1. Join Now

    AVForums.com uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

New 3803 questions

Discussion in 'AV Receivers & Amplifiers' started by SixWhippys, Jun 19, 2003.

  1. SixWhippys

    SixWhippys
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    I’ve seen a couple of messages posted in previous threads that the timbre of a Denon 3803 should improve after a burning in period. Can anyone (e.g. Kramer) confirm that this did indeed happen?

    I ask because my new 3803 is definitely lacking in the bass department. I’ve got it at the factory defaults with bass turned right up and it’s got nothing of the warmth that my fronts have when being driven by the external speaker output of my old TV.

    Note I haven’t done any setting up yet because as far as I can see this has to be done via the OSD, and this needs a component connection into the TV… and until I get my new 42pw23 next week I haven’t got component input.

    Oh, one other thing: I bought it from Unbeatable – ordered Tuesday afternoon, delivered Wed lunchtime. Excellent, couldn’t ask for better service.

    The only nagging thing is that I’m sure the box had been previously opened – the polystyrene bits were broken (and taped back together), and the white plastic wrap stuff was ripped and looked like it had been undone and then hastily put back on and secured with masking tape, and plastic bag holding the manual and remote was also masking taped.

    Now, the amp itself is unmarked and appears to be working fine. It’s just the thought that I’ve spent 680 quid on something that has for one reason or another possibly been returned. In my position would you be worried / complain?
     
  2. chris

    chris
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2000
    Messages:
    1,216
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    51
    Location:
    romney marsh, kent, uk
    Ratings:
    +28
    I'd say, ring unbeatable and tell them the situation......tell them you have a prob with it and would like a replacement.

    Mine is ok and has been since it came out the box.
    You do not need a component connection to get the OSD it works in S-vid and i think composite (i have mine on s-vid).

    Apart from the channel levels, all my settings are default and i get enough bass out of my 602's, with music.
     
  3. Merritt

    Merritt
    Member

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2003
    Messages:
    262
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    21
    Location:
    Hampshire
    Ratings:
    +1
    Before you go and panic - have you checked the speaker setup for large/small speakers etc. Note that 'large' or 'small' does not mean the size of the speaker but it does change the crossover frequency. If it is currently set to small - the amp will be filtering alot of the bass off as it is expecting to send it to a sub)

    Regarding the OSD - do you not have SVideo out on the back of the amp? I have the AVC11SR and that does but im not sure about the 3803. If it has Svid out - you can use that in the mean time?

    If all else fails, take a look in the manual and see what the default settings are for the speaker size. This could well be the issue

    Steve
     
  4. Zor

    Zor
    Standard Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2003
    Messages:
    185
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    19
    Location:
    Cheshire
    Ratings:
    +0
    I think the default out of the box is
    large on the fronts
    small on centre
    Sub yes
    rears small

    Hope that helps.
    Had mine a couple of days and still tweaking!
     
  5. SixWhippys

    SixWhippys
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Thanks for the replies folks.

    Firstly, I should have read the manual a bit more closely - of course you can connect the OSD via s-vid, so I've borrowed the s-vid cable running from my htpc to the TV.

    I've had a play and ended up with the following:

    Large fronts, centre, rears
    Sub yes
    Crossover 80Hz
    Bass +10db

    It now sounds pretty good - I'd still like the midtones and bass stronger but the clarity is excellent.

    When I can afford it I'll get some decent speakers as I'm sure that's where the problem lies: I've got Eltax Silverados and an Eltax Sub 8. Nuff said I think.

    Now onto a Zone 2 conumdrum in a new thread...
     
  6. vdeknock

    vdeknock
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    I did not notice any burn-in period. Sounded great from day one.

    To get better bass you need to set the fronts to small. It has nothing to do with the size of your speaker. Setting to small will move all the below 80hZ to the sub and give you the bass you are looking for. This can also be adjusted for the different sound formats. ie direct stereo you can just use your front speakers if you so choose. Enter the menu when in that sound format

    The OSD will also work on composite/S-vid/Component. With component the change in volume is not displayed on the TV if turned on, unless I have not set something up correctly.

    Enjoy!
     
  7. blue73

    blue73
    Standard Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2003
    Messages:
    113
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    21
    Location:
    Manchester, UK
    Ratings:
    +1
    Sound is amazing,
    My Dad is an acoustics Engineer, Its all Science and Maths, But it is really very interesting when he talks of space or certain materials having an effect on frequencies. It really is crazy how when you are in your "listening room" But your direct neighbours dont hear anything upsetting but a couple of doors down they are mad for killin someone. It isnt really "sound" though Its Frequency. You may just be "used to hearin" a certain kind of sound but really its the Frequency or SPL that really has an effect. God sorry if that sounds daft but it is 3:27 sunday mornin
    Any thing that can move air in a convincin manner and make you want to cry or dance is amazin...
    I'am not even sure if any of that makes any sence but......Ahhhhhhh Bollo''@s:D
     
  8. SixWhippys

    SixWhippys
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    blue73, that's a pretty good stream of consciousness for three thirty on a sunday morning!

    You're dead right - we're not just dealing with physics but psychology, and we all perceive things differently.

    Right now I've got a huge grin on my face because I just love the sound my 3803 is now making (is it my imagination, or has it got "warmer" over the past couple of days? Not sure, but I've turned the subwoofer down a tad), but when I ask my wife what she thinks she just says "yeah, it's fine". By her own admission she just doesn't hear the surround effects, doesn't appreciate the quality of the sound, and her general comment is that it sounds loud and boomy. But it sounds like it does at the cinema, I say. Yes, she says, but this is our living room...

    You can't win 'em all!
     
  9. vdeknock

    vdeknock
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    That is always the way - My wife just complains it is too loud. But I had some of our friends (husband and wife) over and she was totally impressed. Saying this is so much better than the cimena you can really hear the effects. My wife is still coughing at the amount of money I have spend on a stereo..........But the 3803 is a very sweet beast as far as I am concerned.
     
  10. mick23

    mick23
    Standard Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2002
    Messages:
    801
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    uk
    Ratings:
    +2
    six whippys you do not say what speakers you have, i have 3802 and cdm1nts, the cdms are a bit bass light,

    i often use denons tuner on the radio station magic, speakers small +sub, although i do not always have sub "powered up"
    and normally use direct mode.

    i used 3802 and thought there seemed to be very little bass/midrange and set to sterio and bass controls to bass +8 and left 3802 running and went out and returned 5 hours later amp was on low volume about -46db.

    i then found bass/midrange had improved quite a bit ,and could return amp to direct mode.

    the 3802 definately sounds better once it is really (warmed up)
    as regards bass/midrange from speakers.

    as regards dvd replay or cd using the 3802 from cold it is not so noticibly.
     
  11. ReTrO

    ReTrO
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2000
    Messages:
    3,506
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    71
    Location:
    High Wycombe, Bucks, UK
    Ratings:
    +59
    You should not need to have the bass set to +10db, to get a decnt response. It should give a good output with all the tone/EQ controls set to the 0 point, and then maybe benefit from a little tweaking.

    At +0db bass on my system at home, with JMLabs 710 floorstanders only, the bass is more than adaquete. +10db sounds aweful and boomy.
     
  12. SixWhippys

    SixWhippys
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Speakers are Eltax Sliverados and Eltax Sub 8. (Ok, I own up - I was on a tight budget, and that was before I blew up my AVR-1602 in May!)

    After demise of the 1602, I plugged the fronts directly into the TV. With bass turned up on the TV the Silverados sounded rich and resonant - so much so that I didn’t miss the subwoofer. This makes me think that the speakers are capable of delivering the bass and midrange but perhaps they take a bit of driving?

    On the basis that the large/small, LFE/LFE+Main and crossover settings control the bass contributions of the speakers and subwoofer, I experimented with these settings with the subwoofer turned right down. e.g. I was expecting to hear the bass reduce as I increased the crossover. However, the difference was negligible leading me to think that the speakers just weren't sensitive to the bass and midrange signals being sent from the amp.

    That all being said, with the current settings (cited earlier in the thread plus LFE+Main) I'm sure that either my ears have adjusted or the amp is sounding less bright - watching Stigmata on Beeb1 Saturday night was superb (just how does PLII know how to send the sound effects to the back?), as was Pearl Harbor on Sky on Sunday.

    Also, I'm pleased to say, I haven't got to have the amp turned up anywhere near max to get room filling sound (as was the case with the 1602), and hence it isn’t running at egg-frying temperatures.

    So I’m a happy bunny… and I am, let’s say, setting expectations about changing the speakers in a couple of years once we’ve finished paying for the 3803 and the new TV being delivered on Thurs!
     
  13. mivvi

    mivvi
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Have just ordered my 3803 from unbeatable and can't wait to receive it. After reading your reviews here, I think I made the right choice in the end. Am planning on getting B+W 600 series speakers but ain't made up my mind which ones yet. Am going to look at a REL sub today, a friend of mine works in the factory 6 miles away from where I live, gets them super cheap £150. I hope it all works well together though? Thanks for the reviews, has set my mind at rest....
     
  14. SixWhippys

    SixWhippys
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    mivvi, excellent - I'm sure you'll be really pleased with it.

    Unbeatable were astonishingly fast in getting mine to me, so I'm sure you won't have to wait long. (It'll be interesting to see if yours is packed a little more neatly than mine was - though my amp is absolutely fine, so I'm not bothering to get it replaced.)

    The speakers you're considering sound far more up market than mine - enjoy!

    Now I'm sitting here waiting for Mr Toshiba to show up with my 42" rear pro sometime this afternoon...
     
  15. mivvi

    mivvi
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Hi Six Whippys,
    Have been waiting 5 days now for my amp. They must have put you on priority, ha,ha.

    Yea the speakers I want sound the bizz, but wanting and having are completly different things. Will have to see how the bank balance looks in a few weeks time.

    I will let you know how well packaged it is, when it turns up!

    Cheers.....
     
  16. markbuffyfan

    markbuffyfan
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    mmm re the fact that your spekers sounded warmer through the tv amp.This because the amp in the tc was having to work harder in order to drive the speakers and dare i say it was probably introducing distortion in to the signal that you may have heard as warmth infact the only warmth you are really hearing is the heat as your amp in the tv slowly fries itself to death. Did you also chechk the ohm rating on the tv's amp my bet it was something like 16 aside and you were probably powering it with 6 ohm speakers also producing a harder working amp and a enhanced mid .This is what creates the pwr ammp distortion in traditional guitar amps as they overload the sound thickens up to the point of distorsion, I am just about to treade up from my 3802 some either a 3803 or an onkyo so i can get mu delay sorted from the plasma but thats another story.Most amps should be set flat without any significant eq and then tweaked to personal taste with 1odb of bass boost in there it must be boomy and your local cinema is too .No offence mate but invest in some new speakers it will get the wife off your back i promise you it did with mine.

    cheers

    mark
     
  17. SixWhippys

    SixWhippys
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Hey Mark, when I've paid off the loan for the TV and Amp I reckon that I will indeed get some better speakers.

    Til then, I'm pretty happy with what I've got - and even my wife was saying last night it doesn't sound too bad... praise indeed!
     
  18. markbuffyfan

    markbuffyfan
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    hey whippy
    if the wifes happy we are all happy m8 bugger the speakers if it saves on the eardrops
     

Share This Page

Loading...