Lost Freeview signal after Sky Q install - Triax 110B DDU

paultoon

Standard Member
Hi all, I originally posted this in the Sky section, but was recommended to ask here. I recently upgraded from Sky HD to Sky Q and have a couple of problems following the install. Sky Q works fine, but I've lost Freeview signal so would appreciate any advice on the following:

First, previously I had Sky distributed to different rooms via a Triax Domestic Distribution Unit DDU 110B in the loft and using magic eyes. No need for that anymore with Sky Q multiroom. During the install, the installer bypassed the Triax unit - basically unplugged the two wires and joined them together. This is fine, except the Triax unit also distributed the terrestrial aerial signal, and I have now lost that signal and Freeview. I'm keen to get Freeview back in case Sky goes off or (after 18 month deal!) gets cancelled. I can't find any wiring diagrams for the DDU 110B. As far as I can see it still has the aerial input and 4 TV outputs (plus the "up link IR", which I think can be removed?) Should it still work without the Sky input/output? Or do I need to get a different distributor/splitter? This is how the unit looks now:

IMG_20200210_151312.jpg


Second, the installer also bypassed the faceplate where the main Sky Q box is located. It now looks quite messy, see below. The installer said to replace the faceplate with one with a brush that the cables will pass through. I've found one of these, but if I do this there will be no TV aerial socket, which I will need once I get Freeview sorted! Is there a neat solution? Or should I maybe try to smash out the sat 1 and 2 sockets to create holes? Not sure if possible without breaking the TV socket. This is what it looks like now:

IMG_20200210_104024.jpg


All ideas and advice welcome! Thanks!
 

Rodders53

Distinguished Member
Oh dear.
What a Bodger you got to do that install.

Q1. Why are there attenuators on the aerial input cable and Return feed from living room?
What values are each of them?


Fix #1
Aerial could go into the up link (from 'return' cable from lounge) input of DDU to feed the four rooms connected to the outs.
Cable presently in Return could feed lounge with freeview via a 2-way splitter off one of the 4 outputs of the DDU.

Fix #2
It may be possible to passive split the aerial to feed four or even six outlets. Depending on aerial, any masthead amplification, and location (for signal strength available). Based on the need to attenuate the signals...

Sadly the Triax 110B manuals or spec sheets don't appear to be found on the internet to know the gains of the amplifiers within the device.
 

paultoon

Standard Member
Oh dear.
What a Bodger you got to do that install.

Q1. Why are there attenuators on the aerial input cable and Return feed from living room?
What values are each of them?


Fix #1
Aerial could go into the up link (from 'return' cable from lounge) input of DDU to feed the four rooms connected to the outs.
Cable presently in Return could feed lounge with freeview via a 2-way splitter off one of the 4 outputs of the DDU.

Fix #2
It may be possible to passive split the aerial to feed four or even six outlets. Depending on aerial, any masthead amplification, and location (for signal strength available). Based on the need to attenuate the signals...

Sadly the Triax 110B manuals or spec sheets don't appear to be found on the internet to know the gains of the amplifiers within the device.
Ha, yes a bit of a bodge. Seems Sky installers don't like faceplates.

I'll check the attenuators and try fix #1 tonight and report back.

One question - the Sky Q box has two cables running to it, but it seems like he only bypassed one cable from the dish. So what is the second cable, and it that still running through the Triax? i.e. might I bugger up the Sky signal if I start swapping cables in the Triax?
 

Rodders53

Distinguished Member
* please read "would have been" where I say "will be" in the following...

There will be three coax cables in the faceplate to going to loft.

One will be SAT2 - direct to the LNB

Two will be the triplexer SAT1/UHF TV/FM-DAB (SAT in on DDU combined with UHF etc.,. and out via Down Link). (This is the one the installed joined the cables together in loft.)

Three will be the 'return' feed from faceplate to loft DDU Up Link input.

Installer has disconnected SAT1 & SAT2 (had no need to do that one, but...) and used your fly leads via joiners.

Triax_304114 wall plate is the back of the faceplate you have for reference.

You can get modular wall plates with F-socket double-enders affixed, but the back box would need to be extra deep to accommodate those crimped (aka compression) f-plugs without damaging (a too-tight radius) bending of the cables.
Another option may be to remove the Triax module from the faceplate (4 screws, it appears?) to leave 5 holes through which the three cables can pass... ?
 

paultoon

Standard Member
Oh dear.
What a Bodger you got to do that install.

Q1. Why are there attenuators on the aerial input cable and Return feed from living room?
What values are each of them?


Fix #1
Aerial could go into the up link (from 'return' cable from lounge) input of DDU to feed the four rooms connected to the outs.
Cable presently in Return could feed lounge with freeview via a 2-way splitter off one of the 4 outputs of the DDU.

Fix #2
It may be possible to passive split the aerial to feed four or even six outlets. Depending on aerial, any masthead amplification, and location (for signal strength available). Based on the need to attenuate the signals...

Sadly the Triax 110B manuals or spec sheets don't appear to be found on the internet to know the gains of the amplifiers within the device.
Ok, in answer to Q1, both attenuators are 10db. Why they are there I don't know. I believe we are in an overlapping signal area from two transmitters.

I tried Fix 1 and unfortunately it didn't work, still no signal to any of the TVs. Puzzling.

Fix 2 is beyond me I'm afraid, may need to pay a non-bodger installer to have a look!
 

ChuckMountain

Distinguished Member
@Rodders53 i would have agreed with you and thought fix 1 should have worked. Just wondering if there is some thing active in the aerial as there is also power supplied to that input. If that case you could use a lead from the down link to the up link to get round this limitation.

As per the other thread sky q is incompatible with triplexer or quadplexer as the signal is full frequency and overlaps the existing tv signals.
 

paultoon

Standard Member
@Rodders53 i would have agreed with you and thought fix 1 should have worked. Just wondering if there is some thing active in the aerial as there is also power supplied to that input. If that case you could use a lead from the down link to the up link to get round this limitation.

As per the other thread sky q is incompatible with triplexer or quadplexer as the signal is full frequency and overlaps the existing tv signals.
Thanks, I'll have a go and if not i'll get an engineer to look at it.
 

paultoon

Standard Member
An update: I've managed to get @Rodders53 Fix #1 to work - almost!

As suggested, I switched the aerial cable from UHF to up link input.
Then I switched the return cable from up link to down link input.
Then connected the main TV in the lounge to the return socket on the faceplate.
I now get full Freeview signal in the lounge!
However, I'm still getting no signal to the other TVs. (I did briefly get a poor signal on one of the other TVs, but I think this was just from messing around with the cables, and not connected to the aerial.)

The faceplate is still a mess. I unclipped the telephone socket and tried to feed the two wires through there but they just wouldn't quite fit. I think the solution will be a single gang "brush" plate plus a single TV socket. A job for another day! Thanks for the help folks.
 

Rodders53

Distinguished Member
Remove the attenuator from aerial feed in to the UpLink input... that might improve things on the 4 outputs?

Have you had a look at the aerial/pole or nearby wall for a masthead amplifier weatherproof box Splitters, amps and diplexers - A.T.V. Poles, Brackets, Clamps & Aerials

For the down link to work fine as you state it is connected suggests a very strong signal area and direct cable pickup, as there is no aerial in circuit via that method! What does the TV report as signal strength and quality on the different multiplex frequencies?

Have you tried the aerial back into the UHF input (with attenuator) and a link cable between UP and DOWN links to feed the 4 other sets? That is how it used to work (albeit via the lounge and $ky box cables).

If that can work you can then sacrifice one of the 4 rooms to feed the lounge return while you get a passive splitter and the bits to connect it in. (Then use it to feed the two nearest rooms from one output).
 

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