Question Netflix Panasonic Oled App more superior picture than 4K disc on Xbox, why?

Scoutfinch

Novice Member
Dear Readers,

I need a fix for playing 4K source material through my Xbox One S, as it is displaying more inferior 4K picture quality in comparison to both my 2018 Panasonic FZ802 OLED TV's inbuilt Netflix TV app and the Xbox Netflix app.

To explain: the quality of the picture on my Xbox is reduced somewhat for the same film source when comparing it to the TV's own Netflix app.

I used a direct comparison of the newly released 4K Bladerunner 2049 Netflix v the 4K disc I own and the app was much better.

Any explanation why there is a difference would be most welcome, given all the settings are the same and the Xbox settings are correct (4K/HDR/24hz options on) and the console is directly connected by a recent HDMI cable?

Thanks
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
The Xbox has been critisised for this in the past compared to a designated UHD Blu-Ray player, you can see the details of why here:
In short, its because of poorer chroma picture processing. But it will be the same with built in apps, possibly even worse.
 

Scoutfinch

Novice Member
Thanks Dodgeexander very much.

I expected a picture quality difference, but not that stark (or where the disc was more inferior to the streaming service given the higher bitrate), especially given the bunch of firmware updates and following tweaks MS have made over the last couple of years:

I did note when I did a comparison with a 1080P bluray source film (Inception) with that on Netflix was there was very little in it. If anything, there were more highlight details in the 1080p bluray disc. It may well be a HDR issue then as highlighted in the HDTV video.

I guess what those 4K player comparative print or video reviews do not compare in their analysis is the respective leading player brand 4k disc picture quality source with the same film/programme on a streaming service like Netflix. That will really tell you how good a 4K player is surely, otherwise why pay for discs (especially when many 4K discs are similar in picture quality to the bluray due to the transfer quality)?

Based on these findings. Does this really mean that I need to spend in the high hundreds to get a player like the Oppo, Pioneer and Panasonic or would I get similar or more superior picture quality to the inbuilt Netflix and other apps even with a relatively budget Panasonic or Sony player e.g. £150-£250 range compared to the Xbox and more importantly, when compared to a streaming service picture?

Many thanks
 

THX1138UK

Active Member
Dear Readers,

I need a fix for playing 4K source material through my Xbox One S, as it is displaying more inferior 4K picture quality in comparison to both my 2018 Panasonic FZ802 OLED TV's inbuilt Netflix TV app and the Xbox Netflix app.

To explain: the quality of the picture on my Xbox is reduced somewhat for the same film source when comparing it to the TV's own Netflix app.

I used a direct comparison of the newly released 4K Bladerunner 2049 Netflix v the 4K disc I own and the app was much better.

Any explanation why there is a difference would be most welcome, given all the settings are the same and the Xbox settings are correct (4K/HDR/24hz options on) and the console is directly connected by a recent HDMI cable?

Thanks
Unfortunately, there are some chroma conversion bugs that haven’t been corrected.

Additionally, in the XBOX setting, make sure you are using Limited Colour 16-235 and not Full Range 0-255 mode. Limited is correct when using TV, rather than a PC monitor.

I find that the NetFlix App on the XBOX forces my TV into Dolby Vision mode all of the time. Which is wrong and looks horrible.

Regards,
James.
 

mushroomkid

Active Member
Damn I was planning on picking up a used Xbox one s for it's 4k drive (odd that the PS4 pro refresh didn't come with one) but I'm guessing I'll be throwing away my money?
 

THX1138UK

Active Member
Damn I was planning on picking up a used Xbox one s for it's 4k drive (odd that the PS4 pro refresh didn't come with one) but I'm guessing I'll be throwing away my money?
If not having Dolby Vision isn’t a show stopper for you, get a Panasonic DPUB320EBK stand-alone UHD Blu-ray player. You’ll find this a far better UHD movie experience than using an XBOX

If you hunt around online you can get one for £99. Superb value for money, and a very capable player. Also, it has all the popular Apps such as NetFlix built in. It doesn’t have WiFi - only an Ethernet Port. But you can always use a Powerline adapter if you don’t have wired Ethernet.


Regards,
James
 

Scoutfinch

Novice Member
Unfortunately, there are some chroma conversion bugs that haven’t been corrected.

Additionally, in the XBOX setting, make sure you are using Limited Colour 16-235 and not Full Range 0-255 mode. Limited is correct when using TV, rather than a PC monitor.

I find that the NetFlix App on the XBOX forces my TV into Dolby Vision mode all of the time. Which is wrong and looks horrible.

Regards,
James.
Thanks for your reply. I seem to have all the correct 4K settings as picked up and confirmed on the “4K details” info screen. However, I couldn’t see where you access those colour options. Please advise?
 

THX1138UK

Active Member
The option to set Full RGB or Limited is in the Colour Space menu.

It might seem odd that you want to 'limit' the colour, but it makes more sense if understand why it's like this (the terminology 'limited' makes it sounds liked your missing out on something, but you're not).

In the world of Television, black is represent by the value 16, and the brightest lumiance is represented by the value 235. It is possible to display "below black", but a proper standards compliant video will never have values below 16 in the signal. It's like this for historical reasons.
In video there's a luminance signal (black and white elements), and then a colour difference signal.

Sometimes video signals do have lumiance values above 235, and this is some manufacturers refer to this as 'super white' - but lets not go there, as it's not really an issue.

In the computer world, RGB is used, and the values are 0-255 (8 Bit) for Red, Green and Blue. There is no lumiance and colour difference signals like there is in the Television world.

If you connect your XBOX to a TV, the TV expects video lumiance levels, not PC lumiance levels. If you don't select the 'limited' mode on the XBOX, then you will suffer from 'black crush'.

A better name for 'limited' is Television Mode and a better name for Full RGB is is 'PC Monitor Mode'.
But we seem to be stuck with the poor and confusing terminology.


Regards,
James.
 

Scoutfinch

Novice Member
The option to set Full RGB or Limited is in the Colour Space menu.

It might seem odd that you want to 'limit' the colour, but it makes more sense if understand why it's like this (the terminology 'limited' makes it sounds liked your missing out on something, but you're not).

In the world of Television, black is represent by the value 16, and the brightest lumiance is represented by the value 235. It is possible to display "below black", but a proper standards compliant video will never have values below 16 in the signal. It's like this for historical reasons.
In video there's a luminance signal (black and white elements), and then a colour difference signal.

Sometimes video signals do have lumiance values above 235, and this is some manufacturers refer to this as 'super white' - but lets not go there, as it's not really an issue.

In the computer world, RGB is used, and the values are 0-255 (8 Bit) for Red, Green and Blue. There is no lumiance and colour difference signals like there is in the Television world.

If you connect your XBOX to a TV, the TV expects video lumiance levels, not PC lumiance levels. If you don't select the 'limited' mode on the XBOX, then you will suffer from 'black crush'.

A better name for 'limited' is Television Mode and a better name for Full RGB is is 'PC Monitor Mode'.
But we seem to be stuck with the poor and confusing terminology.


Regards,
James.
Cheers James. I found it - the Xbox Limited option on my FZ802 is noted as the "standard" recommended" default setting, there is no option for "RGB Limited' unless there is another click option I need to amend?
 
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