NAD M10 + Sansui AU-717

dedero

Standard Member
Hey there!,

I would like to ask you some basic question here that I wasn't able to find in the corresponding NAD manual.

My idea is to buy a NAD M10 to use it also as music streamer for my lovely Sansui AU-717, I can see in the back of the device that there's a "pre-out" connection but the manual is not very clear for the purpose I want to use it:

"Use dual RCA-to-RCA cable to connect PRE-OUT to the corresponding analog audio input of compatible devices such as amplifiers, receivers or other applicable devices. This makes it possible to use the M10 as a pre-amplifier to such devices."

My question is, should I connect that NAD M10 RCA pre-out to the RCA in the Sansui's "power amp in" and use the Sansui as a standalone power amplifier or can I connect it, let's say to "aux" or "tuner" input?, because my idea is to keep using my Sansui's pre-amplifier, mainly because I want to keep using my vinyl player with the Sansui and I think the preamp of the Sansui is better than the NAD M10 one and I'm not sure if this can be used in the "aux" or "tuner" inputs..

Any hints will be appreciated!

Cheers,
Bruno
 

Ugg10

Distinguished Member
Looking at the manual the M10 has a permanently variable output on the pre-out terminals and can't be set to fixed.

Typically you would use a fixed output into the Sansui Aux/CD/Tuner line level inputs whcih therefore uses the Sansui preamp, or a variable output into the Power ASmp main input on the Sansui using the M10 preamp.

However, you can plug it into the aux etc. ports on the Sansui and raise the volume on the M10 until the volume out of the Sansui+speakers matches your other sources with the same volume setting on the Sansui note this volume and leave it fixed on the M10.

I would try both ways and see which sounds the best as the preamp circuits have more of an effect on sound character than the power amp settings.

So you have 3 options -
M10 on its own
M10 into Sansui Aux etc. with M10 at a set volume, use the Sansui to change volume
M10 into the Power Amp main in on the Sansui and use the M10 to control volume

Try each and let your ears decide.
 

dedero

Standard Member
Thanks a lot for your reply!

Yes, what you've suggested is something that I'm afraid I'll have to deal with in case I get a M10, I guess using the Sansui as power amp is not an option otherwise I will lose its preamp (phono for example)

It's a pity that the volume cannot be set to fixed but on the other hand the M10 is designed to be used by its own, otherwise I would need to go for a dedicated network streamer, if I decide to go for the M10 I would need to deal with the volume situation.

Thanks again!
 

Ugg10

Distinguished Member
If you have no plans to use the M10 as intended i.e. an integrated amp attached to speakers, then the Bluesound Node 2i will be plenty for you or there are the more expensive Cambridge CXN or 851N and the more minimalist Primare NP5 which will need your choice of DAC may provide the best sound for around £750 if buying new (£450 for the NP5 mk2 and £270 for the Topping E50 dac). Buying an M10 just as a streamer is a big waste of £ on all of the parts you would not be using.

Just a thought.
 

Helix Hifi

Well-known Member
Please google M10 first. Software, hardware problems. Display not working.

I would buy something else. Rotel RA 14MK2. Whether it supports pre out I don’t know. I believe it does however.

Then get the Node streamer.
 

dedero

Standard Member
Thanks a lot for the hints and recommendation guys, I would like to give you some more details about my desired setup:
The thing is I have an android box (nvidia shield pro) to see movies, series, netflix, etc etc and now it's connected via USB to a Cambridge Audio Dacmagic plus, this DAC is connected via Optical to an onkyo r-n855 receiver (which is by the way a very good price/performance receiver) so I listen my movies/series coming from the android box via the onkyo and then I have a Sansui AU-717 that I use for listening vinyls and my local hi-res music collection, so I use the android box to play the music, this is passing through the DAC which is connected via RCA to the Sansui, so even though I'm quite happy with this setup, I would like to simplify it a little bit to have a bit less things to deal with (like depending on having my TV on while playing music), what I've tried so far is to connect the line-out RCA connection of my Onkyo to my Sansui and listen music via network using DLNA but I'm not that happy with the audio quality.. for my ears the combination android box + DAC sounds WAY better in many ways.. in the past I've also built a Raspberry Pi network streamer with RCA connection to the Sansui but still.. nothing beat the android box + DAC configuration so far..

@Ugg10 I'm totally agree with the Cambridge CXN or 851N, I'm actually still considering them but in that case I would need an additional amplifier because I don't want to use my Sansui to watch movies/series or even listen internet radio (which I'm doing with my Onkyo now), those streamers are in my top priority list, I've checked the Primare NP5, which I can also connect to my actual DAC but it lacks of display and I don't want to rely on smartphone to control it, I like the display, physical buttons and remote control experience instead, but if I go for the M10 or Cambridge Audio EVO 75/150, it will replace my Onkyo and my DAC in a (hopefully) better quality and both integrated in one machine, otherwise if I go for the 100% streamer solution, I would need to add an additional amplifier or eventually a soundbar which I'm trying to avoid but I also consider it as a solution (soundbar + streamer + sansui)

@Helix Hifi That's a very good point I haven't been checking the problems with M10.. I was tempted for the BluOS and that lovely display in the M10 but now you make me think about it.. I've checked Rotel RA 14MK2 thanks to your recommendation and it looks promising even though it doesn't have so many streaming options like my actual Onkyo has and it pulled me back what I've just read in the manual regarding the pre-out:
"The amplifier has a set of preamp outputs labeled PRE OUT. The currently selected source input is available from this output. Typically the PRE OUT output is used to provide a signal to another integrated amplifier or power amplifier, which is used to drive remote speakers."
And I would like to have some fixed volume solution.. I've been checking few minutes ago the Lyngdorf TDAI-1120 but I have no idea what people's experience with it.. I didn't check that much but it has a huge amount of customization options which is very tempting, also for the price..

Any further suggestions are very welcome!

Cheers,
Bruno
 

Mark.Yudkin

Distinguished Member
My question is, should I connect that NAD M10 RCA pre-out to the RCA in the Sansui's "power amp in" and use the Sansui as a standalone power amplifier or can I connect it, let's say to "aux" or "tuner" input?, because my idea is to keep using my Sansui's pre-amplifier, mainly because I want to keep using my vinyl player with the Sansui and I think the preamp of the Sansui is better than the NAD M10 one and I'm not sure if this can be used in the "aux" or "tuner" inputs..
Wow! I scrapped my vintage (bought new in 1980) Sansui AU-417 15 years ago, as it was no longer performing to its original specification and couldn't be serviced. You have had amazingly good luck.

Technically there is nothing to prevent your using it as a power amplifier for the NAD. Set the "pre power switch" on the AU-417 to the separated position (probably using "direct coupled" mode). Connect the NAD to the power in inputs on the Sansui, the NAD will then control the volume.

To use the TT etc., through the Sansui, you need to connect the Sansui's tape rec to a line level input on the NAD. The Sansui will be the phono amp, but the NAD will act as the preamplifier, controlling the volume.

Unfortunately the "pre power switch" on the AU-717 is not the same as a modern HT bypass; moreover it's at the back making it hard to flick back and forth.
 

stevoknevo

Active Member
Thanks a lot for the hints and recommendation guys, I would like to give you some more details about my desired setup:
The thing is I have an android box (nvidia shield pro) to see movies, series, netflix, etc etc and now it's connected via USB to a Cambridge Audio Dacmagic plus, this DAC is connected via Optical to an onkyo r-n855 receiver (which is by the way a very good price/performance receiver) so I listen my movies/series coming from the android box via the onkyo and then I have a Sansui AU-717 that I use for listening vinyls and my local hi-res music collection, so I use the android box to play the music, this is passing through the DAC which is connected via RCA to the Sansui, so even though I'm quite happy with this setup, I would like to simplify it a little bit to have a bit less things to deal with (like depending on having my TV on while playing music), what I've tried so far is to connect the line-out RCA connection of my Onkyo to my Sansui and listen music via network using DLNA but I'm not that happy with the audio quality.. for my ears the combination android box + DAC sounds WAY better in many ways.. in the past I've also built a Raspberry Pi network streamer with RCA connection to the Sansui but still.. nothing beat the android box + DAC configuration so far..

@Ugg10 I'm totally agree with the Cambridge CXN or 851N, I'm actually still considering them but in that case I would need an additional amplifier because I don't want to use my Sansui to watch movies/series or even listen internet radio (which I'm doing with my Onkyo now), those streamers are in my top priority list, I've checked the Primare NP5, which I can also connect to my actual DAC but it lacks of display and I don't want to rely on smartphone to control it, I like the display, physical buttons and remote control experience instead, but if I go for the M10 or Cambridge Audio EVO 75/150, it will replace my Onkyo and my DAC in a (hopefully) better quality and both integrated in one machine, otherwise if I go for the 100% streamer solution, I would need to add an additional amplifier or eventually a soundbar which I'm trying to avoid but I also consider it as a solution (soundbar + streamer + sansui)

@Helix Hifi That's a very good point I haven't been checking the problems with M10.. I was tempted for the BluOS and that lovely display in the M10 but now you make me think about it.. I've checked Rotel RA 14MK2 thanks to your recommendation and it looks promising even though it doesn't have so many streaming options like my actual Onkyo has and it pulled me back what I've just read in the manual regarding the pre-out:
"The amplifier has a set of preamp outputs labeled PRE OUT. The currently selected source input is available from this output. Typically the PRE OUT output is used to provide a signal to another integrated amplifier or power amplifier, which is used to drive remote speakers."
And I would like to have some fixed volume solution.. I've been checking few minutes ago the Lyngdorf TDAI-1120 but I have no idea what people's experience with it.. I didn't check that much but it has a huge amount of customization options which is very tempting, also for the price..

Any further suggestions are very welcome!

Cheers,
Bruno
There's a 160+ page thread on the Lyngdorf on here - New Lyngdorf TDAI-1120 Streaming amp
It doesn't have the fancy screen of the NAD M10 though (and the M10 was quickly superceded by the M10 v2 due to issues) NAD have just released the C700 which is a 'slimmed' down M10 v2 - if you plan to connect to a Bluesound OS device via HDMI/optical to watch content then there's a lot of posts online saying it introduces latency that can't be countered as the minimum adjustment starts at 50ms - despite repeated requests from users on the Bluesound forum requesting a software update for the last couple of years they've been sanctimoniously gaslighted by the product manager. I was seriously considering buying the latest Powernode and had no intention of connecting it to a TV so it would never affect me, but the attitude from the Bluesound rep put me right off their products - https://support1.bluesound.com/hc/en-us/community/posts/360046724114-Lip-Sync-Node-2i-digital-out-
 

dedero

Standard Member
@Mark.Yudkin awesome hint! I didn't know about that.. great to know!, I really love my 717 it sounds amazing, I've bought it in 2017 for 300eur with a keeping in protection mode forever, I've checked and some caps were leaking so I've done a full recap with high end capacitors (ELNA, nichicon, panasonic and wima's) and the result is amazing, I would like to keep it forever but I don't want to use it for watching TV and keeping the 717 almost all day on listening internet radio and watching TV that's why I would like to consider a all-in-one network streamer and amplfier, the 417 is an amazing amplifier too!, I've recapped a 217 (my first project) and 2 x 317, the 317 is such an awesome amp too, it looks small but it sounds big

@stevoknevo thanks a lot for the info about the Lyngdorf, I've watched yesterday several reviews in youtube and a very good one with a deep dive into the features () and it has everything I wanted and even more, the chance of customizing some inputs is awesome and also the possibility of tunning the gain in the pre-out connection, such an amazing piece of audio, thanks to your recommendation I will directly go for the Lyngdorf, I stopped researching, thanks a lot for that
 

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