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Lumagen VisionDVI or HDP

Discussion in 'Projectors, Screens & Video Processors' started by Cocksure, Oct 27, 2005.

  1. Cocksure

    Cocksure
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    Hi all!
    Having taken a look round the site and reading the posts I have come to realise that the best video processor for me is either the vision DVI or HDP which I thank you for. I have also read that whilst the HDP can process and scale HD inputs the DVI cannot, which leads on to this question. As my projector (Panasonic PE-AE700E) is already HD compatible do I really need to spend the extra money for the HDP version over the VDI model?
    :confused:
     
  2. VirusKiller

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    Hi Lizard. Bear in mind that the Panny 700 has 720 lines, so if you feed it a 1080i or 1080p signal then it, rather than your scaler, will be scaling from 1080 lines to 720 and with a 1080i signal, also doing the deinterlacing. I guarantee that the deinterlacing and scaling in any of the £1000->£2000 scalers will be a massive improvement over what the Panny can offer.

    I went for the Crystalio which I am very happy with even though it only has basic weave (or is it bob?) 1080i deinterlacing. Going with the Lumagen HDP would be a pretty future-proof solution if HD source material is going to be important to you.
     
  3. Cocksure

    Cocksure
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    :) Thanks VirusKiller, your answer has helped me a lot to make my mind up as to which one is best for me, the HD source material is important to me but then at the same time so is having the funds too!

    I’m not to worried about the processor not being able to handle 1080p as currently no one is filming in that standard yet and it is likely to be a good few years before they do (if ever), also as most of sky HD broadcasts will be in 720p and I believe will be the HD dvd’s (I could be wrong!) I can’t justify the extra expense for the few times 1080i processing will be needed as the panny should handle the bulk of the HD sources fine.

    What I’m trying to say is that I will go for the visionDVI model as a result of you clarifying the matter for me which I am grateful for. Thank you.
     
  4. Joe Fernand

    Joe Fernand
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    Hello Lizard

    I think your missing one of the key points of the VisionHDP vs. DVI - both units will Input 1080i source material and Output it at 720P to match your Projector; one will do it (VisionDVI) and one will do it very well (VisionHDP).

    If your keen on getting the best out of HD sources then you'd have to assume you want to get the best performance with 720P and 1080i source material and go with the VisionHDP.

    Keep in mind too the VisionHDP outperforms the VisionDVI with SD sources too your not simply buying better 1080i source signal processing.

    Best regards

    Joe
     
  5. dilsher

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    Vision HDP all the way...
     
  6. Liam @ Prog AV

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    The 1080i reverse telecine is a great feature for the HDP, but it's not all about just that. The HDP uses 10bit version of the 8bit processor found in the DVI. The image (from SD or HD) from a HDP will be cleaner of scaling artefacts and with more accurate detail and colour rendition where it has the more horsepower to do so.
     
  7. Cocksure

    Cocksure
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    Thanks all for your kind replies, you’ve convinced me that it is worth putting in the extra cash (just got to find it now!) and going for the visionHDP. However I’m sorry to say that I have one more question to ask if I may? Now that I have made up my mind to go for the higher model it brings it into the same price range as the iscan VP30 which has the advantage of HDMI inputs (though this is not too important as I need to buy cables anyhow) and audio delay which is important to me as I have no way of currently controlling this, so I guess my latest question is would you still recommend the visionHDP over the iscanVP30? The picture quality is what counts to me as I know I can always buy a separate audio delay device later.
    Many thanks in advance
    Lizard
     
  8. Joe Fernand

    Joe Fernand
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    Hello Lizard

    Once the DVDO iScan VP30 arrives in the UK and its put through its paces with a range of source material then folk can give you the answer to your question!

    Until it arrives its on the 'shows great potential' short list!

    Best regards

    Joe
     
  9. Cocksure

    Cocksure
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    Thanks Joe, I had a feeling you might say that! lol

    Well at least I wont have to wait much longer to find out, according to DVDO they will be available from mid November.
     
  10. Joe Fernand

    Joe Fernand
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    Hello Lizard

    I'm told possibly early next week for UK availability.

    Best regards

    Joe
     
  11. cheechy

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    Just had a look at the VP30 pdf and I have to say that it certainly looks like very promising.

    Put the price past the missus and she did flinch however.....hard to tell in that department though.

    That being said I've managed to reintroduce my old CD player and amp into the living room and made an audiophile out of her.

    There may be hope yet :thumbsup:
     
  12. Welwynnick

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    Lizard, news emerged yesterday that Lumagen, as well as having an HD inverse tele-cine upgrade (for film sources) in the pipline, have also been working on a motion-adaptive per-pixel de-interlacing capability for video-source HD. While that doesn't mean the Crystalio II or Radiance XT won't be better still, it does add another big string to the VisionHDP bow. Tremendous.

    Nick
     
  13. Liam @ Prog AV

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    I had thought it was a region based motion-adaptive technique rather than right down to per-pixel, but either way it's gonna knock spots off any other processor in the same price category!!!
     
  14. Liam @ Prog AV

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    I've spoken out of my exit port. There will be the option for per-pixel too. I am now one incredibly happy Lumagen dealer/owner!!!!!!!!! I just don't know how they fit it all in
     
  15. Welwynnick

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    Dilsher will be hooting!

    I can feel some SDI mods coming on........

    Nick
     
  16. Liam @ Prog AV

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    I still can't believe they've done it. It's a huge, huge, huge feature!! No other processor even comes close, and with Lumagen's excellent scaling I don't think the distinction between HDP products and the "next gen" processors is going to be as big.

    Basically - wow.
     
  17. sharper

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    Im excited and I hardly understand a word of it.......Liam, whats the SP for the NLOC (Nontech Lumagen-HDP Owners Club) among us? :confused:
     
  18. Liam @ Prog AV

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    Basically 1080i from Sky HD (or HD-DVD or a PC with 1080i material on it, perhaps streamed with a Snazio) will look the mutts nutts. Anyone with a Crystalio I, DVDO, Cinemateq etc will be very jealous. However for now and your particular system there's no need to go rushing into getting the firmware updated.
     
  19. sharper

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    As always :thumbsup:
     
  20. cheechy

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    Liam - forgive my ignorance but I'm currently going through the turmoil of do I / dont I need a scaler with a PHD8 (which I'm also shortly going to purchase).

    This will only affect HD content - anything coming from an SD source (either component or HDMI) will not benefit from this new feature?
     
  21. Liam @ Prog AV

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    This particular feature is specific to 1080i. SD is already processed using per-pixel, motion adaptive deinterlacing and Lumagen's own scaling algorithm (which reckon is about the best around).
     
  22. gizlaroc

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    Even for us brits who watch a lot of Pal video material??
     
  23. Liam @ Prog AV

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    I can't see why it would do per-pixel for NTSC and not PAL?? Unless I am grossly misinformed!!
     
  24. gizlaroc

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    Sorry, I didn't mean that, I meant do you really think that the Lumagen is the best deinterlacer for those of us that live in the UK and watch a lot of Pal video material?
     
  25. Liam @ Prog AV

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    I was actually referring to the scaling algorithm, but yes of course I think the Lumagen is the best option in it's price category of those that I have seen. I wouldn't keep barking on about them otherwise!! Cinemateq does a pretty blinding job with PAL, DVDO doesn't (but that could change with the VP30), the Crystalio is quite awesome - and actually based on something I think you posted I've had a Plasma Enhancer Pro sent down to the office so I can get up close and personal with it!! (and the sexiest DVD player I've ever had my hands on - Primare DVD30 w/ SDI :D )
     
  26. gizlaroc

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    The reason I asked was I used to have a Lumagen and swapped for a Crystalio, however I recently had another go with the Lumagen after the recent firmware upgrades but still thought the Crystalio had the better image, I can only judge on my system of course.
    I am only talking about SDI Sky too, that was all I bothered comparing as I use my system for watching TV 80% of the time.
     
  27. NicolasB

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    When it's motion-compensated I'll be impressed. Not before. :devil:
     
  28. Welwynnick

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    I don't think PAL comes into this because by the time the video processing gets the video, it is decoded to such a low level that the only vestage remaining that is specific to PAL is the vertical refresh rate.

    Motion compensated? Well, maybe one day we will be laughing about we used to put up with black and white...motion-adaptive.....interlacing....pixels...etc, etc.

    Nick :)
     
  29. Liam @ Prog AV

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    I think you may mean video mode deinterlacing giz. (I keep saying PAL when I mean video mode, cos I often attach it to Sky TV performance, usually when I'm talking about the Cinemateq)

    Although, when the Lumagen was in BETA it did have poor PAL deinterlacing for a while but NTSC was fine (film and video) so I guess somewhere internally they are treated differently. Limit of my technical know-how though.
     
  30. Cocksure

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    Hello again all!
    Many thanks for all of your replies on the subject and I am very pleased to say that I went for the VisionHDP in the end and would just like to say WOW!!!!! Whilst I am confidant that I have set the colour, hue, etc, correctly, I am not sure if I have sent the timings up right to achieve a 1:1 bases to fit my Panasonic PT-AE700. The settings I have at the moment are

    VTOT 752 VRES 702 VSYN 4 VFRN 14
    HTOT 1996 HRES 1252 HSYN 80 HFRN 482

    These settings allow me to see the whole picture when I use the overscan or cross hatch test patterns of the lumagen which im sure is how its meant to be, but where I’m unsure is when I bring up the every other H/VLine test patterns, here the pictures are made up of a white background with faint evenly spaced black lines across the image, the black lines and the white background is the same shade across the picture, is this right? If it isn’t than does anyone know the correct timings or how the image should appear?
    Many thanks in advance
    Lizard :lease:
     

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