Negotiating new trade deals and closing the rift.

LX200GPS

Member
Whether they did or they didn't doesn't really alter the fact a healthy dose of spin was used to win a majority and that the likes of yourself and psikey are now trying to rewrite the narrative to infer they were given carte blanch to do what they wished, that's simply untrue
Don't all political parties spin? All part of the game of politics. Not trying to rewrite anything. Voted for the only Party who I thought would deliver Brexit. It's really that simple. So far I am happy with progress. I'm sorry you are struggling with this but I'm not going to waste any more time trying to convince you.
 

psikey

Distinguished Member
Don't all political parties spin? All part of the game of politics. Not trying to rewrite anything. Voted for the only Party who I thought would deliver Brexit. It's really that simple. So far I am happy with progress. I'm sorry you are struggling with this but I'm not going to waste any more time trying to convince you.
And we have had years of talking, EU don't want a deal without maintaining control of UK which is completely against what Brexit is. No re-writing the narrative. Its just you not accepting reality that majority didn't vote how you hoped.
 

LX200GPS

Member
To keep me company. Its like I'm one of the 300 against the Persian onslaught :eek:
Yep, I guess you know what it's like ploughing a lonely furrow? Was missing you and Bigfingers too much to stay away too long. :smashin:

EDIT: Also wanted an update on the bond markets after today's Brexit news!
 

psikey

Distinguished Member
Yep, I guess you know what it's like ploughing a lonely furrow? Was missing you and Bigfingers too much to stay away too long. :smashin:

EDIT: Also wanted an update on the bond markets after today's Brexit news!
I've been consumed chasing an RTX3080 down for last 3 weeks but had to pop in today since I got one yesterday and with EU dis'ing Boris on his No Deal threat.

So, have we had a visit by the Bond Market expert?
 

Panavision

Well-known Member
Wrong again. I have no hatred of the EU, I've clearly said multiple times over the years its about Democracy for me. I couldn't give a damn if we stay in or leave so long as its the choice of the British electorate. I was pro EU until I read more into the EU due to the upcoming referendum.

I do strongly believe the EU aim to be like US where all power ultimately resides with them. If that was what the UK people wanted then fine with me.

EU will not give us a Canada deal as they Have to punish us for daring to leave and must shackle us as a potential competitor and discourage others from wanting to leave. Its so obvious.

They are only your friends while your in their club.
You are right about us being a direct competitor, Barnier has said it himself. The only way to a Canada deal was if the UK left with May's deal.

I don't think it's about discouraging, because why would the EU allow non-EU countries to compromise their market?

U.S. are only our friends when they need us...

The bigger you are the more power you have. Simple.
 

psikey

Distinguished Member
You are right about us being a direct competitor, Barnier has said it himself. The only way to a Canada deal was if the UK left with May's deal.

I don't think it's about discouraging, because why would the EU allow non-EU countries to compromise their market?

U.S. are only our friends when they need us...

The bigger you are the more power you have. Simple.
But we are tiny and ruled nearly half the world! The world has obviously changed now.

Romans also had a good go at it :D

There are much bigger countries than us based on landmass and population yet we are still one of biggest economic and military powers. Don't sell us down.
 

LX200GPS

Member
I've been consumed chasing an RTX3080 down for last 3 weeks but had to pop in today since I got one yesterday and with EU dis'ing Boris on his No Deal threat.

So, have we had a visit by the Bond Market expert?
Ssshhhh! He was about a couple of pages back!
 

tapzilla2k

Distinguished Member
Ask and ye shall receive, Moody's has downgraded the UK credit rating a notch.
Moody's rationale is here, I know some will leap on the outlook stable part. But you have to look at the reasons given for the downgrade. It's a fairly stern rebuke of the trajectory of the UK Government in terms of brexit, weakening institutions and poor growth since 2016 when we lost our AAA status.

And the cliff notes UK credit rating downgraded by Moody's amid growth concerns
 

Rasczak

Distinguished Member
As per above, yesterday's little charade got the UK's credit rating downgraded. A clear reflection of the UK's debased position.
 

domtheone

Distinguished Member
No surprise. In or out. We have huge issues.
 

Nick74

Well-known Member
Ask and ye shall receive, Moody's has downgraded the UK credit rating a notch.
Moody's rationale is here, I know some will leap on the outlook stable part. But you have to look at the reasons given for the downgrade. It's a fairly stern rebuke of the trajectory of the UK Government in terms of brexit, weakening institutions and poor growth since 2016 when we lost our AAA status.

And the cliff notes UK credit rating downgraded by Moody's amid growth concerns
I suspect many who voted to leave won't care about this at all.

I've long since accepted that, for these people at least, no price is too high for perceived "freedom," even when, in practice, this means our rights, standards and freedoms are diminished. Johnson and Cummings' government will get its way in this regard, and we'll all be poorer for it.

They won. We lost. That's all that matters. I recall visiting the pub the weekend after the referendum, where I heard jubilant chants of "we beat the EU," as though it was a football match.

So it doesn't matter what happens to our economy, our human rights, our jobs, or anything else. It doesn't matter if Kent becomes one giant, county-wide lorry park. True believers will cling to Brexit no matter what the evidence. They will not be moved.
 

richp007

Distinguished Member
With regards to this Australia deal nonsense, sadly looks like some Brexiter's are excited by this rubbish. What they probably don't realise is Mongolia and Kyrgyzstan get better access to the EU than Australia (through the GSP).

Here's an explanation why it won't be anything like Australia.


(Australia are incidentally trying to renegotiate their position with the EU anyway).

So it's just WTO for us and big tariffs. There's nothing comparable whatsoever with Australia.

No deal will decimate some business and industry. Especially farming. Problems amongst other areas not trade related as well. At this point to anyone who has followed Brexit even just loosely this should be common knowledge.

And all that is before we get to the rubbish about a 'Canada' deal as well.
 

Nick74

Well-known Member
With regards to this Australia deal nonsense, sadly looks like some Brexiter's are excited by this rubbish. What they probably don't realise is Mongolia and Kyrgyzstan get better access to the EU than Australia (through the GSP).

Here's an explanation why it won't be anything like Australia.


(Australia are incidentally trying to renegotiate their position with the EU anyway).

So it's just WTO for us and big tariffs. There's nothing comparable whatsoever with Australia.

No deal will decimate some business and industry. Especially farming. Problems amongst other areas not trade related as well. At this point to anyone who has followed Brexit even just loosely this should be common knowledge.

And all that is before we get to the rubbish about a 'Canada' deal as well.
Yes, but as above this will not matter, it will not register, because Brexit isn't an evidence based movement. Like religions, the greater the evidence to the contrary, the more hardline believers' stance becomes.

There are common traits. When evidence doesn't support belief, they attack those presenting the evidence. When that evidence becomes overwhelming, it's decried as conspiracy and naysaying.

There's another common trait - over time, beliefs and demands lean further toward the extreme. It didn't take long for "the easiest trade deal in history," and "all the benefits of membership without the costs" to morph into "the only true Brexit is no deal."

I wonder, a decade from now, how many "Brexiteers" will admit to voting for all of this.
 

Rasczak

Distinguished Member
No surprise. In or out. We have huge issues.
We (the UK) certainly do. Interesting to note only we (the UK) were downgraded and not the major EU countries that would feel our no-deal exit most acutely - a good pointer to the disproportionate effect a 'no deal' would have.
 

richp007

Distinguished Member
We (the UK) certainly do. Interesting to note only we (the UK) were downgraded and not the major EU countries that would feel our no-deal exit most acutely - a good pointer to the disproportionate effect a 'no deal' would have.
Very good point. This notion that No Deal hurts the EU more than it hurts us needs to be put to bed.

It still hurts of course, but it's also very clear to those that matter with these things that the EU have prepared better. As I think tapzilla alluded to in an earlier post.
 

Nick74

Well-known Member
We (the UK) certainly do. Interesting to note only we (the UK) were downgraded and not the major EU countries that would feel our no-deal exit most acutely - a good pointer to the disproportionate effect a 'no deal' would have.
Yeah but they need us more than we need them. Did nobody explain this to Moody's?
 

Nick74

Well-known Member
Very good point. This notion that No Deal hurts the EU more than it hurts us needs to be put to bed.
The UK has grabbed the ball and screamed "I'm not playing anymore."

The EU response is "OK, we've got out own ball; we'll carry on playing, see you around."

We now sit mardily on the touchline calling them names for not letting us win 10-0.
 

richp007

Distinguished Member
The UK has grabbed the ball and screamed "I'm not playing anymore."

The EU response is "OK, we've got out own ball; we'll carry on playing, see you around."

We now sit mardily on the touchline calling them names for not letting us win 10-0.
Brexiter's also forgotten that the Labour manifesto that was derided so much didn't create as much of a deficit as the Tory manifesto with a No Deal. As was projected by the IFS.

And that was before Covid. I posted a few links in the other thread about the Covid effect now too.

No Deal is folly, only advocated by the likes of Nige, Tim Martin and Mark "where is he now?" Francois.

That should tell people all they need to know.
 

The latest video from AVForums

Podcast: Best Hi-Fi products of 2020, Plus Best of the Month for TV Shows & Movies

Latest News

Best Projectors of 2020 - Editor's Choice Awards
  • By Phil Hinton
  • Published
What's new on Sky and NOW TV UK for December 2020
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
PS5 vs. Xbox Series X: Which Next-Gen Console is Best?
  • By Rik Henderson
  • Published
Black Friday 2020: Best UK deals currently available
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
Top Bottom