Question Loud buzzing with Epson TW9300 with 4k material and 60Hz input

Discussion in 'Projectors, Screens & Video Processors' started by olorian, Sep 7, 2017.

  1. olorian

    olorian
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    Hi all,

    After taking the plunge and recently forking out for a TW9300 I was pretty annoyed to find out that when it is fed with either a 4k source or 4k enhancement mode is on that it emits a very loud buzzing sound which is very audible during film watching or game playing.

    After playing about it seems that this only happens when the source is 60Hz, so I have managed to work around the problem with my connect media pc by changing the output to 50Hz. However I am stuck with running my ps4 at 1080p without 4k enhancement becausee of its fixed 60Hz output. I was also looking into buying a Panasonic DMPUB700 but after speaking to Panasonic on the phone today it seems there is no way of changing the output from 60Hz to 50Hz, so that's also out.

    I have emailed Epson and got a very patronising "it can be louder when 4k is on" response followed by a request for me to measure the output in dB to see if its within spec when I complained further. I know for a fact that not all models make this noise from demoing a couple in AV shops. The buzzing also occasionally stops for a while when switching modes, though doesn't last long, which suggests to me it is a fault or at least a bad design flaw.

    It all seems very similar to this thread here which didn't seem to overly resolve the issue:
    Question - TW9300. Loud noise with 4k material and enhancement?

    The supplier I got it from seems to think that sticking to feeding it 50 Hz is a fine solution, which doesn't overly help. The only other solution I can think of is building a hush box, which I am very reluctant to do. I have looked into frequency converters to change any 60Hz output to 50Hz but I get the impression these are expensive and can lead to image issues.

    Any advice on how to sort this would be greatly appreciated. I refuse to accept the fact that such a modern and premier AV product can only handle 50Hz. In the meantime I'm going to make a video of all these issues to put online, measure the dB level of the buzz and share this with Epson to see if they will take the issue more seriously.
     
  2. True Romance

    True Romance
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    Doesn't sound right to me. Sure I've seen this mentioned before but can't recall from where or who?? If you've only just purchased it I'd reject it as faulty and get it swapped for a new one. Your dealer should help with this.
     
  3. jakimp

    jakimp
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    never heard the noise you describe and I have 800 hours on mine. I would reject it as well.
     
  4. paulr2006

    paulr2006
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    There is a very slight Whine (If thats the correct word) when using 60Hz due to how 4K works on these PJ's but it's barely audiable unless you get very close to it. With regard to the UB700 you only get it happen on the home screen as that's 60Hz, nothing when using it as a UHD player @ 24hz
     
  5. adam-burnley

    adam-burnley
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    Pretty sure this has been mentioned in the Epson 7300 / 9300 owners thread - might have been @burtonpark, but not 100% sure
     
  6. Russ 66

    Russ 66
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  7. unreel

    unreel
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  8. burtonpark

    burtonpark
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    Image-1.jpg
    I had a 9300 with a loud whine, with 4k enhancement i.e. 'buzz' mode on, in my case it was loudest on at 24Hz material. I did some research and rejected the unit within 7 days, the online dealer were very helpful, and Epson replaced it with a new unit.To illustrate the problem, I used an spectrum analizer app on my iPad to capture dBA measurements which showed a clear 10db peak frequency at 433Hz when enhancement was was on.
    The new unit, was much quieter in general, and Although there is a 4k buzz it is very faint, which does seem to be what others report.


    Edit have added the email I sent to the dealer of the noisy unit with background noise with 4k on and 4k off.

    I attach screen shots from an FFT app to further illustrate the 'whine' problem. On the first image you can see the 433hz peak of the whine which is up around 50dbA (i.e. very audible). The second image shows the same measurement with 4k image enhancement setting off and is the background noise of the fan etc and normal.

    Hope that clearly illustrates there is a problem here.
     

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    Last edited: Sep 8, 2017
  9. olorian

    olorian
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    Thanks for everyone's responses so far. Particularly burtonpark for the very useful info.
    I would definitely describe the noise as more of a buzz than a whine.
    I have uploaded a video to youtube that shows the issue. It was taken with a sony compact camera on a tripod next to my head on the seating in my cinema room:

    Epson TW9300 4k buzz with 60Hz input


    First I show my ps4 which has a 60Hz 1080p output. You can hear the buzzing click on and off when I turn the 4k enhancement on and off.
    Next is my media pc which is outputting 4k. I switch the output from 50 Hz to 60Hz and back again and again you can here the buzzing click on when the projector is fed with the 60Hz signal.
    As I said before, a couple of times the buzzing has stopped when I flip between these modes, usually preceded by the screen going black.
    I will see if I can do some spectral analysis on the buzz to see if its also at 433 Hz.

    I am positive it is a fault. I just hope Epson take responsibility for it because the dealer doesn't seem to care.
     
  10. burtonpark

    burtonpark
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    @olorian ...Whine sounds the same, however in my case I did not get it at all at 50/60hz only at 24Hz...which was even worse as it happened in all movies, so that may effect the frequency at which the 4k buzz peak appears. Did you by it online within last week, If so can't you just reject it swiftly?
     
  11. olorian

    olorian
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    @Burton I only get a slight whine at 24 Hz. It sounds like we have similar issues but at the two different frequencies.
    Unfortunately I purchased the projector about 6 weeks ago. I've recently had a child and haven't had much time to sort all this out.
     
  12. paulr2006

    paulr2006
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    Mine sounds nothing like that, it appears to be faulty to me, I could not live with that.
     
  13. simbav

    simbav
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    I get same noise on 60 Hz input. I using Nvidia shield and epson TW7300. Now using 4K 50Hz output from nvidia shield, no problem. But looks mine epson TW7300 is faulty?
     
  14. olorian

    olorian
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    @simbav The fact that most 9300s and I assume then 7300s don't make that noise suggests that it is a fault, albeit a semi common one.
    It is still a fault though and I am not prepared to live with having to feed it just 50Hz sources which is ridiculous in this day and age for an AV product that costs £3k.
     
  15. olorian

    olorian
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    For anyone interested, here's a vid of some spectral analysis I did of the buzz:



    It produces a peak at 420Hz (60Hz 4k input) that is 10dB louder than when the buzzing is off (50Hz 4k input). The majority of the non-buzzing noise (the peak at 100Hz) comes from my media PC fan and not the projector as well.
     
  16. burtonpark

    burtonpark
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    Good evidence that there is a problem, so if your getting no traction with the dealer or Epson and paid by credit card Just ask cc company to immediately refund as goods are clearly defective goods and supplier uncooperative.

    Congratulations on the new baby!!!! Life is not truly about AV!
     
  17. olorian

    olorian
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    Just to hopefully close the case for anyone interested because they are having similar issues:

    Epson finally sent me out a replacement model which I'm happy to say has resolved the buzzing issue. I can still hear a slight buzz with 4k 60Hz but nothing like it was before.

    What I'm less happy about is the replacement looks like a refurb and had 285 hours on the lamp when I turned it on.
    Plus it came with a European power cable (I'm in the UK).
    Overall I'm very dissatisfied with this whole process and Epson in general. Very good projector but terrible customer support which has been bad enough for me to never want to buy from them again.
     
  18. Russ 66

    Russ 66
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    How old was your one, couldn't you have just rejected it under distance selling regs?
    There is no way I would be happy with a refurbished one with 285 hours on it.
    They should either repair your old one or supply new.
    I wouldn't be happy if I took my brand new car in for warranty work and they gave me a 1 year old car with 10,000 miles on the clock back.
     
  19. panman40

    panman40
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    Unfortunately Russell that is epsons policy, overnighting a refurb as a replacement warranty scheme.
     
  20. Russ 66

    Russ 66
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    That is awful
     
  21. panman40

    panman40
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    I guess if it's a month or so old you would get a brand new unit, providing there was no cosmetic damage like I had on a Sony repair once I would prefer my own unit repaired and returned if I ever had the need.
     
  22. olorian

    olorian
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    The original defective projector was about 2 months old when they picked it up and it was as good as new cosmetically. I perhaps racked up about 20 hours on the lamp. I started the complaint process within a month of buying it but it took about 6 weeks to get a replacement.

    It seems that I am not the only person that has had issues with Epson customer support:
    Epson UK is rated "Bad" with 1.8 / 10 on Trustpilot
     
  23. Russ 66

    Russ 66
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    They haven’t replaced it with a like for like unit. I would take to social media, that usually does the trick with PR departments.
     
  24. panman40

    panman40
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    20 hrs in 2 months ?, is it really worth the outlay for so little use ?, I like to use mine several times a week if I can.

    The trouble with trustpilot is there will be a massive number of negative comments posted simply because more people are likely to vent than praise IMO.
    As Russ has said perhaps go to social media and get a quick resoloution, I certainly would not be happy with the service you have received.
     
  25. olorian

    olorian
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    The main reason I didn't use it much was because of the reason I started this thread - the buzzing made it unwatchable for me.
    Plus I recently had a child so it took me a while to find the time to set it up.
     

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