Monitor Audio GR10

Discussion in 'Home Cinema Speakers' started by DMT, Mar 20, 2006.

  1. DMT

    DMT
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    I have a Pioneer AX4AVi Amp with Pio 868 + Arcam CD82
    Speakers are currently 6 x B&W VM1 + REL Q150E
    I am contemplating a pair of GR10's + Centre to replace the front soundstage.

    Questions:
    Is my Pioneer amp good enough to warrant these speakers?
    Is it better to Bi-amp and therefore give up my centre rear?
    Can they be placed directly onto a cabinet (I know stands are better but room does not allow)
    Is there a mini stand that could work sited on a small low level cabinet?

    Thanks for reading.
     
  2. phillfyspoon

    phillfyspoon
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    The gr10 is a good hifi speaker and should be matched to a good hifi amp to get the best out of them

    There will be an improvement in soundstage and detail and being the gr10 can be had cheap it is a good upgrade
     
  3. DMT

    DMT
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    Thanks for the reply, if they are going to be an improvement i will purchase then upgrade the amp and room later.

    Do you have an opinion on the Bi-amping. I can do this but will then lose my centre rear; they should also offer an amplifier that can bi amp the centre speaker also!
     
  4. David77

    David77
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    I'll use this thread instead of creating a new gr10 thread.

    I'm getting the gr10s next week secondhand and need an amp that will go well with them.
    From what I've read so far on here the MF A3.5 or A5 is a great amp for them but they're out of my price range. Would a cheaper MF amp like the X-A2 or X-150 be any good? I listen to mainly metal music at medium volume.
     
  5. Knyght_byte

    Knyght_byte
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    DMT, i would definitely recommend biamping the GR10's from an AV amp to help get better grip and control of them.....however, they are a very good quality and open sounding speaker, i would suggest you also get the matching GLCR centre speaker too so you are not left with a front soundstage in movies that may lack cohesion.......

    but definitely in the future upgrade by getting a decent quality stereo amplifier (which you feed by the pre-outs of the av amp when watching movies), tbh you really need to be looking at £800 and above as a rough guide, these speakers can note improvement in sound with amps costing up to £4k, so spend as much as you can afford, or get a stereo amp that allows you to biamp at a later date so split the cost over time....

    David77, tbh if you like metal, altho it sounds different, it has similar principles to classical music, especially in the dynamic swings that happen, which are what can tax an amp and speaker the most.......tbh the X-150 is the bare minimum these speakers should be fed by, and i do mean bare minimum.......tbh i'd suggest you have a hunt around for a second hand A3.5, or save up or use a 12 month interest free deal in a shop and get a new A3.5....

    you might wanna check out Primares offering around the £750 mark as well, but tbh i think it might just sell these speakes a little short......

    they are not the easiest to drive and if you like your metal turned up loud on the odd occasion, you really do need an amp that can supply its quoted wattage in a continuous way, not just a peak way, the MF A series manage that, the X-150 will struggle a little more, it will do well in quality of sound, but turning things up to let rip could well tell in harshness or hardness of sound, which with metal could well overdo the effect....(altho nowadays i listen to classical more, i used to be a heavy metaller a few years ago so i'm well aware of what it should sound like and the way it can be affected)........there are other amps worth looking in to, but i'd definitely suggest keeping the MF's in mind.......you could always buy the X-150 now, and then in the future look out for a pair of monoblocs going cheap secondhand....
     
  6. andye2004

    andye2004
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    David77,

    I demo'd a pair of GR20's today with a 3.5 and it was a simply awsome match up. I know these are bigger speakers than the GR10's but if yo can get hold of a 3.5 I am sure you will not be disappointed. I'm sure an A5 would be even better.
     
  7. David77

    David77
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    I've decided to get the X-150 as I can get that now.

    What are they then? Sorry, I'm new at this game.
     
  8. Knyght_byte

    Knyght_byte
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    monoblocs are power amps, except its just one amp in each monobloc, so one monobloc powers the left speaker and the other powers the right speakers.....imagine a normal power amp cut in half........it will usually improve the sound because as you know with stereo each speaker is getting its own signal and one speaker might replay sounds that the other speaker isnt, which means each speaker is drawing a different amount of current from the amp, in a single box amp this means a single power supply is having to cope with two amplifier windings drawing different amounts, if you split it over two boxes, yes it means needing to two mains plugs instead of one, but it means each box has its own power supply inside, so the power supplies are only taxed by the speaker they supply, not by both speakers.......hope that makes sense?...heh

    basically it should mean a better sound anyhow...just more mains plugs in the wall is all...

    far as i remember the X-150 has pre-out terminals for power amps/biamping......if it does then you want, when funds allow, to keep an eye out for MF monobloc power amps (sorry, cant remember the models, check the MF website) going cheap secondhand.....i think they are 200watt ones, but i might be wrong.....

    anyhow, the X-150 should hopefully satisfy you for a while to come anyhow :)
     
  9. David77

    David77
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    Wow you know your stuff!

    At the moment I listen to music with Wharfedale 9.1s, Yamaha 1400 receiver and a Toshiba Sd-9000 dvd player so I'm sure I'll be blown away by the GR10s and the X-150.:thumbsup:

    Btw would it be good to use a subwoofer with the GR10s as I've just bought a BK XLS200?
     
  10. Knyght_byte

    Knyght_byte
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    iirc the BK only has low level inputs? so you can only use it if you are running the GR10's on the av amp and have them set to small (altho no doubt your receiver allows you to set them at say 60hz which i would definitely do, if not 50 or 40hz).......

    if you get the X-150, unless i'm much mistaken you wont be able to use them with the sub...not unless you run your source thru the avamp first via pre-outs to the X-150 then on to the GR10's, but if you do that then you lose a little in quality tbh.......

    i am quite happy using my GR10's on their own most of the time, only high level wiring my REL Strata 5 sub to the MF A5 for stuff like dance/r'n'b/hiphop, or organ music.....ie music where you know there is lots of true sub bass notes lurking around...heh

    edit: if the BK does have high level inputs then your laughing, use the low level inputs for the av amp and surround sound, then use teh high level input from the X-150 for stereo performance......high level is basically a speaker cable type connection from the same terminals on the X-150 that connect to your speakers.....the BK manual if it allows this should explain high level connection....
     
  11. Crustyloafer

    Crustyloafer
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    Not quite I'm afraid Knyght_byte. The BK XLS200 has both low level and high level connections, however it is not designed correctly for both to be used simultaneously. The reason for this is that it is not possible to have the sub's crossover active on the high level input, say at about 50Hz for the GR10s, whilst simultaneously having it bypassed on the low level input for connection to the AV receiver's own filtered signal. The BK XLS200's crossover is active all the time on both inputs so if you set it to it's maximum setting in order to effectively bypass it for use with an AV receiver which applies it's own crossover then the crossover setting will be too high to blend in properly with the mmain speakers when used with the high levle connection. Conversely, if you set the crossover on the subwoofer to a point at which it blends in seamlessly with the main speakers on the high level connection, ie about 50Hz, then this will then lose all signals between 50Hz and 80Hz (the normal crossover frequency on an AV Receiver) sent to it on the low level connection. You could if you have the option set the cross over on the AV recevier to a lower setting that the 50Hz set on the subwoofer, however that is likely to put far too high a strain on the rest of the speakers.
     
  12. David77

    David77
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    Well I don't mind changing the crossover point manually each time so I'll connect with high level too. Also my speakers are'nt that close or parallel to a wall so I think using the sub would be a good idea.
     
  13. Pufz

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    MF`s X-A200 monoblocs are what you need..

    They are going for around the £400.00 - £500.00 mark on ebay at the mo for a pair.

    If you can get your hands on an X-A2, all the better.

    You can then (i think..) use this as a pre-amp when you upgrade.

    The X-A2 come in 2 versions - remote controlled, or not.

    The square X series, which I think the X-150 is part of, didn`t seem to receive the high reviews that the original round X series did. In fact, there is one person I know, actually sold all of his new square X series and bought second hand round X series...

    I have an MF X-P100 pre-amp, a pair of X-A200`s, X-ray Cd player, coming out into a pair of MA GS20`s.... The result is stunning.

    The A5 (which my brother has just recently purchased) is a step up again, but at the cost of £1500.00 and another £1500.00 for the cd player, it`s a hefty whack. But throw in the MA GS20`s with this pair and you really do have perfection.


    Happy buying.
     
  14. David77

    David77
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    How much would a secondhand MF A3.5 or A5 be?
     
  15. andye2004

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    Not sure about second hand as I haven'y seen any, but I did see the A5 ex demo today for £1150. I thought that was a good price.

    It was here http://www.pjhifi.co.uk/pj/special_offers.asp
     
  16. Knyght_byte

    Knyght_byte
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    at £1,500 the A5 is staggering value far as i'm concerned sitting here listening to it atm..heh

    but if you can pick an A5 up for under £1,200 do!

    A3.5 you might get for around £700 if lucky.....but they such nice amps i doubt many owners will be selling them on just yet...heh


    btw Crusty, i was thinking of the SVS PB10 last night, got me forum favourites mixed up...heh, the PB10 only does low level doesnt it?........*goes and runs and hides from the BK and SVS fanatics in case they wanna beat him up for daring to mix them up....*

    altho BK's Gemini allows simultaneous connection and use doesnt it?

    s'why i like my Strata 5, in the room i use it in its perfect size and i can have it hooked up to the av amp for movies and m/channel audio, but also up to the A5 for stereo listening....class bit of kit, pricey but worth it in my opinion (based against other subs i have heard, still yet to come across a BK or SVS so i happily withold comparative judgement against those for the meanwhile)
     
  17. David77

    David77
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    Right I've decided I'm gonna get the A5 ex-display, you've talked me into it.....I'm sure I won't regret it though (he hopes).

    So that's my speakers and amp sorted now but haven't even thought about the source yet...that'll have to wait though, I'll just make do with my dvd player for now.
    Any suggestions on cables aswell?


    Thanks for all the info and advice so far.
     
  18. sdb123

    sdb123
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    Please tell me you're going to get a demo before buying blind :rolleyes:
     
  19. Knyght_byte

    Knyght_byte
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    i'd appreciate it if he did demo.......however a number of people have happily reported the combination of MF A series and MA GR/GS series working immensly well together, so i guess its a slightly safer blind purchase....lol

    as for cables, well, i wouldnt go too mad tbh......at this precise point in time i'm making do with a 2m Wireworld Terra cable which was only £35 or £40 and it sounds good (from my 3910 DVD player to my A5)...altho this is only for the moment, i need to rewire my system due to mains socketry, once i do and the A5 is closer to its source i'll be using a Chord Cobra, normally around £70 but i got it half price when i bought something else......

    for sources (i assume CD player)..hmm...i'll be entering that arena myself once 2007 starts, gonna be looking towards Arcam, Primare, possibly MF, not so sure they are so good value in the CD side of things tho apart from the X-Ray but thats secondhand only now i think, plus a few other options i might consider......gonna start demoing around autumn to be ready for when the cash is there...heh.......however i can confidently say GR and A series worked very nicely with Arcams CD73 if you want a cheap solution with very good benefits...
     
  20. David77

    David77
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    I've never bought (or even heard) quality seperates before so I'd be suprised if I wasn't blown away by what I'm getting, and I can always sell on if I didn't like them. For CD I might get a denon DVD-2900 modified, I've heard good things about it's cd playback and it'd be better for me having one player for dvd and cd.
     
  21. Knyght_byte

    Knyght_byte
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    yes, the 2900 was well regarded, i wanted to buy one myself for the same reason, sadly i couldnt get one in the shop........because i'm not a very trusting person due to past experiences in life (not with hifi, just life) i wont buy second hand, even tho i know i can get a better bargain essentially........i ended up with my 3910, which tbh plays CD's extremely well, a lot of other people disagree, but i guess it partly comes down to what equipment you connect it to........i know that my 3910 isnt far removed in general quality terms from the CD73 when i demoed it hooked up to the same equipment, so i'm happy i saved myself spending £400 on a temporary CD player.........

    i wouldnt mind buying a Naim CD player, there is a certain allure to them aesthetically...heh
    if it sounded best for the money i'll probably buy one, but i also do like the look of the Primare CD players and definitely the sound of them......Arcams are good but i'm holding out till they get new models because of a few issues with timing on certain types of disc....most notably SACD hybrids, but also some others.....

    anyhow, if you are not blown away by the A5 i'll be damn surprised...heh....i sincerely hope you are...i know i was.....given the esteemed Arcam company it was up against, it was just gorgeous.........altho i'd still like to get my mitts on a KW 500...lol.....one day....
     
  22. David77

    David77
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    Just out of curiosity how come?
     
  23. Knyght_byte

    Knyght_byte
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    when life gets good for me, it inevitebly turns sour very quick........is a running theme....
    altho despite this i always aim to remain cheerful and happy....

    but if i spent even £400 on a £800 bit of kit second hand and it broke down i'd be really upset because putting that much money together for a one of payment is basically half a months wages for me (i work part time due to back problems in a call centre...bleah)....

    whereas if i go to a shop, ok i pay close to full price (have used same shop for 2.5 years and get on very well with them so i never pay full price) but i can pay it off over a year or two and if anything does go wrong they are very helpful and will always get it sorted out without fuss or charge to me at all....even if somethings out of warranty!

    my hifi/home cinema/PC setup is worth (almost £ for £) a whole years wages to me.....and i've put it together over 2.5 years, with about a third of a years wages still on credit.....ok so i coulda got it cheaper, but i would have had to wait longer to actually own the kit each time by not using credit, and i'd have no backup if anything went wrong..........its one thing buying something for £50, ok if that goes breasts up then i can write it off with a frown, if something for £500 goes breasts up then i really would feel sad......so i'd rather not risk it...hifi makes me happy, not a lot else does......i dont want to risk having hifi let me down as well....

    make sense?

    hope it does anyhow..lol
     
  24. Pufz

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    The A5 amp and A5 CD player can both be had brand new for £1350.00 a piece...

    It`s a shop in London but can`t think of the name of it right now.

    Let me know if you are interested and i`ll try and find out for you.
     
  25. David77

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    @ Knyght byte....that's fair enough.


    Just found at that I can't get the GR10s secondhand anymore so I'll have to find them ex-display somewhere or even buy new. I know Brighton Sevenoaks are selling some at the mo but they're asking £500 for them ex-display and new. Might get the GR20s now as they're going for £800 so they're only about £200 more than the GR10s with stands. How do the GR20s compare to the GR10s?
     
  26. andye2004

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  27. David77

    David77
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    I've managed to locate a pair of ex-demo GR10s for £500, although Brighton Sevenoaks are also selling them brand new for the same price so would I be better of buying them ex-dem or new? I know brand new should be the obvious choice but with ex-dem they'll already be run in so not sure which would be best to get.
    Also what stands would go well with the GR10s?...don't want anything too ugly though as they'll be in my living room.

    Also my amp's sorted now as I've bought the MF A5 today (thanks KB for all the advice and info on that).
     
  28. Knyght_byte

    Knyght_byte
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    i'd go brand new tbh, that way you have no problem getting help if a fault develops.....especially if its the same price...lol

    as for stands, you want very heavy ones, preferably ones with pillars toward each corner.....how much you want to spend depends on you, but the ones i heard them on in the shop were just perfect, sadly a specially made up model for the shop so not freely available to buy, but they are as i described just now.....the shop said if they were to sell them they'd want around £300....eek...lol

    but i reckon you should be able to find a pair for around £150-200 that will do the job......its worth the money in my opinion, and i'm not one to say that about ancilliary equipment normally...heh

    and your more than welcome for the advice on the A5 ;-)
     
  29. David77

    David77
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    Does anyone know which compact or satellite centre speaker would match the gr10s?...can't fit a full size centre.
     
  30. Knyght_byte

    Knyght_byte
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    oohh thats a shame.....the MA ranges work so well with their own centres matching....cant you make room somehow?...heh

    you could try mismatching with something like the Monitor Audio Radius 180.....might have a chance of voice and timbre matching reasonably well.......try asking a shop if they can lend you their demo model for a night so you can try it at home in your own setup....if its not right, try another speaker......

    some people dont seem to notice the difference too much with movies when the centre is mismatched, some people do, i know i do.....sticks out like a sore thumb, but i'm overly critical...lol
     

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