• New Patreon Tier and Early Access Content available. If you would like to support AVForums, we now have a new Patreon Tier which gives you access to selected news, reviews and articles before they are available to the public. Read more.

Answered Little help with rear speakers - pic included

jmac

Distinguished Member
Hello all
As per my picture in my current setup I already have the FR/FL/SUB at the front (2 x monitor audio shadow 60 speakers and will use my incoming sony bravia oled as the centre speaker) and the 2 atmos speakers in the roof (KEF Ci130QR)
I/m wanting to add either rear side speakers and back ones (either or both)
Couch is right up against the wall so rear ones may be an issue, also the SL one would have to go away over to the corner of the room by the door and window so it wouldn't get knocked about by kids.

My questions are can I use ceiling speakers for rear and side speakers as per picture?
Can anyone recommend some decent ones maybe about £200 each or so.
Would I be better with maybe just the 2 side ones and do 2 more atmos ones or....?

Proposeda-Model.jpg
 

ShanePJ

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
What speakers are you using at the front next to the TV?

I would suggest using another pair of these on the side walls pointing towards the settee then this will allow you to gain a 5.1.2 Atmos. I feel with the setup room confines you have, this will deliver you the best surround sound experience
 

jmac

Distinguished Member
What speakers are you using at the front next to the TV?

I would suggest using another pair of these on the side walls pointing towards the settee then this will allow you to gain a 5.1.2 Atmos. I feel with the setup room confines you have, this will deliver you the best surround sound experience
Thanks for that @ShanePJ

These are my 2 front speakers. (they actually sound very good to me anyway)
https://www.monitoraudio.com/en/support/past-products/shadow/shadow-60/

And I already have 2 of these in the ceiling as per pic:
http://uk.kef.com/ci130qr

So I was thinking maybe another 2 ci130qr kefs and then some other directional speakers further out? For a 5.1.4 setup? or would I be better with 7.1.2? or like you say 5.1.2?
 

ShanePJ

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
Because you are sitting so close to the rear and you have have so many speakers within a close proximity, Ii feel that some will cancel others out when the room gets a little lively creating a noisy experience in place of delivering a good solid surround sound experience

Ideally you would want to use some di-pol speakers with you sat so close to the rear and would recommend a pair of these as you are using the shadows.

This would then at least reduce a pair of speakers. I still have a conundrum though about having ceiling speakers and Atmos speakers both sending sound from almost identical places (i.e. the ceiling). So long as you are aware that you will not gain the full experience of height because they are both starting from the same place which could create a basic extension surround sound rather than Atmos then that's fine.

For the Atmos, I would look at C260-IDC for the Atmos giving you a little more control of the speakers to allow a little more separation

I still feel a 5.1.2 is the best option for your room too :)
 

jmac

Distinguished Member
Because you are sitting so close to the rear and you have have so many speakers within a close proximity, Ii feel that some will cancel others out when the room gets a little lively creating a noisy experience in place of delivering a good solid surround sound experience

Ideally you would want to use some di-pol speakers with you sat so close to the rear and would recommend a pair of these as you are using the shadows.

This would then at least reduce a pair of speakers. I still have a conundrum though about having ceiling speakers and Atmos speakers both sending sound from almost identical places (i.e. the ceiling). So long as you are aware that you will not gain the full experience of height because they are both starting from the same place which could create a basic extension surround sound rather than Atmos then that's fine.

For the Atmos, I would look at C260-IDC for the Atmos giving you a little more control of the speakers to allow a little more separation

I still feel a 5.1.2 is the best option for your room too :)
Thanks very much.
I also have a pair of these: Shadow 50
and a pair of these: Shadow 25

Do you think I would be better mounting either of these on the side walls in a 5.1.2 setup? (see new pic) My concern was the LS one being so far away but could that be properly compensated for in the AV setup maybe?
1111.jpg
 

ShanePJ

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
I feel that that would be the best solution for you to fully appreciate Atmos in that room. Sometimes less is more :)

If your amp is up to the job, although it is a long way, it should be fine. If however the room eq on the amp is below par, then it could create problems. But that would still not be as bad as it would be if you was to have progressed with so many speakers in the room at such close proximity. So its still the lesser of two evils
 

jmac

Distinguished Member
I feel that that would be the best solution for you to fully appreciate Atmos in that room. Sometimes less is more :)

If your amp is up to the job, although it is a long way, it should be fine. If however the room eq on the amp is below par, then it could create problems. But that would still not be as bad as it would be if you was to have progressed with so many speakers in the room at such close proximity. So its still the lesser of two evils
That is what I will do then mate :)
So the 2 kef's I already have in the ceiling.. do you think it's worth me swapping them to the MA ones you linked?
The all my monitor audio shadow speakers are 8ohm and so are the kefs, I notice the MA ceiling ones you linked were 6 ohm.. would that effect the system at all for better or worse?

A half decent amp.. I was thinking about £600, maybe a denon..?
 

ShanePJ

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
Money wise on the amp should be fine. If you are going to use them as atoms, then stick with the kefs. But if you do go with the idc monitors, then you will be able to tweak them a little to your preference.

Myself, if you feel they are lacking, then yes, otherwise keep them.
 

jmac

Distinguished Member
Thanks for all the help, Will order that amp from audiovisual online soon :thumbsup::thumbsup:
 

Goldorak

Distinguished Member
994D5713-A666-47AE-9DA6-9897E7BFD4D4.jpeg
EB03A112-63FD-43A9-93D4-DE2D536DC7A8.jpeg
I think you got all the help you need from @ShanePJ...pretty much spot on.

My only comment is this:
1. He is right...less is more...so 5.1.2 should be perfect for you.
He also could be right to use MA speakers for ceiling to keep same sound signature...
Every brand has its sound signature and mixing is not recommended even if it works.
2. If you are willing to move your couch by half a meter, you can even try 7.1.2 because you simply already have the speakers...
In this case, you swap your most powerful shadows to point 5 because you compensate for your room length (put shadow 50 in point 2 and shadow 25 in point 6)...very important that your location 6 rear speakers are inclined a bit which is possible with shadow 25...
A bit overkill but since you have the speakers :)
 

Attachments

  • 99603EE5-7F5B-471D-96E3-C32C7C90798B.jpeg
    99603EE5-7F5B-471D-96E3-C32C7C90798B.jpeg
    287.6 KB · Views: 97

jmac

Distinguished Member
View attachment 1137207 View attachment 1137208 I think you got all the help you need from @ShanePJ...pretty much spot on.

My only comment is this:
1. He is right...less is more...so 5.1.2 should be perfect for you.
He also could be right to use MA speakers for ceiling to keep same sound signature...
Every brand has its sound signature and mixing is not recommended even if it works.
2. If you are willing to move your couch by half a meter, you can even try 7.1.2 because you simply already have the speakers...
In this case, you swap your most powerful shadows to point 5 because you compensate for your room length (put shadow 50 in point 2 and shadow 25 in point 6)...very important that your location 6 rear speakers are inclined a bit which is possible with shadow 25...
A bit overkill but since you have the speakers :)
Thanks Goldy
Can't really move the couch I'm afraid but will go with 5.1.2 :D
No matter what it will be better than standard tv sound :)
 

jmac

Distinguished Member
Oh yeah @Goldorak
The Monitor audio atmos speakers are 6ohm while all my other speakers are 8ohm.. does this matter?
Thanks
 

Hoku

Active Member
Thinking about Atmos speakers is all well and good, but IMO the front 3 in both quality and positioning are a fundamental foundation. They still provide the majority of a soundtrack, Atmos or not.

You cannot use the TV speaker for your centre channel. It won’t work.

The centre channel is a huge part of the overall sound experience. So with a fixed budget I would personally always go for quality over quantity, particularly for the front 3 & sub.

If for practical reasons you can’t put a centre speaker in the ideal position (as per the diagrams posted above), you could just set the centre to ‘no speaker’ on your AV receiver and it will simply assign the centre channel sound to your left & right speakers.

But don’t even think about using the TV speaker.
 

jmac

Distinguished Member
Thinking about Atmos speakers is all well and good, but IMO the front 3 in both quality and positioning are a fundamental foundation. They still provide the majority of a soundtrack, Atmos or not.

You cannot use the TV speaker for your centre channel. It won’t work.

The centre channel is a huge part of the overall sound experience. So with a fixed budget I would personally always go for quality over quantity, particularly for the front 3 & sub.

If for practical reasons you can’t put a centre speaker in the ideal position (as per the diagrams posted above), you could just set the centre to ‘no speaker’ on your AV receiver and it will simply assign the centre channel sound to your left & right speakers.

But don’t even think about using the TV speaker.
Hi
Thanks for the info mate, The Sony AF9 or AG9 with acoustic panel is meant to make a very good centre speaker when switched to centre mode.
If it does sound rubbish I would just do as you say though.
 

jmac

Distinguished Member
On a atmos surround setup of 5.1.2 or 5.1.4 I'm sure I read somewhere the side speakers should be dropped to ear height rather than above ear height, Is this correct?
 

jmac

Distinguished Member
I feel that that would be the best solution for you to fully appreciate Atmos in that room. Sometimes less is more :)

If your amp is up to the job, although it is a long way, it should be fine. If however the room eq on the amp is below par, then it could create problems. But that would still not be as bad as it would be if you was to have progressed with so many speakers in the room at such close proximity. So its still the lesser of two evils
Nearly ready to move on all this lol.
So going with the 5.1.2 and rear/side speakers on the wall facing couch as discussed.
@ShanePJ do you think it's worth me getting 2 more atmos speakers and making it 5.2.4? much point?

edit: sorry had a read of the thread again, you think 5.1.2 is better for this room rather than 5.1.4.

cheers
 

The latest video from AVForums

Hisense U7H TV and T+A Solitaire T headphone reviews, AV/HiFi news plus, what is screen uniformity?
Subscribe to our YouTube channel

Full fat HDMI teeshirts

Support AVForums with Patreon

Top Bottom