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LP12 for sale

Discussion in 'Hi-Fi Stereo Systems & Separates' started by Triggaaar, May 9, 2004.

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  1. Triggaaar

    Triggaaar
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    I have a LP12, which has spent far too many years in its box (14). Its not had any modifications (Basic, K9), and has not been serviced in that time - I don't think its needed servicing as its not been used. Its consequently in excellent condition (I shall check exactly before advertising).

    Could you give me some advice on how I should sell it? I'm not sure whether to pop it on ebay, and if so, what sort of starting price/reserve I should give it.

    Thanks
     
  2. Magic

    Magic
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    Ebay is usually decent, you might want to try Loot also. You won't need to worry about a starting price on Ebay as LP12s invariably attract plenty of bids. Put on plenty of photos & make sure you include the serial number (as if you don't you'll get a million emails about it). Do you have the original packaging? Otherwise it's not going to be an easy thing to pack & send. Even if you have make sure you allow for postage as it won't be cheap.

    Pricewise I think you should get in excess of £300 (unless it's a particularly bad day).

    Hope that this helps you.
     
  3. Triggaaar

    Triggaaar
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    Thanks, will do. It has the original packaging. Would prefer it to be collected, as it can be demoed, but guess I can't be that fussy. In which case I'm not sure who to send with - needs to be handled with care I'd think.
     
  4. GaryB

    GaryB
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    Why not try it on here first? It's bound to attract a far higher class of buyer. Of course you have to specify a price but if you start a bit above the prices on eBay you should get some decent offers.
     
  5. CJROSS

    CJROSS
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    Trig - £300 for a very tidy LP12-Basik is a reasonable price I would agree, FWIW if you are posting this item, you bascially have to strip it right down (ie like removing counterweight stub on arm etc & removing the platter from main bearing) quite simple there are guides on the net, when I bought mine I opted to collect it rather than have it potsed FWIW, anyway all you need to know about LP12s you will find here (handy for youir selling scpeel – ie from serial number you can tell vintage etc etc)

    http://pinkfishmedia.net/
    http://www.n.mackie.btinternet.co.uk/linn/tlp12faq.html

    I would sell it on Pink Fish myself Gary, they are LP12 daft on there, here Gary only a few would appreciate it IMHO. No disresepct to the users here but there are more LP12 entusiasts elsewhere IMHO. Well after Ebay of course, LP12s are like MK X-Components they tend to bring out the craziness in "E-Payers"

    ATB




    HTHs
     
  6. overkill

    overkill
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    MK X? Do you mean MF X? I would agree there, Linn gear goes for crazy prices on ebay!! Even the digital stuff, which was frankly critically panned, goes for almost as much as new!!I agree CJ that doesn't mean much, but I wasn't bowled over by Linns CD players either................ or their amps come to think of it.

    Not that they're that bad, they just weren't as good as the price would lead you to expect. JMPO.

    Fancied an Ittok VII a while back, but ebay's pricing has bumped them up way over the odds - for an OEM tonearm that is.

    I would use your own photos to show off the deck. I've seen using stock pics knock £50-100 off the expected price.
     
  7. CJROSS

    CJROSS
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    MF X Components Overkill, MF X-Cans V1, V2, X-DACs (HDCD DAC), X-24K (24-96Khz DAC very good off a DVD player BTW - especially one sending it a pure 24-96Khz signal from DAD 24/96 DVD-V stereo). X-10 (Tubed anlg stage), X-Pre-XA50-XA-100 amps, the little cylindrical extruded numbers, besy of all if you own a X-PSU you can easily expect £200, for one which sold from £80-110 IIRC when first out, have seen one go for £285 on Epay. LP12s are in the same vein IMHO on there.

    Now you must have sold some of those old boy !! :D
     
  8. suzywong

    suzywong
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    Before you sell it you need to play the

    "Requiem Mass for a Fallen Linn Owner"


    Don't Do It
     
  9. CJROSS

    CJROSS
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    Im sorry I have not echoed what Suzy has rightly pointed out here, for the £300 you are about to get for that TT I would be keeping it also, I have spent a good part of tonight playing around with a new (well 2nd hand but very very good buy) Moth 30 series RIAA Phono stage in MM mode running a K9 cart (on an Akito - Crowded House - Woodface - Jeff Buckley Grace both 180g pressings) not that removed from your TT Trigaar FWIW. £300 cant replace sounds like that TBPH. For example as OK mentions you could pick up a Ittok LVII for £150, sell the Basik for £50-75 on Ebay, add a £75 Cart and your outlay for a £1000 challenging TT is only £150 in total. Im sure It worked out as £150 in my head FWIW.

    Do you own a TT already ? If not it will be a firing squad at dawn Trig.

    ATB & :smashin:
     
  10. Magic

    Magic
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    I agree about the upgrade problem. I had a beautiful rosewood LP12 for 15 years before I upgraded to a Michell Orbe. It was the first deck I heard that really sounded much better (& it was a massive leap).

    Unless you're getting out of vinyl altogether I'd have the LP12 serviced by a decent dealer & change the arm (the Basik is not great). I's also keep clear of Akitos, which aren't much better & seem to make very good money these days. The Ittock is v. good, but I'm not sure that many can be had for £150 (as most Akitos seem to get upto this). The Rega RB300 is very good, although you'll need a new armboard & they are better on a glued (rather than screwed) subchassis, but they trounce the Akito & I preferred it to my Ittock too. These are usually around £100 2nd hand (go for one with a grey arm cable, rather than the older black if poss.) VTA can be a problem with some cartridges, but a good dealer can help with this. You can probably get £100 for the Basik + armboard so it should be a £40-50 upgrade.
     
  11. Triggaaar

    Triggaaar
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    Thanks for all the advice. Firing squad it is I'm afraid :( The qualities of vinyl are unfortunately lost on me, and this deck deserves to be enjoyed, not left in its box.
     
  12. overkill

    overkill
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    CJ, you is losing me again.............:D I was asking what MK X components where!! I wasn't taking the p*ss either, I was wondering if you knew about something I hadn't come across!! Yes, we did sell the MF X components. No I wouldn't waste one on a cheap DVD player.:D *you love it*


    A Linn LP12? Sell it mate..................... ;) Then if you've still got vinyl buy a good turntable!!


















    *waits for it*.................:laugh:
     
  13. CJROSS

    CJROSS
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    Easy now OK Finish your Weetabix before posting bruv.

    Whats your idea of a "cheap" DVD player BTW out of interest ?

    Oh BTW I think you will find

    "I was asking what MK X components where!!" Should read :
    "I was asking what MK X components were!!" See it happens to the best of us dude.

    Unfortunately for you dude I dont happen to think the LP12 is the best thing since sliced bread, there are plenty of new deck that give it a clean pair of heals, but for £300 a 2nd Valhalla LP12-Basik-K9 well tell what beats that at that price ?
     
  14. overkill

    overkill
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    DOH!!! :D Touche!!


    A cheap DVD? Anything in the sub £100 to £150-200 from the last couple of years, as yes, I would agree the new budget Pioneer DVD all-in-one is outrageously good value for money!! ;)


    On the LP12 CJ, I never said you did. It was humerous aside!! For £300, to be honest, I'd go for a 2nd hand Radius. IMHO, Linn helped kick start the digital revolution with the LP12. I want a turntable that just gives me the music, not it's version of the music. It was that, that turned many people off it when CD players were less "characteristic" in their presentation. Back then, if I'd had a choice between a quality CD player or a LINN, I'd have gone for the CD - once I'd heard the two. And that's from someone who (still) prefers vinyl.
     
  15. CJROSS

    CJROSS
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    Hmmmm £300 Radius whats the upgrade path on that ?, as many spare parts as a 12? for a high end TT the LP12 these days is more like a Ford Sierra IMHO many spare parts around, from entry level uo to Sapphire Cosworth level if you wish. There is no other deck with as many variations or levels of upgrade than a LP12, you may not like it for whatever reason (The Audio Note TT2 IMHO is a far better engineered deck a LP12 clone as well) but second hand wise below £600 I dont know a better bargain.

    OK - surely a £300 Radius will give you its version of the music as much as a LP12 will it not, every device in the world "colours" music to some extent IMHO. So the LP12 set the CD world alight did it because it tainted the playback of music so much, so why all the views these days of how harsh CD players sounded back then, I think improving CD recording quality has done more than improved CD players "technologically" ever has.

    Are you really telling me that you got into CD because of vinyl playback from a LP12 ??? And you preffered CD from early 80s to the early 90s even when the majority of CD recording quality was pants ?

    Have you been smoking again ?
     
  16. overkill

    overkill
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    I tell you what CJ, you really do come out with some grade 'A' b............. ;) You been drinkin'?

    What difference does the upgrade path make if you don't like the sound in the first place? I've heard the LP12 with the full Ekos/ Troika path and still wasn't blown away even by comparison with cheaper players. The Audio note deck has a similiar suspension system, but an LP12 clone? :confused:

    OH BTW the radius can be upgraded, for example to an Artemiz/Shiraz, & one went recently on Ebay for £750 with that combi. The Xerxes can be had for around £300-400 depending on arm cart combi & version. Back on the LP12 the Rega arms were not recommended as partners, as they didn't get on with Linn suspension.


    The whole point of buying turntables from Roksan and other stables was exactly the opposite of what you're claiming, that is that the players imprint is completely minimised. The Xerxes is famous for being an "open window". By Linns own admission, that's not what their ethos is, or what they want from their TT's. As one of their reps once double whammied "you can tell it's a Linn playing before you even go in the room". Exactly. Which is why I don't want one thanks................

    I always found LP12's hideously coloured, so yes I did prefer, for example my own CD2 to the LP12. If you think the CD2 sounds "harsh" then you obviously haven't heard one. I also note with interest the "CD recording was pants in the 80's and 90's"?? ALL CD's from the 80's & 90's were pants? :oops: Uh, huh.


    I do like my personal preferences being questioned CJ, perhaps i'll put my love life up next, and you can tell me where i've gone wrong there as well................;)
     
  17. Triggaaar

    Triggaaar
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    Hi overkill,

    Unfortunately, due to forum rules, you can't make an offer on this thread, I'd have to pop it in the classifides first. Thanks for the interest anyway.

    ;)
     
  18. overkill

    overkill
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    You talkin' about my love life here???:D Sorry Triggaaar I don't swing that way. You can still "put it on" the classifieds page thou'...... ;)




    Oh, you mean the LP12!! Sorry, I don't swing that way either ;)











    But I think you know that............:)
     
  19. CJROSS

    CJROSS
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    OK I give up lets face it any time we converse you seem to take the wrong end of the stick and go off on one, which Im pretty fed up with TBH, to take one of your daft comments above you are suggesting that when CD arrived that people who were used to vinyl presenatation went all out for CD because of how LP12s sounded and how they “coloured” the sound (this I find funny today having a handle on how digital sounds and how my LP12 sounds), you may not have meant this but that is how your views above come across to me and probably others, I think sometime you have trouble getting onto a post what you actually mean, hence when “questioned” you really go to town and take it personally.

    FYI I did not say all CDs in the early 80s to the early 90s were pants but large sections of it where pretty unlistenable, even now I can only call a few of my discs from that era as well recorded (FYI Gracelands Paul Simon – Katye Bush – The Whole Story – Stevie Wonder Innervisions there more but the vast majority is unlistenable go try Eric Clapton 24 nights) these days a lot more are “listenable” ie the majority. As for AN TTs being LP12 clones, well lets just say they are based on LP12s with mods, just like LP12s were copied from other suspended decks of its era and engineered to better tolerances. So the choice of word “Clone” is maybe a bad one. But handy for you to make an argument out of nothing.

    Finally note where have I even once said the Radius is deficient in any manner ? I just don’t seem to buy into how bad a LP12 is, Mines is pretty similar to my DVD-DAC combo albeit with a more fluid presentation but that’s vinyl, the problem you have with me is that I don’t think the sun shines out of LP12s backsides (im not claiming anyhting about the sound as you have said above so what the fudge are you on about ?) I am saying for £300-600 you can pick up a pretty fantastic first time vinyl spinner that would embarrass CD replay below £1000 IMHO as you would with a Radius TT, you are going out of your way to rubbish this ethos AFAICT, which to me makes your arguments more personal aimed at my views than any logic in audio terms.

    Seems to me like you twist my words to have a go well Im ignoring you from now on and don’t send me any PMs like you did before if you would be so kind tyhere is no need. Is you name Mike by any chance ?
     
  20. overkill

    overkill
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    I would say the means what it says. That more often than not CDs were bad in 80 and 90's. Again when it comes to some of the re-releases I would agree. But the new releases were normally of a high standard from 88' onwards.

    CJ, I did not say that "people" by which I assume you mean "the majority" switched to CD because of the LP12. However, going on the large number of people i've come across who cited the LP12 as their last vinyl contact and never looking back as result, I'd have to say from my experience it had negative effect on vinyls future - at that time. They also tended to cite similar reasons to mine.

    Yes, you were making a general point on sound. However, I wouldn't argue, but my point was that Roksan aim not to do that while Linn actually do!!

    Sorry CJ, if you think, as I have stated my PERSONAL opnion on the LP12 is wrong, but hey, as you said once before, its a forum!! I am not out to rubbish your points, (i enjoy debating with you!)and it's you that's taken it personally. Hence once again I was accused of being on something, "what the fudge" am I talking about etc.....

    If you feel you have been insulted then I apolgise, but as you're not playing anymore I guess that's a waste of time..........:(
     
  21. chrisgeary

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    honestly, can you two stop arguing in everyone's threads?
     
  22. overkill

    overkill
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    Fine by me..............:blush:
     
  23. Nimby

    Nimby
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    Hi

    I think the point about the LP12 is that it communicates with the soul. It brings emotion to the music that CD simply cannot achieve at affordable prices.

    The major problem with the Linn is its need for pampering. Unless you have been taught how to set one up properly your power to maintain your own LP12 is handed to a dealer. I consider this a form of slow suicide for any product.

    Comparison between a half decent CD player and an LP12 is not easy. The CD player sounds loud, exciting, has masses of bass, silent background & real imagary. In comparison the LP12 sounds fairly gutless on direct comparison between the same LP & CD on quick A/B testing.

    The problem is that on the LP12 your spine will tingle like a Pavlov response to stimulii you can't even start to explain. The CD will pass this critical point in the music without a flicker from your spine. Nor will tears ever well up in your eyes on cue listening to any CD player that I've ever heard.

    But, you either love snap, crackle and pop or (like me) you detest a single pop in a whole LP side. Which is why as my record collection grew more tired and noisy my LP12 sat for years on top of a cupboard unused. I actually preferred the obvious grain and artificiality of a second hand CD63SE to crackling records. Even without the emotion.

    Desperate final upgrading to an Ittok LV8 and DL304, new bearing and inner platter and Valhalla didn't cure the aging record collection. Record availablility is now almost zero except for second hand. Those I've purchased second hand have been as bad as my own records or worse.

    I should have sold the LP12 years ago. But my wife still remembers how much the damn thing cost when we could ill afford it. Not to mention the endless arm and cartridge upgrades over the decades. :blush:

    Sorry to interrupt. I'll let you get back to the musac. ;)

    Nimby
     
  24. overkill

    overkill
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    I don't enjoy surface noise either. However, a good phono stage/arm/ cartridge combi should sort most of that out. My current setup, even with quite poor LP's has very low interference levels. A mate of mine, long commited to CD, was shocked at just how little surface noise gets past a good setup.

    I must admit, the last time I heard an LP12 (amps were Naim nac92/nap90) I was a little surprised at the amount of noise that came thru............. :confused:

    I'm not sure about soul :D, I prefer LP reproduction because I've not heard a CD/digital source (I have an SACD/DVD-A player as well) give me what I want, for a variety of musical reasons. Maybe one day........

    Hopefully before the floor gives way under the weight of all those Lp's! :laugh:
     
  25. Nimby

    Nimby
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    I could have saved a lot of words if I'd simply said that a CD player tells you what was played. While the LP12 tells you why it was played, and how.

    I keep hoping the DVD will finally drag us into the digital age with a level of reproduction that will flatten the LP12 once and for all. Then we can get on with the 21st century instead of being stuck in the 19th. :blush:

    Nimby
     
  26. karkus30

    karkus30
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    Put your fingers in your ears, dont listen to the pied piper of vinyl nirvana, you will end up selling your wife and kids, I know, I was a victim :rolleyes:

    Now Im sat up every hour of the night dusting off and playing albums like a chain smoker. I dont sleep any more, I cant walk past a secondhand vinyl shop without getting a fix. Ive got callouses from adjusting my azimuths, tracking weights and VTA, my 'works' consist of carbon brushes, weight balances and spirit levels :suicide: hes a monster dont let him talk you into it :eek:

    ........it will start by teling you to by a Roksan, just a Radius or a Xerxes (must find one with a straight arm board). He will seduce you with thoughts of Rega 9s and 1000s or SME IV. Finally he will point you in the direction of brand new Ortofon Cartridges from a guy on the Ebay, who sells them for less than half of list price (in my case a third of :eek: ).......

    Then you will be hooked..........hes the lord of evil - vinyl incarnate :devil:
     
  27. karkus30

    karkus30
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    Surface noise, pops , crackles My Oracle Delphi/RB300/OrtofonMC20 supreme had that problem, vinyl was hanging on the edge, about to be dumped after several reprieves.

    But not now, with a Xexes/Origin live/Ortofon Jubilee set up, wheres the pops gone and the bass :eek: the dynamics, soundstage, just makes CD sound lifeless and muddy. Im not playing this with a few female vocals, its everything from heavy rock like Killing Joke, through to paul Simon. I dont really know how a good tt/arm combination does this trick, its like turning the focus ring on a pair of binoculars, suddenly everything is in focus and the colours are stunning.

    I was sceptical, I began to think that this tt sound was mythical, but its not.

    As for Linns, they are not a modern turntable, they have their good points in the same way as an old mellow valve radio, sort of relaxing.
    But theres good and bad Linns, most are mediocre, no matter how much care seems to have been involved in setting up. The good ones are very pleasant, but dont hold a candle to a well set up Roksan wrt timing and dynamics.
     
  28. CJROSS

    CJROSS
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    A very good point Nimby which I agree with totally, there is definitely something in vinyls playback that makes it “different” to CD playback this difference equates to a “preference” in sound terms to vinyl users which IMO is incorrectly called “superiority” over the other (I rate vinyl & CD this exact same in sound terms FWIW just different presentation), both formats (CD & Vinyl) have strenghts the other lacks IMHO (but that’s a whole other discussion)

    What I think DVD-V/A (16/24 Bit – 48Khz and above) has to offer is a difference in the bass performance from CD, you still have the detail that CD retrieves but bass becomes fuller & more articulate than CD more akin to the fluid nature of vinyl.

    Mind you these are vibes from a “mediocre” Linn LP12 owner so what do I know.

    Hey Karkus not disputing what you think you hear with your level of vinyl addiction but there are plenty of audiophiles in the world who find LP12s very good at what they require to hear (even in timing & dynamics – I don’t use terms like that TBH though), so seeing labels like “most are medicore” well that sort of comment will just irritate current owners of the old venerable deck (which for some reason brings out venom I find hard to fathom), quite a few of us BTW would not buy a one new, the best TT Ive heard in the flesh is a Audio Note TT2 FWIW in a all AN setup from Cartridge to Loudspeaker, still does not make my LP12 or others happy with it “medicore” I hope you note that level of comment does nothing to further peoples enjoyment of vinyl – especially new vinyl users that are avialble like the one above for £300, why on earth deriding a decks “flavour” has any relevance when it purely personal preference in a lot of cases is beyond me. When did this turn into the great Roksan V Linn TT thread ? A guy comes on asking about a LP12 he has found in a loft, which should fetch £300 no problems, other LP12 enthusiasts come into thread to recount their experiences and all of a sudden other owners of other decks call it “flawed” for whatever reason. The world of the audiophile is a weird one to me TBH.

    Im very happy with my LP12 as you will guess and nowhere in the world would I describe it medicore my ears just don’t hear that at all, just like I would never call anyones choice of audio kit medicore. The other thing that is so funny about how labels can be put on TTs to me is the amount of sonic “flavours” you can get from any one deck where the followiing (IMHO) can be tweaked/changed to suit what you are looking for (starting from the groove) :

    Platter surface (ringmat et al)
    Cartridge
    Tonearm
    Tonearm Cabling
    Deck Type
    Deck PSUs
    Phono Stages
    Amplifier Phono stage is fed into
    Hifi Rack imparting a sonic flavour to deck (if you believe such a thing)
    Loudspeakers
    Room acoustics

    The list goes on to infinity FWIW as you will know but do you catch my drift. FWIW there are other deck at the same price as Roksans efforts that people prefer, they for whatever reason possibly think Roksans efforts are mediocre, which as you know does not tally in with your vibes.

    ATB.
     
  29. overkill

    overkill
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    As someone who's owned both, I think Karkus should be allowed to comment without being patronised.

    The only people I know who have a go at Xerxes, are guess who? Yes, Linn owners. I bought mine from one. His loss. I'm not devoted to this turntable or biased against Linn owners. I've heard better than the Xerxes, but sadly my wallet doesn't stretch that far. However, IMHO I've not been satisfied with the Linns reproduction for many reasons.

    As for "moving on" with a digital medium???? Who cares? If DVD finally offers me what I want - great. But that doesn't mean that i've finally left the "19th century". Jeez!

    No, its called superiority because one isn't doing what the other can in the majority of areas. In other words it is superior. If your CD kit can, then fine. Mine and many others can't.
     
  30. CJROSS

    CJROSS
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    Here we go again, I am NOT patronising Karkus :lease: , now if I said his TT of choice was mediocre or crap etc etc I would be patronising him does that tally ?, I simply disagree with his opinion that My record deck is mediocre not to me it aint. Again you are making this forum a PIA to frequent TBPH.

    :censored: :censored: :censored:

    Where in this current thread from post 1 to this one do you see a Linn owner saying anything derogatory about Roksan TTs ?, what I can see it 2 Roksan deck owners having a go at Linn owners from where I stand. You guys like your Roksans fine but your are calling other people misguided who own Linn TTs, cant you see this ? again this has not happened to either of you Roksan owners.

    A moment of clarity, you are not satsifed with LP12s so what !! what about those who are ? they are pefectly within their rights to question your views when they patently don’t hear the problems you have with the deck.

    It’s a bit like a skoda fabia driver saying his car is to him better than a ford escort he drove, in a escort based thread, calling the escort anything derogatory is going to cause hassle when you have current owners who disagree with you, or maybe that’s the intention.

    Audiophilia you gotta love it.
     
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