New and rather complicated system advice

[MikeyT]

Hey all,

Initally Kudos on the site and info given on here, I've been reading info from here for ages but I need some advice as I can't find the answers to the following.

I need to sort the following system out for my brother and am a little unsure which is the best solution. What he's looking for is that each room has just a very descrete I.R. receiver at each screen (13 in total) and all source equipment is to be located in a cooled cabinet hidden away.

4 HD inputs (x2 V+ boxes, PS3, Blue Ray) and 13 outputs. As mentioned he wants them to be completely switchable via I.R.

I'm also installing (I'm a telecoms engineer)

RG6 aerial to all
Internet connections
SONOS in each room
Some gaming equipment (also installed in aforementioned cupboard)

I need advice on the following

What is the best way of acheiving the switchable HD distribution system?
What is the best I.R. solution?
Which are the recommended baluns?

I've told him that this is not going to be cheap and he's told me that he's willing to spend "whats needed to sort it".

Any and all advice would be greatly appreciated as i'm a little stuck

Thanks all

 

[dj-dulux]

As you are doing this for someone else you need to be very careful, agree the exact functionality and expectations at the start. Don't assume anything, don't let your brother assume anything. Also be prepared for fault finding, sorting out equipment features (such as control over HDMI), general HDMI issues, audio routing etc.

I need to sort the following system out for my brother and am a little unsure which is the best solution. What he's looking for is that each room has just a very descrete I.R. receiver at each screen (13 in total) and all source equipment is to be located in a cooled cabinet hidden away.

Why IR, if the rooms are small then this is likely to be acceptable. Once you get over 3m distances or from multiple angles IR control my not be the solution.

4 HD inputs (x2 V+ boxes, PS3, Blue Ray) and 13 outputs. As mentioned he wants them to be completely switchable via I.R.

Can be done over HDMI and analogue. Pros and Cons to both methods. Do you have any surround sound zones?

RG6 aerial to all
Internet connections
SONOS in each room
Some gaming equipment (also installed in aforementioned cupboard)

Use WF100, better option for domestic and the connectors all fit. 2 to each TV location. Minimum or 2 Cat5e of each TV location.

What is the best way of acheiving the switchable HD distribution system?
What is the best I.R. solution?
Which are the recommended baluns?

Won't be cheap and the system will likely get more complex as his ideas change. Every installer will have favorites, no one system is perfect and most need experience to get them to work as the customer wants.


Feel free to get in touch, I would strongly recommend you employ the services of a pro to design and commission at least, will save you a huge headache...

Dupe...

 

[vex]

Agree with everything that DJ has said.

Also gaming machines from the central location can be difficult to do, most stuff is BlueTooth controlled now which is ok locally, but once you get any further than a couple of walls you start to have problems.

Also Wii and any of the new eye based machines like 360 Konnect and the PS3 Move also need a high speed USB connection to communicate back to the main machine.

With matrixes, I install HDBaseT stuff now, it is the only benchmarked solution that has an industry standard behind it. 4 x 13 is a tough combination, realistically you will be looking at a 4 or 8 input and 8 or 16 output system.

It might be worth considering breaking it down to a 4x8 HD matrix and then the kids bedrooms etc using a standard coax distribution system.

HTH

V.

 

[MikeyT]

Thanks for the info!

"As you are doing this for someone else you need to be very careful, agree the exact functionality and expectations at the start. Don't assume anything, don't let your brother assume anything. Also be prepared for fault finding, sorting out equipment features (such as control over HDMI), general HDMI issues, audio routing etc."

Couldn't agree more!! I hate it when people try and use phrases such as 'future-proof' for things like this. What I have said is that I will take the initial request, hopefully fulfil it and agree with him what it can, and moreover, can't do, then it's down to him. To be honest he's a sound guy and as such this shouldn't be much of an issue.

"Why IR, if the rooms are small then this is likely to be acceptable. Once you get over 3m distances or from multiple angles IR control my not be the solution."

Basically he's wanting just to have one (or multipul) IR receiver(s) in each room and have full control over the equipment i.e. be able switch V+ boxes (individually) and blue ray. In the first instance and before looking at getting more complex remotes he's after being able to use the OEM remotes in front of each screen/in each room - obviously with him wanting x2 V+ boxes they will have the same IR package and will need to be split so I believe an I.R. system is the best solution - happy to take advice mind ;-)

"Can be done over HDMI and analogue. Pros and Cons to both methods. Do you have any surround sound zones? "

Looking at using CAT6 Baluns as opposed to HDMI (I know they're essentially the same thing/Functionality) this would cover the HD 'feed' to the TV from the source(s). Surround sound zones, he's happy in the first instance to use the speakers from the screens (?) but is also incorperating a SONOS system for audio control/zones. This is going to be hardwired and is going to be in each room. so the SONOS system will have to be connected for audio control.

"Won't be cheap and the system will likely get more complex as his ideas change. Every installer will have favorites, no one system is perfect and most need experience to get them to work as the customer wants.

Feel free to get in touch, I would strongly recommend you employ the services of a pro to design and commission at least, will save you a huge headache...

Dupe... "

Thanks Dupe, I've told him that this is not going to be cheap, he's perpared for this. I'm still looking for hardware advice regarding the HD distribution, and I.R. systems. I'm reasonably prepared for a headache to be honest.

"Agree with everything that DJ has said.

Also gaming machines from the central location can be difficult to do, most stuff is BlueTooth controlled now which is ok locally, but once you get any further than a couple of walls you start to have problems.

Also Wii and any of the new eye based machines like 360 Konnect and the PS3 Move also need a high speed USB connection to communicate back to the main machine.

With matrixes, I install HDBaseT stuff now, it is the only benchmarked solution that has an industry standard behind it. 4 x 13 is a tough combination, realistically you will be looking at a 4 or 8 input and 8 or 16 output system.

It might be worth considering breaking it down to a 4x8 HD matrix and then the kids bedrooms etc using a standard coax distribution system."

Thanks Vex, i'll have a look at the HDBaseT stuff, if he needs to buy an amp with additional outputs then so be it, at the end of the day I've told him that this 'request' is a little awkward and over-the-top but he will not be told, he wants what he wants. I mentioned about running some rooms in SD via coax (as it's going in anyway for the FTA freeview) but he's not interested, he wants all the rooms to be the same "if i'm getting you to put a system in I want the one I want" I think were his exact words.

 

[Linx08]

Sounds like another candidate for Control 4 to me.

Linx

 

[vex]

he's not interested, he wants all the rooms to be the same "if i'm getting you to put a system in I want the one I want" I think were his exact words.

Do you think he would still be interested when the RRP hardware cost for a 8 x 16 HD Video matrix and receivers come in at around £15K?

You then have 13 Zone of Sonos, at around £10 - £13K

Then there is the cable and racks and labour to put it in.

That were we find most people rethink their ideas.

V.

Just trying to help you understand and manage you 'clients' expectations, and welcolme you to our world of I want it all but I want to pay nothing for it.

 

[MikeyT]

Unsure to be honest, until I have some figures/ideas to produce for him then I'm not going to know. Personally and like I said before to me this system is overkill but it's obviously subjective, one man's idea of genius is anothers madness.

I am still unable to quantify any of this as I can not see any suppliers figures on hardware (and to be honest still unsure as to what is the best solution). I know that he's aware of the SONOS pricing as he's already bought all of that kit. Again for me the sticking point is the ir and the hd switch.

Any and all suggestions on hardware would be greatly recieved so I can give him numbers.

Thanks for all of your help thus far!!!

 

[Linx08]

Ping me a PM with your contact details and we can have a chat, several ideas and can give you an idea on pricing.

Linx