests this for contrast and "sharpness" which i think the reviewer confuses for detail ? certainly we get the same fire engine screen shot ... talking off smoother picture from the new eshift.

There's lots of comparison to the 9400 there, which is probably it's biggest competition. Maybe they had a Sony and that is more comparable and they didn't have a JVC....and even if they did, showing the JVC best it, is probably not that useful - Also bare in mind this is the LS11000 and the LS12000 is far closer to a home cinema projector.....they keep talking about sports and a light living room set-up - Which may well be what normal people want.

I still don't feel that these LS range projectors are aimed at the Home Cinema geek, but the wider mass market living room and gaming sector!
 

Ram84

Standard Member
long time lurker, will wait to see the outcome of the LS12000 reviews but i am starting to think this is not the projector for me. Think i will purchase the 9400 for now and upgrade in the next year or two to something else
 

SamAVR

Standard Member
long time lurker, will wait to see the outcome of the LS12000 reviews but i am starting to think this is not the projector for me. Think i will purchase the 9400 for now and upgrade in the next year or two to something else

I'm getting to the same place.
 

Ram84

Standard Member
I'm getting to the same place.
it’s not a terrible place to be in if i’m honest, i am coming from a w1070 so most projectors are a upgrade and the extra saving will reinvest it in dropping my ceiling and maybe looking to do a atmos setup. Might even get a OLED 65 inch as well so i can cover the gaming aspect i was looking for in my next projector.
 

Alaric

Well-known Member

TW9400W - so white, wifi (meh, use cable for 4k, HDR, 60Hz), low hours and warranty!
Looks like a bit of a steal to my mind at £1600
Essex
 

Triggaaar

Distinguished Member

TW9400W - so white, wifi (meh, use cable for 4k, HDR, 60Hz), low hours and warranty!
Looks like a bit of a steal to my mind at £1600
Essex
Or buy an LS10500 which is probably better than the LS12000:
 

Luminated67

Distinguished Member
long time lurker, will wait to see the outcome of the LS12000 reviews but i am starting to think this is not the projector for me. Think i will purchase the 9400 for now and upgrade in the next year or two to something else
I think those considering the 9400 or one of these new ones really needs to wait for some reviews to surface about the LS12000, the 11000 is clearly not geared for a dedicated room and even in a normal living room with an ALR screen it's blacks will be no where near the 9400. One hopeful thing mentioned in the last review was the laser dinning seems to be very good so here's hoping with the extra native contrast of the 12000 it should prove to be very effective.
 

Luminated67

Distinguished Member
Or buy an LS10500 which is probably better than the LS12000:
Why on earth did Epson not bring us an updated version of the LS10500 :facepalm:, if there is one bit of feed back they take from the launch of these two models was this comment.
 

Alaric

Well-known Member
Or buy an LS10500 which is probably better than the LS12000:

I've pondered that one a couple of times. But it is almost twice the price, older, no warranty and less bright, so there's a trade off for the contrast and laser.

Also the people above said they were considering the 9400, hence the post at all!
 

Thatsnotmynaim

Distinguished Member
Or dare I say, this :-
 

Triggaaar

Distinguished Member
I've pondered that one a couple of times. But it is almost twice the price, older, no warranty and less bright, so there's a trade off for the contrast and laser.
If your screen is too big for it, then yeah, the lack of brightness is a big issue, but if it's not then that doesn't matter. Good point on the warranty, I didn't realise the 9400 had so much. I wouldn't worry about the age, they don't seem to go wrong much. If the 9400 is in budget and all you need, I think it's a great choice, but I wouldn't want one as a stepping stone - if you know you'll later upgrade, it's not really worth the hassle (only my opinion of course).
 

Luminated67

Distinguished Member
That's what we all wanted, but as said previously on the thread, the technology was probably too expensive.
Or maybe Epson didn't want to venture into that higher price bracket once more, especially if it hadn't native 4K.
 

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