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MadVR finally here ?

IWC Dopplel

Distinguished Member
Screenshot 2020-09-09 at 07.58.10.png
 

IWC Dopplel

Distinguished Member
I didn't bother to translate but the £10k unit looks very home made tbh. Clearly prototype ?

Screenshot 2020-09-09 at 08.19.32.png

Screenshot 2020-09-09 at 08.20.00.png
 

IWC Dopplel

Distinguished Member
I think they are trying to productise their software, most seem to want to do the reverse ! Im not really sure what the ENVY PRO and EXTREME do that the software doesn't do, looks very powerful, I guess if it transform the image and provides a better end result than the Lumagen, maybe it will gain some traction with the big installs
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
It’s not the most handsome device in the world, definitely looks like a custom install job where all equipment is in a separate room, I can’t imagine too many people wanting this in their lounge!! 🤔
 

cynix

Active Member
This is going back to the days of the TAW Rock video processor almost 20 years ago, a PC with a video i/o card running video processing software. I still have my old Rock+ in a cupboard somewhere. :)
 

sim12

Well-known Member
Is it possible that there is a flirc in the bottom left usb port, surely not, but as mentioned already it does appear to a pc of sorts.
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
What does it do more than a powerfull PC running MadVR?

you’ll be able to run normal sources through it such as UHD, media streamers, etc
 

Luminated67

Distinguished Member
I appreciate that having the ability to use it with stuff other than hard drive or blurays is appealing but at the asking price you could upgrade your projector to a JVC N series and buy yourself a Lumagen which all cover both based and throw in arguably the best home projector this side of stupid money.
 

KelvinS1965

Distinguished Member
There's a massive thread over on AVS about this, with very enthusiastic owners/potential owners posting about it. Also another thread that plans to 'objectively' compare this with the Lumagen Pro (and other devices).

So far what I've read seems to indicate better upscaling by the Envy, DTM may well be a back and forth as they each launch various updates. TBH the Pro is hardly rubbish at upscaling as it is and it's already a proven product with great backup from Lumagen, with further (free) updates likely to come. Therefore I'm not planing on swapping to an Envy any time soon myself, though I can understand those who want the nth degree of upscaling improvements to go for the Envy over the Pro.

There are a number of other differences between the two products as well that I can't recall off hand, but they also meant I'm better off staying with my Pro. However, it's no bad thing having some competition in the market.
 

Neil Davidson

Well-known Member
AVForums Sponsor
The Envy range is available from my company Genesis Technologies. I have had my Envy Extreme since February and I am very happy with the quality.

It is critical to understand that an Envy is not meant for the same customer as may want an HTPC setup. It is for someone that wants total ease of use, perfect functionality and, most importantly HDMI input.

We are also not out to compete with Lumagen. The Envy is more ideal as a set and forget device. Connect, enter the display brightness and go gets you 90% of the way there. Of course you can add the advanced calibration features on top and the aspect control is truly wonderful and it is a joy to have a beautiful gui rendered out at 4K.

What it does to the image is absolutely phenomenal. It’s hard to go back to not having it when it’s there.
 

scrowe

Distinguished Member
There are a number of other differences between the two products as well that I can't recall off hand, but they also meant I'm better off staying with my Pro. However, it's no bad thing having some competition in the market.

It seems to me from reading those threads over time, that the key differentiation in terms of picture quality may well be:-

1. The Envy uses lots of AI-based picture enhancement techniques to try and wring the absolute best it can from the original source. But this can mean ‘interpreting’ a lot, things like sharpening, and other techniques, similar to what darbee offered.

2. The Lumagen tends to take the ‘purist’ approach and processes mainly what is in the content, a d doesn’t try to overly add anything to the mix. One particular evaluation from a movie post-production worker, suggested the Lumagen output was very close to what is produced on professional ‘pulsar’ equipment when mastering content.

As a Lumagen owner for many years thru the Vision, XS and now Pro, I’m definitely not a purist, and use the darbee sparingly. The problem with trying to compare PQ is that the nature of these processors is they will both still be moving goalposts, as software updates keep coming, like an arms race to be the best, not necessarily a bad thing in this area. And to be clear everyone seems to be discussing and looking to compare the Extreme model at 10k, which is more than twice the price of a current Lumagen Pro I believe.

So you have to say that the Envy is very expensive in pursuit of the ultimate PQ only.. The Pro of course offering multiple HDMI inputs and outputs, switchable memories, plus a load more functionality on top around being a key component of an amateur to professional cinema setup. The Envy is 1 in 1 out HDMI.

I think if you consider Lumagen as a niche target audience, the Envy has an even narrower niche. The comparison is the person prepared to pay for the £15k Sony laser over the JVC N7, or. Trinnov over an Arcam setup. Things that add incremental performance at an exponential cost comparison.
 

IWC Dopplel

Distinguished Member
I think choosing an Envy over a Lumagen is a bit different to choosing Trinnov over Arcam, the differences between top end processors At 10k+ vs those at 3-5k I suspect will be greater than the difference between a Lumagen and an Envy. If the non Pro Envy moves the image on by a significant amount then I might be interested as I only use one hdmi in and one out. I just don’t believe it will be enough to remove a Lumagen and fit an Envy, but you never know
 

Neil Davidson

Well-known Member
AVForums Sponsor
The Envy Pro is £7800 inc VAT.

The Envy Extreme is £13200 inc VAT.

There is an awful lot of incorrect conjecture on the US threads and many people that haven’t touched either device talking boldly about what they heard. An Envy is not the same as a MadVR. The algorithms are not exactly the same. The user experience is not remotely the same.

We will try to get the unit in some trusted hands over here who can give their opinion as they see fit.
 
The Envy Pro is £7800 inc VAT.

The Envy Extreme is £13200 inc VAT.

There is an awful lot of incorrect conjecture on the US threads and many people that haven’t touched either device talking boldly about what they heard. An Envy is not the same as a MadVR. The algorithms are not exactly the same. The user experience is not remotely the same.

We will try to get the unit in some trusted hands over here who can give their opinion as they see fit.
Opinions are quite useless, some hardcore testing and documentation would be golden. show of what it do, find the right test patterns for the purpose and show us with and without Envy.
 

ask4me2

Active Member
With that much PC hardware in a video processor, I guess the cooling noise level can be something to consider in some setups too.
 

IWC Dopplel

Distinguished Member
At £8k or £13k, gulp this will only be for those with £20k plus PJ’s. Still interested to see how it performs as a spectator
 

MartR

Active Member
Well... i have the NX9/RS3000 and Paladin DCR with the MadVR Envy and i can say it is amazing.
When i see the picture quality of the NX9 with FA stand alone and compare it to the NX9 and DCR that is a big step and then including the Envy makes it hudge.
Hdr become so much better and you must see it to believe it because i can't find words to explain that upgrade to be honest, the only word that comes to mind is 'hudge'.
Yes it's big , yes it's expensive but man what am i glad i bought that piece of kit and i also must add that it is very user friendly with a really good menu set up.
You can let it calibrate in 3d lut and set it in the 'permanent' menu and what ever you touch or change in the settings just to compare or trying to improve the picture it will always start up in the 'permanent' calibrated settings after it's boots up so you can't mess up or change things you didnt wanted to.
Very very happy with it, and as it is still in beta it can only being better in the future.
It is really plug and play as it automatic takes the right settings and calibration and you don't have to look at it if you don't want to, just put the disc in and press play and enjoy your movie.
 

IWC Dopplel

Distinguished Member
Well... i have the NX9/RS3000 and Paladin DCR with the MadVR Envy and i can say it is amazing.
When i see the picture quality of the NX9 with FA stand alone and compare it to the NX9 and DCR that is a big step and then including the Envy makes it hudge.
Hdr become so much better and you must see it to believe it because i can't find words to explain that upgrade to be honest, the only word that comes to mind is 'hudge'.
Yes it's big , yes it's expensive but man what am i glad i bought that piece of kit and i also must add that it is very user friendly with a really good menu set up.
You can let it calibrate in 3d lut and set it in the 'permanent' menu and what ever you touch or change in the settings just to compare or trying to improve the picture it will always start up in the 'permanent' calibrated settings after it's boots up so you can't mess up or change things you didnt wanted to.
Very very happy with it, and as it is still in beta it can only being better in the future.
It is really plug and play as it automatic takes the right settings and calibration and you don't have to look at it if you don't want to, just put the disc in and press play and enjoy your movie.

Really glad its providing a big upgrade, Hmmm, maybe the £8k price won't be as hard to justify then at the slightly low price point. I was thinking if I was adding £8k or £13k to most projectors below £20k the 4k Lumagen and a slightly better PJ would be the better deal
 

MartR

Active Member
Well maybe yes, but that is something someone has to figger out personnaly i guess...
I have the Envy in beta and for the lower (testing) price , the Lumagen would come close for me in price so it was a no brainer.
But if i have a Lumagen allready i would not buy a MadVr Envy or you must have a money tree in your backyard.
I had the same projector as you ,the LS10000, and i was looking for an upgrade because it was always a mess in hdr but in sdr blu ray it was very good. In hdr it was always a hassle etc etc.
Then i was thinking of taking a Paladin lens and a lumagen or MadVR to upgrade the LS10000. The lens would give more lumens and sharpness with all the panels pixels in a ratio 2.35/2.40. Win win if you ask me and just what the Epson needed... then with the tone mapping of the MadVr/Lumagen it must be a very good combo i think.
I was speaking to Gordon about this for a while and also with Shawn from Panamorph about going this route.
Then i get a demo with this lens and madVR on a NX9 and there was no way back from there, i was sold in 5 minutes. I think the step from a LS10000 to a NX9 is pretty big but not as big as i thought... but then adding a DCR lens and a MadVR making it HUDGE.
If i decided to get the 2k Paladin lens for my LS10000 it would be a short term investment in my eyes because when i will buy a native 4k projector later on i will have to sell the lens and buy a DCR all over again so that started me thinking.
End of story i ordered the NX9/MadVR Envy/Paladin DCR/Screen Research 2.40:1 and am a happy camper from there.
Very happy.
But if i were you i would be looking at a Paladin lens ;-)
 

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