My set up - lots of advice needed :)

Sessen Ryu

Active Member
I have a builder/carpenter coming over to mount my plasma to the wall, and then build a false wall, like a false chimney (protruding from the middle of the wall) around the plasma, and install in-wall speakers into the plaster above the tv.

Below, I have done a quick aerial view of my front room, and also a proposed set up of the wall which will house the plasma and false wall (from the view of the sofa).

I'm hoping for advice and suggestions before I go ahead of what I am planning, as obviously it's going to be difficult to change later, - obviously i wont have the luxury of moving speakers around or adjusting the height of the tv.

As well as inviting any general comments you may have, I do have a number of questions:

1. In regards to mounting the speakers (M&K SW150) does it matter how deep I make the wall that they're mounted in?

2. Are there any risk of heat problems arising from back of the telly, being in this proposed false wall? Ie, do I need to ensure the wall is a certain depth, / ensure the tv is a certain distance from the wall to allow heat to escape, - or not really given that the false wall continues up to the ceiling (bearing in mind there is a speaker directly above it)?

3. Comments on speaker and tv placement. My reasoning is to keep the tv around eye level. Speakers top of the tv to keep sound reflections off the wooden floor.

4. Any acoustic measures I should consider, like sticking acoustic foam or whatever on the real wall behind the tv?

5. What are your thoughts on the placement of the surround side tripoles (probably will be MK M4Ts) ?

6. What are your thoughts on the placement of the surround backs, (they'll be on the floor behind the sofa facing the ceiling) shall I bother with them at all? Or, place them at each end of the sofa?

7. Just to check that there are no magnetic problems placing these speakers this close to the telly?

8. The plaster surrounding speakers, - does this need to be of a certain depth? I would like the Centre channel as close to the tv as possible, so the plaster immediately below the Centre speaker (above the tv) might get pretty shallow, - how little can I get away with to ensure a secure housing for the speaker?

My kit is:

LCR - M&K SW150
Rear Sides- MK tripoles (probably M4Ts)
Rear Backs - M&K K7s
Panasonic 65" ST50B plasma
Denon 4311 AVR
Sony BDP-350 (soon to be upgraded)
QED Silver anniversary cable

Many thanks for any help! :smashin: :smashin: :smashin:



 

logiciel

Moderator
My suggestions are that the front centre would be better below the TV, the front left and right need to be further apart, the surround backs aren't needed but if used need to be further apart, and that front highs would be better than them.
 

Gboardman1959

Active Member
I agree with Logi about the centre but it's not that critical with the MK inwalls as for the left and right speakers again it's not that critical if you look in the MK manual the placement for the front three is how you have them set up I've got a similar set up to you have a look at my build in the DIY section
Geoff
 
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Sessen Ryu

Active Member
Many thanks so far.

What is your reasoning for putting the centre near the floor? My reasoning is that I want to keep the L, R and C in line with each other is important to me, in order to gel the front sound stage. Putting them all close to the floor would increase sound reflection, no? And also, it would force me to house the TV quite high? I find a picture around eye level far more immersive. Also the sound dispersion from SW150s is quite big, so placement no *as* critical...

I have wondered about moving the L & R out.. - will consider that, although it would make the false wall even wider...

As for heights (or wides for that matter) - it comes down to aethestics... I have some K7s and some S85s, - but it's a case of how to house/mount them without them looking intrusive. I like the idea of a big sound coming from the tv wall with no speakers visible...

I'll have a look at your setup thanks Geoff.

Any comments on my other concerns would be great :)
 

tonyrees687

Well-known Member
I have the same size TV a VT30 65" and its wall mounted a little bit higher than you want yours to be. Mine is 75cms from the floor and I have no problems with the picture and my eyeline is about 1/3 up from the bottom of the screen and this allows me to have a centre speaker below the screen at nearly the right height. My centre is a Sonus Faber Dolmus and L&R are Sonus Faber Concertinos it gives my a great soundstage that gels nicely. I think if you have your speakers along the top of your TV you will be missing out on what these speakers can do. I would have centre below TV and L&R a little lower. Hey hope to see what youve done when youve done it. Good luck
 

Sessen Ryu

Active Member
Hmmmm - it's a tricky decision. I have read many comments stating that having the front LCR at the same height makes a significant difference for the better...., - hmmmmmm??

If you've managed to get our centre at nearly ear height, I would be tempted to keep the L & R also at the same level

Yes, will post pics when it's done :)
 

Gboardman1959

Active Member
Many thanks so far.

What is your reasoning for putting the centre near the floor? My reasoning is that I want to keep the L, R and C in line with each other is important to me, in order to gel the front sound stage. Putting them all close to the floor would increase sound reflection, no? And also, it would force me to house the TV quite high? I find a picture around eye level far more immersive. Also the sound dispersion from SW150s is quite big, so placement no *as* critical...

I have wondered about moving the L & R out.. - will consider that, although it would make the false wall even wider...

As for heights (or wides for that matter) - it comes down to aethestics... I have some K7s and some S85s, - but it's a case of how to house/mount them without them looking intrusive. I like the idea of a big sound coming from the tv wall with no speakers visible...

I'll have a look at your setup thanks Geoff.

Any comments on my other concerns would be great :)
Can't really disagree with anything you have said it really comes down to aethestics and for me having the front array below the TV looks better
 

tonyrees687

Well-known Member
Hmmmm - it's a tricky decision. I have read many comments stating that having the front LCR at the same height makes a significant difference for the better...., - hmmmmmm??

If you've managed to get our centre at nearly ear height, I would be tempted to keep the L & R also at the same level

Yes, will post pics when it's done :)
The LCR in an ideal world would be all the same height ,but above the TV at your height your thinking of would not be great. I would have them lower for a better sound. To listen to the speakers that are above the TV you would have to be standing up to hear them at their best. I would compromise a little. TV higher, centre speaker below and the L&R tweeters at ear level. When its all done you wont even notice the layout of the speakers for aesthetic purposes.
 

tonyrees687

Well-known Member
Can't really disagree with anything you have said it really comes down to aethestics and for me having the front array below the TV looks better
Sorry to jump the thred.
Mr Gboardman you have had your Plasma calibrated. Its something I have been wanting to do for a while, was you pleased with the results.
Regards Tony
 

Gboardman1959

Active Member
I find that the single most important thing when doing builds like this is to get the TV at the right height i've seen plenty of builds where the TV is set to high there is nothing worse
 

tonyrees687

Well-known Member
+1 on this I know some TVs are above fireplaces and things like that for a purpose but if you can go lower then all the better. Mine is 75cm from the floor and all ok but 60cm for me would be perfect.
 

logiciel

Moderator
What is your reasoning for putting the centre near the floor?
Putting them all close to the floor would increase sound reflection, no? And also, it would force me to house the TV quite high?
I have wondered about moving the L & R out
I actually have my centre above the TV, but the TV is not as big as yours and above that would be too high imho.
I don't get the point about reflection, it wouldn't have to be too close to the floor, and it needn't push the TV higher.
You do need some space between the left and right front but with such a wide TV you might be OK as they are.
Having front highs rather than back surrounds would also make their separation less important.
 
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Sessen Ryu

Active Member
Sound reflecting off the floor will muddy the sound somewhat. In my plan above the tv is 40cm from the floor. Sw150 needs to be upright and is 28 cm tall. My skirting is 12cm high plus I need wall above and below the speaker so it would push up the tv.

When I used to have a crt, my centre always sounded better on top of the telly than below.
 

logiciel

Moderator
My carpet couldn't reflect anything but I don't know what surfaces do reflect audio, so that concern could be valid.
Yes, speaker on top of TV used to be normal, and my current one at 42cmW x 15cmH on a shelf above the 46" TV now is fine, but it just seemed that the extra height of your TV might push that taller speaker up too high to give a natural effect - as of sounds coming from the screen.
Having my front left and right at a lower level than the centre improves that natural effect.
It's less logical but the high fronts seem to have the same sort of effect.
Are there any others of your original points that you'd like to repeat for answering?
 
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Sessen Ryu

Active Member
I have solid oak flooring, I believe that will cause some reflection, - I plan to get a rug to cover of the floor however. Sound reflections will cause the same sound to be echoed a milsecond later, it wont sound like an "echo" as such, it will just muddy the clarity a touch, - and some of these americans a hard to understand at the best of times, as a lot of them tend to have this sort of laid back mumbling style about their speech :D

Yes, that's the problem isn't it, the extra height of my tv. It seems that either way is a compromise :(

I think the only way to truely know is try and use some props to stand the speakers on now, to get an idea of what it sounds like. I have been told that placement of these inwalls isn't critical because they're designed to be in flexible, unlike the S-150s for eg which are very fussy.
 

Sessen Ryu

Active Member
Are there any others of your original points that you'd like to repeat for answering?
Thanks, - yes, a few actually :D


1. In regards to mounting the speakers (M&K SW150) does it matter how deep I make the wall that they're mounted in?

2. Are there any risk of heat problems arising from back of the telly, being in this proposed false wall? Ie, do I need to ensure the wall is a certain depth, / ensure the tv is a certain distance from the wall to allow heat to escape, - or not really given that the false wall continues up to the ceiling (bearing in mind there is a speaker directly above it)?


4. Any acoustic measures I should consider, like sticking acoustic foam or whatever on the real wall behind the tv?

5. What are your thoughts on the placement of the surround side tripoles (probably will be MK M4Ts) ?

6. What are your thoughts on the placement of the surround backs, (they'll be on the floor behind the sofa facing the ceiling) shall I bother with them at all? Or, place them at each end of the sofa?

7. Just to check that there are no magnetic problems placing these speakers this close to the telly?

8. The plaster surrounding speakers, - does this need to be of a certain depth? I would like the Centre channel as close to the tv as possible, so the plaster immediately below the Centre speaker (above the tv) might get pretty shallow, - how little can I get away with to ensure a secure housing for the speaker?
 

logiciel

Moderator
The rug would help with the reflections as well as adding comfort.;)
However it does like it will have to be centre above TV, but something like my system of having that but the front lefts and rights lower would help towards that compromise.
The problem we used to have with speakers too close to TVs has gone, but your l/r would still be too close for me.
Much the same applies to heat problems, but I'm still always reluctant to enclose anything at all.
My note "the surround backs aren't needed but if used need to be further apart" remains.
 
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