Lyngdorf MP-40 AV Processor Review & Comments

davejones2

Well-known Member
I find it remarkable that consumers (and a very experienced AV reviewer) are prepared to accept such a compromise in one of the basic, fundamental functions of an AV Processor. There is clearly absolutely zero financial, structural or developmental reason for the decision to provide only 3 HDMI inputs. The one and only reason is that SL have (quite inexplicably in my opinion) completely unecessarily decided to use this as a differentiator between this and a more expensive model.

This is a company willingly inconveniencing a reasonable percentage of their consumers for the sake of upselling a vastly more expensive model to a tiny fraction of them.

Regardless of the nonsense excuses being highlighted by the Lyndorf resellers on this forum, 3 HDMI inputs on an AV Processor for £8.5k is utterly ludicrous, and reflects fairly shamefully on the brand imo.
 

Rock Danger

Distinguished Member
Some of these comments... Jesus H Elivs...

You are getting the sound quality of one of the best units in the world. You are also buying something from a product line, that has 2, 12 and 16 channels.

Does that make it perfect? no.. however this would have done me up until yesterday when I added 2 extra height channels. I have a media player, games console and you could argue whether the computer is relevant as it runs as a server only and can be remote accessed.

So if I had to have the outstanding picture quality of Sky or Virgin I could, or I could rub jam in my eyes and listen to the radio.. point being 3 HDMI is enough for the majority of people that want but can't afford the performance of an MP60 as is marketed and priced accordingly.

Video connectivity is a £200 problem that is reliable and set and forget and lets face it you'll probably get that knocked off the unit anyway. You have a bunch of streaming options in there, including chromecast? I'm pretty sure this was held up due to a chrome cast license, but regardless, they are built into things like the Nvidia Shield and you have Roon etc built in to the unit itself.

Also, smaller companies don't have the purchase power of D&M for example - saying things like I can get this £300 unit with 6 HDMI, well ok let me know how that works out, I bet it sounds superb......

And good luck getting something decent sounding for less that actually works, because it's not JBL, Arcam, Nad or Emotiva. By all means, search the forums on those units, some of which were released before their room correction/software was finished and also without it entirely.

Bringing me on to that subject..

I am a screaming Anthem fangirl, I have had 3 generations of their products, I still use one of their 5ch power amps and have Paradigm subs, I think they're great but ARC is not Room Perfect, it just can't deliver the same results and Room Perfect's nearest working Dirac neighbour (remember not all Dirac is created equal) is more likely going to be on Storm audio products, which I'm not sure if you've looked, but they aren't exactly cheap, just like the wizardry of the Trinnov ALT 16 using TEQ.

Buy the MP60 (or whatever) if you want this level of music and movie sound with more channels and connectivity, but the difference between £8.5k and say £12k is a world of difference for more people than not. They are already punching up beyond their budget. You just have to look at what installers are using and how terrified most people are of their wives to see how it all fits in with the marketing in tow.

Similar with the TDAI 1120 and yet they are being gobbled up all over the EU.

On the point of HDMI 2.1 in this day and age - what are you using that for exactly in the next bunch of years*? there's no physical media, or streaming services even thinking touching this and as you probably know, Netflix has just chopped their 4K bitrate, Sky and Virgin's HD is bollocks. Again they're not marketing themselves to home theater owners, but to millions of average £600 HDTV family lounges, that is their bread and butter.

All said, the pros vs the cons (with work arounds) don't leave much to argue about. In my own personal opinion, I think had they even released it with 4 HDMI, there would still be some screeching womble (who can't afford it anyway) who'd still be complaining about something else. The pearl clutching is hilarious, vote with your wallet.


*obviously not including the 2 PC master race users that would have this in their setup.
 
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Dans1210

Well-known Member
Some of these comments... Jesus H Elivs...

You are getting the sound quality of one of the best units in the world. You are also buying something from a product line, that has 2, 12 and 16 channels.

Does that make it perfect? no.. however this would have done me up until yesterday when I added 2 extra height channels. I have a media player, games console and you could argue whether the computer is relevant as it runs as a server only and can be remote accessed.

So if I had to have the outstanding picture quality of Sky or Virgin I could, or I could rub jam in my eyes and listen to the radio.. point being 3 HDMI is enough for the majority of people that want but can't afford the performance of an MP60 as is marketed and priced accordingly.

Video connectivity is a £200 problem that is reliable and set and forget and lets face it you'll probably get that knocked off the unit anyway. You have a bunch of streaming options in there, including chromecast? I'm pretty sure this was held up due to a chrome cast license, but regardless, they are built into things like the Nvidia Shield and you have Roon etc built in to the unit itself.

Also, smaller companies don't have the purchase power of D&M for example - saying things like I can get this £300 unit with 6 HDMI, well ok let me know how that works out, I bet it sounds superb......

And good luck getting something decent sounding for less that actually works, because it's not JBL, Arcam, Nad or Emotiva. By all means, search the forums on those units, some of which were released before their room correction/software was finished and also without it entirely.

Bringing me on to that subject..

I am a screaming Anthem fangirl, I have had 3 generations of their products, I still use one of their 5ch power amps and have Paradigm subs, I think they're great but ARC is not Room Perfect, it just can't deliver the same results and Room Perfect's nearest working Dirac neighbour (remember not all Dirac is created equal) is more likely going to be on Storm audio products, which I'm not sure if you've looked, but they aren't exactly cheap, just like the wizardry of the Trinnov ALT 16 using TEQ.

Buy the MP60 (or whatever) if you want this level of music and movie sound with more channels and connectivity, but the difference between £8.5k and say £12k is a world of difference for more people than not. They are already punching up beyond their budget. You just have to look at what installers are using and how terrified most people are of their wives to see how it all fits in with the marketing in tow.

Similar with the TDAI 1120 and yet they are being gobbled up all over the EU.

On the point of HDMI 2.1 in this day and age - what are you using that for exactly in the next bunch of years*? there's no physical media, or streaming services even thinking touching this and as you probably know, Netflix has just chopped their 4K bitrate, Sky and Virgin's HD is bollocks. Again they're not marketing themselves to home theater owners, but to millions of average £600 HDTV family lounges, that is their bread and butter.

All said, the pros vs the cons (with work arounds) don't leave much to argue about. In my own personal opinion, I think had they even released it with 4 HDMI, there would still be some screeching womble (who can't afford it anyway) who'd still be complaining about something else. The pearl clutching is hilarious, vote with your wallet.


*obviously not including the 2 PC master race users that would have this in their setup.
For what it’s worth, one thing that attracted me about the MP-40 was that all the money was being put into the audio processing rather than cheap, barely supported, video switching HDMI inputs, badly supported, incompatible with some video formats, and not doing genuine pass through of any video signal. Yes, it’s a luxury that I have the Lumagen fir video switching and processing, but I would hope anyone putting this level of kit in a Home Cinema should have a Lumagen anyway.
Do these lyngdorf processors use generic dsp chips, if not what dsp solution are they using?
Define audio quality, because currently the latest line of Denon receivers are the top measured receivers on audiosciencereview, even beating out the Datasat, Top Nad and Anthem products.
Room correction really seems to be the only thing differentiating these products which depending on your room mileage may vary, As far as i can tell the Trinnov seems to be the only product that knows exactly where your speakers are and then adjusts the dsp accordingly.
 
Last edited:

Seriously Ltd

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
I find it remarkable that consumers (and a very experienced AV reviewer) are prepared to accept such a compromise in one of the basic, fundamental functions of an AV Processor. There is clearly absolutely zero financial, structural or developmental reason for the decision to provide only 3 HDMI inputs. The one and only reason is that SL have (quite inexplicably in my opinion) completely unecessarily decided to use this as a differentiator between this and a more expensive model.

This is a company willingly inconveniencing a reasonable percentage of their consumers for the sake of upselling a vastly more expensive model to a tiny fraction of them.

Regardless of the nonsense excuses being highlighted by the Lyndorf resellers on this forum, 3 HDMI inputs on an AV Processor for £8.5k is utterly ludicrous, and reflects fairly shamefully on the brand imo.
You obviously do not understand the AV market. This has absolutely nothing to do with upselling the MP60. There are no excuses being made I can assure you. We supply many MP60 processors and now we can offer a more affordable option to clients that do not require as many HDMI inputs. If a client does not require more than 12 channels, AES out and needs only 3 or less HDMI (which is very common btw) then we suggest the MP40. The MP40 is a very popular choice for our clients as is the MP60 to clients who have different requirements.

The Steinway Lyngdorf P100 processor also has 3 HDMI whereas the P300 offers more. We supply both to our clients depending on their needs. No one needs to up sell any of the SL/Lyngdorf products.

Again as previously stated, there are fundamental differences between the two products. DTS: X Pro, 16 discrete channels, AES in/out option, 2.1 upgrade path.

If you need more than 3 hdmi add a high quality splitter, use a Lumagen or buy an MP60.
 

Rock Danger

Distinguished Member
Do these lyngdorf processors use generic dsp chips, if not what dsp solution are they using?
I don't know. I use their products but I don't design them, you'd need to ask Lyngdorf.

Define audio quality, because currently the latest line of Denon receivers are the top measured receivers on audiosciencereview, even beating out the Datasat, Top Nad and Anthem products.
I define audio quality in this case as the sum total sound of any given system for it's fidelity, tonality, spatial separation and bass management in relation to how humans perceive audio.

Room correction really seems to be the only thing differentiating these products which depending on your room mileage may vary, As far as i can tell the Trinnov seems to be the only product that knows exactly where your speakers are and then adjusts the dsp accordingly.
The build quality, components and engineering of Lyngdorf is not the same as D&M, you can see and hear this in their audio / video solutions. Room correction is a huge part of any system, the very art or recording and mixing music is room correction, I've certainly done enough of it. Room Perfect has a much higher success rate to it's competitors in the more awkward rooms, there's a wealth of testimony on it and I've seen the engineers explanation of it in a new video - checks out, given the end result.

Every system knows where your speakers are, that's why they have distances and layout maps. Trinnov has some extensive remapping features, but nothing in my experience to produce an end result that puts it in a different class, so whatever DSP used and whatever some guy on ASR says doesn't change the frankly stellar reviews and the user experience - just look at testimony for the TDAI range from all the HiFi wombles on the largest thread/s in the processor section - it's not my thing personally, but these are people that have gone thru a myriad of gear costing much more.
 
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mtenga

Distinguished Member
Yeah and I won't buy a Ferrari because the cup holders are rubbish
What Ferrari wouldn’t do is release a series and put a Honda engine in the lower model to meet a price point; the V is a major part of the two letter AV equation. Whilst there are ways around the lack of HDMI it seems a puzzling omission when as pointed out a 300 quid Denon can somehow achieve a reasonable count. But the market as always will have the final say.
 

RickyDeg

Well-known Member
As long as Lyngdorf implements Tidal Connect for their processors, like they have on the TDAI-3400, the MP-40 is my processor of choice!

For my needs the 'limitations' of this unit are a non-issue. Only utilize 5.2 channels and 2 HDMI's sources. In my set-up I've never been convinced by Dirac Live so it'll be interesting to experience the contrast of RoomPerfect. Can't wait! *fingers crossed*
 

Steve356

Distinguished Member
What Ferrari wouldn’t do is release a series and put a Honda engine in the lower model to meet a price point; the V is a major part of the two letter AV equation. Whilst there are ways around the lack of HDMI it seems a puzzling omission when as pointed out a 300 quid Denon can somehow achieve a reasonable count. But the market as always will have the final say.
Most AV processors/receivers can handle the V side of AV very well as their job is essentially to pass through the video without messing with it. The audio side however tends to be much more complex due to room effects, speaker/bass integration along with decoding and steering requirements. In my experience, it's the audio side that is decisive factor in choosing the right product for any set up, especially if one wants the best stereo and surround performance.

If Denon realistically fits the bill in respect of these attributes, it's easy -- buy a Denon.
 

ggwoodland

Active Member
Interesting discussion, I’ve had a Marantz AV8801 with Audyssey a NAD M17v2 with Dirac and now a Lyngdorf MP50 with RP in my room. No doubt for me the Lyngdorf sounds the best. Also the unit is as reliable as the Marantz in terms of HDMI handling. RP is very simple to use and doesn’t seem to have the teething issues that Dirac had, maybe with Lyngdorf owning hardware and software that helps. So all in all very impressed with the Lyngdorf. I can see the point that 3 HDMIs does seem a bit stingy but that is what I am using now with an ATV, Blu Ray and Virgin box. I stream with Roon from an iMac and that works great. I may eventually go to 4 HDMIs with a next gen console but as I am causal gamer not even sure I will - George
 

mtenga

Distinguished Member
If Denon realistically fits the bill in respect of these attributes, it's easy -- buy a Denon.
Yes of course the market ultimately decides and there is no right or wrong answer. Some people consider it absurd spending eight grand and getting three HDMI inputs others think it doesn’t matter overall in the greater scheme of what you are getting. It’s clearly not a 20 grand HDMI cable absurdity or rip off, just a funny choice to me because they can’t be saving that much by skimping.
 

drillo

Active Member
Some of these comments... Jesus H Elivs...

You are getting the sound quality of one of the best units in the world. You are also buying something from a product line, that has 2, 12 and 16 channels.

Does that make it perfect? no.. however this would have done me up until yesterday when I added 2 extra height channels. I have a media player, games console and you could argue whether the computer is relevant as it runs as a server only and can be remote accessed.

So if I had to have the outstanding picture quality of Sky or Virgin I could, or I could rub jam in my eyes and listen to the radio.. point being 3 HDMI is enough for the majority of people that want but can't afford the performance of an MP60 as is marketed and priced accordingly.

Video connectivity is a £200 problem that is reliable and set and forget and lets face it you'll probably get that knocked off the unit anyway. You have a bunch of streaming options in there, including chromecast? I'm pretty sure this was held up due to a chrome cast license, but regardless, they are built into things like the Nvidia Shield and you have Roon etc built in to the unit itself.

Also, smaller companies don't have the purchase power of D&M for example - saying things like I can get this £300 unit with 6 HDMI, well ok let me know how that works out, I bet it sounds superb......

And good luck getting something decent sounding for less that actually works, because it's not JBL, Arcam, Nad or Emotiva. By all means, search the forums on those units, some of which were released before their room correction/software was finished and also without it entirely.

Bringing me on to that subject..

I am a screaming Anthem fangirl, I have had 3 generations of their products, I still use one of their 5ch power amps and have Paradigm subs, I think they're great but ARC is not Room Perfect, it just can't deliver the same results and Room Perfect's nearest working Dirac neighbour (remember not all Dirac is created equal) is more likely going to be on Storm audio products, which I'm not sure if you've looked, but they aren't exactly cheap, just like the wizardry of the Trinnov ALT 16 using TEQ.

Buy the MP60 (or whatever) if you want this level of music and movie sound with more channels and connectivity, but the difference between £8.5k and say £12k is a world of difference for more people than not. They are already punching up beyond their budget. You just have to look at what installers are using and how terrified most people are of their wives to see how it all fits in with the marketing in tow.

Similar with the TDAI 1120 and yet they are being gobbled up all over the EU.

On the point of HDMI 2.1 in this day and age - what are you using that for exactly in the next bunch of years*? there's no physical media, or streaming services even thinking touching this and as you probably know, Netflix has just chopped their 4K bitrate, Sky and Virgin's HD is bollocks. Again they're not marketing themselves to home theater owners, but to millions of average £600 HDTV family lounges, that is their bread and butter.

All said, the pros vs the cons (with work arounds) don't leave much to argue about. In my own personal opinion, I think had they even released it with 4 HDMI, there would still be some screeching womble (who can't afford it anyway) who'd still be complaining about something else. The pearl clutching is hilarious, vote with your wallet.


*obviously not including the 2 PC master race users that would have this in their setup.
You are wilfully missing the point - the £300 receiver comment is NOT to suggest equivalence, it’s that hdmi’s are demonstrably cheap and therefore cost cannot be pointed as a reason for exclusion as some suggested - intentional differentiation sure, not enforced. Lyngdorf made umpteen decisions, I agree with virtually all, don’t agree with their hdmi count - it’s a forum so I’m foruming.
 

Rock Danger

Distinguished Member
You are wilfully missing the point - the £300 receiver comment is NOT to suggest equivalence, it’s that hdmi’s are demonstrably cheap and therefore cost cannot be pointed as a reason for exclusion as some suggested - intentional differentiation sure, not enforced. Lyngdorf made umpteen decisions, I agree with virtually all, don’t agree with their hdmi count - it’s a forum so I’m foruming.
No I'm not missing anything, I understood it didn't suggest equivalence - if you are a purchaser for components you'll know that the price for D&M and someone like Lyngdorf, Trinnov, Storm etc are 2 totally different prices, even when they share the same factories at times. At no point did I not acknowledge this was a decision from a marketing and compiled user base pool.

However the 'it should have his because price X' is nonsense when you look at where it sits in the market - people seem to think that you can just add this here and that there and it'll only be a small difference because a completely different company and range has one of these features.

This is a business, it has to make money the people that work for Lyngdorf don't come cheap and it's all mainly done in house too

Like I said, the 3 HDMI is a £200 problem and that's a liberal budget for a remote 18gbps splitter. The problem ends there. The £8.5k vs £12+k is a much larger one for more people. Personally I would have said 4 but I don't own an MP40 and don't care, I'm just foruming.
 

UMAR 3:16

Moderator
Personally don’t have problem with 3 HDMI Inputs. I only have my UB820 4K player connected to the 8805 that’s it. Gaming happens next door!

Which makes me think, how much of an improvement would this be over my 8805 if everything else in my kit (see sig) was left as is.... 😁
 

drillo

Active Member
No I'm not missing anything, I understood it didn't suggest equivalence - if you are a purchaser for components you'll know that the price for D&M and someone like Lyngdorf, Trinnov, Storm etc are 2 totally different prices, even when they share the same factories at times. At no point did I not acknowledge this was a decision from a marketing and compiled user base pool.

However the 'it should have his because price X' is nonsense when you look at where it sits in the market - people seem to think that you can just add this here and that there and it'll only be a small difference because a completely different company and range has one of these features.

This is a business, it has to make money the people that work for Lyngdorf don't come cheap and it's all mainly done in house too

Like I said, the 3 HDMI is a £200 problem and that's a liberal budget for a remote 18gbps splitter. The problem ends there. The £8.5k vs £12+k is a much larger one for more people. Personally I would have said 4 but I don't own an MP40 and don't care, I'm just foruming.
I’m not here to convince you. I’d sooner advise you to get another cat.
 

Rock Danger

Distinguished Member
Which makes me think, how much of an improvement would this be over my 8805 if everything else in my kit (see sig) was left as is.... 😁
I'd say you'd notice a fair uptick, easy enough to find out...

I’m not here to convince you. I’d sooner advise you to get another cat.
Never thought you were, you'd need to do a much better job than you're doing now if it was the case.
All fine here for cats, if you need some extra in your life, crack on.
 

HeadBanger

Well-known Member
No one here is disputing the quality of Lyngdorf gear but I cannot believe people are defending Lyngdorf for only putting 3 HDMI inputs on a AV Processor that costs eight and a half thousand pounds!!!

To suggest solving the problem by adding a splitter or buying the next model up is bonkers. It is a problem that simply should not exist - Lyngdorf have got this very wrong IMO.

HB
 

drillo

Active Member
Personally don’t have problem with 3 HDMI Inputs. I only have my UB820 4K player connected to the 8805 that’s it. Gaming happens next door!

Which makes me think, how much of an improvement would this be over my 8805 if everything else in my kit (see sig) was left as is.... 😁

Sure it’s plenty for some, it wouldn’t be enough for others. If it isn’t enough there are solutions in various guises. As I stated upfront, my view is it’s part of their differentiation effort along with many other features. Choosing to differentiate here however feels stingy to me but it’s clearly their call and their business (and my prerogative as a consumer or punter to feel how I feel about it) - however I reject the suggestion they had to leave out hdmi’s to achieve the price point.
 

drillo

Active Member
No one here is disputing the quality of Lyngdorf gear but I cannot believe people are defending Lyngdorf for only putting 3 HDMI inputs on a AV Processor that costs eight and a half thousand pounds!!!

To suggest solving the problem by adding a splitter or buying the next model up is bonkers. It is a problem that simply should not exist - Lyngdorf have got this very wrong IMO.

HB
Now hang on a sec, it’s not like it costs £8.5k and hdmis are relative cheap....oh wait 😛
Actually their preparedness to engineer/market a product this way is fascinating, speaks volumes for their confidence in everything else which appears to be endorsed by all who own or have auditioned them.
 

Steve356

Distinguished Member
Lyngdorf have clearly misunderstood the needs and wants of the market. They should have just used any old off the shelf stuff and bolted it together with any old 3rd party room correction system. Then add a multitude of HDMI sockets, perhaps enough to entertain whole communities simultaneously.

If anyone then says "It sounds terrible", you just point them to the most important part, "Yes, but look at how many HDMI connections I can have". All for eight and a half thousand pounds!!!

I should be in marketing! ;) :laugh::rotfl:


P.S. I'm available for a suitably high consultancy fee. ;) :)
 

felty99

Active Member
As someone who has recently moved from Marantz, Arcam etc to Lyngdorf, the lack of HDMI inputs did seem a bit mean when I saw the released specs. However I don’t think they could release a £8.5k AVP with a full complement of inputs without it significantly cannibalising sales of the MP-60.

@Rock Danger makes a good point that AV R&D costs for a relatively small company like Lyngdorf are disproportionately greater than D&M, Yamaha etc, therefore the risks are greater as well. Look at the companies like Naim and Linn who have given up with AV products because they couldn’t justify the investment, and I would love Naim to bring out an AV3 processor but it just won’t happen given the market today.

It was pretty obvious that the £6-10k market was crying out for someone to come along and hit that price point with something better than what Arcam, Nad, Emotiva were offering while leaving the £10k+ market to Trinnov, Storm and the MP60.

And for me, the MP40 was a genius move for those who didn’t need more than 12channels or fancy AES inputs, because the SQ is frankly stunning.

Yes, 4 or more HDMI inputs would have been nice so I didn’t have to use my Oppo 205’s input or TV input via eARC. The latter especially as ARC is so flakey but I understand Lyngdorf are working on a firmware update to sort out some issues.
 

HeadBanger

Well-known Member
Lyngdorf know how many HDMI inputs the majority of people need as can be seen on their MP60. Or are the additional HDMI inputs actually there just for marketing? :p

HB
 

Steve356

Distinguished Member
Lyngdorf know how many HDMI inputs the majority of people need as can be seen on their MP60. Or are the additional HDMI inputs actually there just for marketing? :p

HB
Glad you acknowledge that they might just know what the majority of their users require. :)
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
Personally I think that the 3 hdmi inputs is a bit tight and people complaining can be justified with their thoughts.

However, this unit is so similar to the mp60 that the price reduction is pretty crazy really, basically you’re getting the same unit if you don’t need 16 discreet channels for £3500 less. That’s a mega saving for most people.

I’d be surprised if the mp40 doesn’t outsell the mp60 significantly moving forward, the price difference between the two let’s you buy a lumagen which in turn solves your hdmi input problem.

Or of course a hdmi switcher for £30 and then pocket the extra change. 👍🏻

For reference, I only use 1 hdmi input on my processor.
 

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