Quantcast

Answered LG OLED65B6V burn in caused by YouTube app

Gotan

Standard Member
Hi all,

I have an a 65" B6 purchased in March from a well known high street AV specialist. Before purchasing I asked the store assistants in the LG OLED TVs we prone to image retention or screen burn (as I'd never owned an OLED panel previously). I was told that although the sets did suffer from "mild" image retention, this would quickly fade during normal use and that screen burn wouldn't be a problem. I was further assured that with included multi-year warranty any issues encountered would be resolved to my satisfaction for complete piece of mind.

6 months down the line I noticed that the B6 was suffering permanent "burn in" of the on screen buttons from the built in YouTube app (particularly the Yellow button) see the attached images. Once spotted I contacted the supplier who advised me to contact LG as the set was well within it's manufacturers warranty. The store manager & assistant also confirmed that they were aware of other customers reporting this damage and that sets were either being replaced or repaired.

Long story short, neither LG or the supplier are willing to accept any responsibility saying the damage caused was not covered by either the manufacturers warranty or the extended guarantee from the supplier. (burn in being excluded in the small print of both).

The way I see this, this was an accident waiting to happen. The built in YouTube app has both a yellow & green onscreen button in the GUI, by browsing the channels the picture isn't "static" so the auto-screen saver doesn't kick in. Pixel shift has been enabled from installation, the set has never been powered off at the socket to runs it's panel clean-up cycles as required. I've spent the past three weeks running nightly panel clear runs and have tried "burn in repair" videos which have made absolutely no difference whatsoever.

I don't accept that the damage caused to the panel is my fault, it's not due to use of any external source (Sky Q, HTPC, Xbox etc), this was caused by the built in YouTube app that comes pre-installed with the B6. I feel that either LG or the supplier should at the very least, honour the warranty/guarantee and ideally swap out my B6, at worst offer a free repair.

Sadly I feel that this case will be heading to the Small Claims Court, but I'd appreciate any advice or experience of fellow B6 owners?

Regards

DAZ (Gotan)
 

Attachments

lloydread

Well-known Member
I feel for you, this is increasingly coming up so unless Samsung is sponsoring these, this could be a reason to avoid the tech. I don't remember seeing any of these reports last year.
 

Gotan

Standard Member
Update ...

I've basically been told by both the retailer, Richer Sounds, (who my contract is with) that "screen burn isn't covered by your extended multi-year warranty, sorry", the same by the manufacturer, LG.

I'm absolutely disgusted by this, I was assured by the shop staff prior to purchase that the 2016 LG OLEDs may experience "mild image retention that would correct itself with continued use", but that screen burn wouldn't be an issue. Only to find that they conveniently exclude this type of damage from warranty in the small print.

I feel I have a case here, the damage was caused by an application that is built into the set by the manufacturer, the static yellow onscreen button is the cause of the damage and my photographic evidence proves that without a doubt.

Sadly it looks like my only recourse is to pursue this through legal channels, I've written to the Citizens Advice Consumer Department detailing my position to see if they feel I have a case against either LG or Richer Sounds.

I thought at the absolute worst, Richer Sounds would offer to go 50/50 on the repair to my OLED65B6V, all they offered was a £550 discount on another set, saying I can keep my damaged set.

I'm livid & disgusted by their "customer service".
 

Gotan

Standard Member
Mate take them to small claims court
Thanks for the support, I'm awaiting feedback from CACD to see if they think I have a case. I've noticed that a number of fellow members have mentioned taking them to court to get things resolved, they say that either LG or their supplier respond saying that they will legally contest the case fully and then you hear nothing more from the member ... if they pursued the case or backed down fearing that they wouldn't win.

Regardless of both LG & Richer Sounds having "Screen Burn not covered" in their respective warranties, I feel that LG have a responsibility and duty of care, the damage wasn't caused by any external device but the TV's own built in YouTube app which has static onscreen buttons in the GUI that has caused the damage.

I'd like to hear of any success stories of fellow members getting a result in cases like mine.
 

MultiRoom

Well-known Member
Get the offer of a discount on another set or 50/50 cost split on repair in writing, this may assist with convincing the courts that they are partly taking responsibility.
 

Gotan

Standard Member
Thanks MultiRoom, I am retaining all correspondence and still have the email from the supplier offering the £550 discount on an new OLED65B7V and me retaining my screen burnt OLED65B6V, if I do take this to small claims court I'll be taking everything including the kitchen sink with me :thumbsup:
 

woppy101

Distinguished Member
Thanks for the support, I'm awaiting feedback from CACD to see if they think I have a case. I've noticed that a number of fellow members have mentioned taking them to court to get things resolved, they say that either LG or their supplier respond saying that they will legally contest the case fully and then you hear nothing more from the member ... if they pursued the case or backed down fearing that they wouldn't win.

Regardless of both LG & Richer Sounds having "Screen Burn not covered" in their respective warranties, I feel that LG have a responsibility and duty of care, the damage wasn't caused by any external device but the TV's own built in YouTube app which has static onscreen buttons in the GUI that has caused the damage.

I'd like to hear of any success stories of fellow members getting a result in cases like mine.
As I said mate take them to court there is plenty of threads and sites showing how the yellow colour is causing premature wear, and there is no way they would let you get to the actual day in court, they will put it off as much as they can and then replace your tv, if they let it go to court and the judge found in your favour in the case of premature wear it would open the floodgates to every other OLED tv they have sold.

20/7 Burn-In Test: OLED vs LCD VA vs LCD IPS
 

dave1956a

Well-known Member
. I was told that although the sets did suffer from "mild" image retention, this would quickly fade during normal use and that screen burn wouldn't be a problem. I was further assured that with included multi-year warranty any issues encountered would be resolved to my satisfaction for complete piece of mind.

Get someone to email RS posing as a new customer asking RS the same question if they get the same answer that will help your case

The youtube app is supplied by Google so it also might be worth getting them involved as well

BTW anyone noticed that Sky One only has a logo for a short time on screen at the start of a program and after each ad break ? Maybe someone complained about screen burn from the logo sued sky, won the case or cut a deal out of court and to ensure no more problems the logo was no longer on screen all the time

EDIT.. Come to think of it how is someone supposed to know if the 'panel clear' function is working as it should? 'panel clear' is supposed to clear the screen if it does not then the set has a fault and a fault is covered by warrenty
 
Last edited:

Gotan

Standard Member
How long were these buttons on display for?
Almost impossible to say as no one times their YouTube usage. But a few hours a week, even then we are talking about catastrophic screen but by the colour yellow on a brand new OLED tv that’s only around 6 months old and with a 6 year “warranty”.
 

Gotan

Standard Member
Get someone to email RS posing as a new customer asking RS the same question if they get the same answer that will help your case

The youtube app is supplied by Google so it also might be worth getting them involved as well

BTW anyone noticed that Sky One only has a logo for a short time on screen at the start of a program and after each ad break ? Maybe someone complained about screen burn from the logo sued sky, won the case or cut a deal out of court and to ensure no more problems the logo was no longer on screen all the time

EDIT.. Come to think of it how is someone supposed to know if the 'panel clear' function is working as it should? 'panel clear' is supposed to clear the screen if it does not then the set has a fault and a fault is covered by warrenty
I’ve been running panel clears for around three weeks without absolutely no change in the damage caused by the yellow button from the YouTube app.

I’m absolutely convinced that this will be a repair only fix folks.
 

jasjeet

Member
Almost impossible to say as no one times their YouTube usage. But a few hours a week, even then we are talking about catastrophic screen but by the colour yellow on a brand new OLED tv that’s only around 6 months old and with a 6 year “warranty”.
Sure, I'm just trying to make sure I don't get stuck in a similar spot.
The warranty is useless, I've done the circles when my panel got 10 dead pixels and they wrote it off after a month of back and forth. Giving me a refund for with which I couldn't buy a new OLED with since all B6's were out of stock and a B7 was 1.5k more than the refund.

I run my pc on the OLED a lot but haven't noticed IR. Now I'm worried about the task at as it has a yellow explorer icon that's displayed for long periods. I do get the dimming of the tv every so often which is probably what's saving it.
 

Gotan

Standard Member
Sure, I'm just trying to make sure I don't get stuck in a similar spot.
The warranty is useless, I've done the circles when my panel got 10 dead pixels and they wrote it off after a month of back and forth. Giving me a refund for with which I couldn't buy a new OLED with since all B6's were out of stock and a B7 was 1.5k more than the refund.

I run my pc on the OLED a lot but haven't noticed IR. Now I'm worried about the task at as it has a yellow explorer icon that's displayed for long periods. I do get the dimming of the tv every so often which is probably what's saving it.
Be VERY careful with static yellow images mate, do a search on YouTube & you’ll find many videos of bright yellow being the most common cause of catastrophic OLED screen burn.
 

Khazul

Well-known Member
It might also be worth contacting Which UK - they can sometimes add a bit of weight to legit claims.
 

barong

Member
Good luck OP - I had a similar issue with my C6. Burn in was caused by the progress bar of a media player app. LG did not want anything to do with it, but luckily my 3rd party warranty covered it. Will be giving OLEDs a miss for the time being.

EDIT: PS there are numerous threads on the avsforums with people having similar problems.
 

iwb100

Distinguished Member
Yes. Static yellow (fully saturated), red and orange elements are what causes this differential ageing of pixels.

The pixels where that yellow box is have aged quicker than the rest around them so are less bright. We call it "burn in" but really it isn't burn in in the traditional sense. Its just pixel ageing.

One thing I've started doing with my C6 is putting up a full red screen every month or so, taking a photo and overexposing the image in a photo-editor. This will show up any early burn in (plus any existing screen uniformity issues). This is my choice as I'm running with a higher OLED light setting (75) and watching a lot of HDR.

So far all good, but this would detect any early signs of burn in and let you stop watching offending content.

Not saying its a perfect solution, but better than wrecking an expensive TV.
 

Gotan

Standard Member
Yes. Static yellow (fully saturated), red and orange elements are what causes this differential ageing of pixels.

The pixels where that yellow box is have aged quicker than the rest around them so are less bright. We call it "burn in" but really it isn't burn in in the traditional sense. Its just pixel ageing.

One thing I've started doing with my C6 is putting up a full red screen every month or so, taking a photo and overexposing the image in a photo-editor. This will show up any early burn in (plus any existing screen uniformity issues). This is my choice as I'm running with a higher OLED light setting (75) and watching a lot of HDR.

So far all good, but this would detect any early signs of burn in and let you stop watching offending content.

Not saying its a perfect solution, but better than wrecking an expensive TV.
Thanks for your input! In my case, my argument is that the damage on my B6 has been caused by use of the built in YouTube app. It’s static yellow & green buttons on the GUI never move & are not disabled while you’re browsing the channels. Hence the TV doesn’t think there is a static image & kicks in the screen saver to protect the panel.

It’s not like I’ve been abusing the B6& using it as a computer display, leaving static images onscreen for hours at a time.

The damage was caused by an internal app, and after only 6 months use of a £3000 set, this is not an isolated issue and complete unacceptable.

This morning I received formal communication from the Citizens Advice Consumer Department who are assisting me and I am fully documenting & building my case. If I receive no assistance from either Richer Sounds or LG, I definitely plan to pursue this through the small claims court for resolution shortly.
 

iwb100

Distinguished Member
Thanks for your input! In my case, my argument is that the damage on my B6 has been caused by use of the built in YouTube app. It’s static yellow & green buttons on the GUI never move & are not disabled while you’re browsing the channels. Hence the TV doesn’t think there is a static image & kicks in the screen saver to protect the panel.

It’s not like I’ve been abusing the B6& using it as a computer display, leaving static images onscreen for hours at a time.

The damage was caused by an internal app, and after only 6 months use of a £3000 set, this is not an isolated issue and complete unacceptable.

This morning I received formal communication from the Citizens Advice Consumer Department who are assisting me and I am fully documenting & building my case. If I receive no assistance from either Richer Sounds or LG, I definitely plan to pursue this through the small claims court for resolution shortly.
Yeah I'm not disagreeing. What I sort of struggle to see is how you've managed to have that button on screen for any length of time. Like it is only there between videos....and the screensaver kicks in after a minute with no activity...unless you browse videos for a long time?

The trouble here is that there is a) only limited numbers who have suffered this. b) no way for LG to easily distinguish between a systemic fault or reduced pixel life for some batches or individual failures in software causing the issue and users leaving static images on screen for extended periods.

LG are behaving as you'd expect in not wanting to take responsibility in case it opens floodgates. Equally I think they are right to be cautious because how can they determine what people's viewing habits are?

My main criticism of LG is that they aren't properly warning people of the risk factors and instead are letting forums determine them. If they warned buyers properly then I think they would give the consumer a fair choice. Instead they still pretend that permanent BI is virtually impossible...we can see it isn't...even if BI is from faulty TV's...its still not impossible.
 

Gotan

Standard Member
Yeah I'm not disagreeing. What I sort of struggle to see is how you've managed to have that button on screen for any length of time. Like it is only there between videos....and the screensaver kicks in after a minute with no activity...unless you browse videos for a long time?

The trouble here is that there is a) only limited numbers who have suffered this. b) no way for LG to easily distinguish between a systemic fault or reduced pixel life for some batches or individual failures in software causing the issue and users leaving static images on screen for extended periods.

LG are behaving as you'd expect in not wanting to take responsibility in case it opens floodgates. Equally I think they are right to be cautious because how can they determine what people's viewing habits are?

My main criticism of LG is that they aren't properly warning people of the risk factors and instead are letting forums determine them. If they warned buyers properly then I think they would give the consumer a fair choice. Instead they still pretend that permanent BI is virtually impossible...we can see it isn't...even if BI is from faulty TV's...its still not impossible.
My frustration & disgust at LG is they know full well that their OLED panels have a genuine weakness when it comes to static images (especially yellow), yet their TVs have come pre-installed with an application that has a GUI which had static yellow buttons in it (the same YouTube app built into my Sky Q box doesn’t have these static onscreen buttons), so this is an addition on a TV that is prone to damage by these very things. To me they have failed in their duty of care & by simply turning me away and refusing any kind of assistance is anti-consumer.

A simple search of forums & YouTube finds many examples of screen burn by bright yellow, the flood gates have already started to open, with customers with premature damage to their “top of the range” TVs. The phrase fit for purpose sadly comes to mind.
 

iwb100

Distinguished Member
My frustration & disgust at LG is they know full well that their OLED panels have a genuine weakness when it comes to static images (especially yellow), yet their TVs have come pre-installed with an application that has a GUI which had static yellow buttons in it (the same YouTube app built into my Sky Q box doesn’t have these static onscreen buttons), so this is an addition on a TV that is prone to damage by these very things. To me they have failed in their duty of care & by simply turning me away and refusing any kind of assistance is anti-consumer.

A simple search of forums & YouTube finds many examples of screen burn by bright yellow, the flood gates have already started to open, with customers with premature damage to their “top of the range” TVs. The phrase fit for purpose sadly comes to mind.
But to wear pixels like this the yellow element needs to be on screen for somewhere close to 500 hours. LG will argue that having that displayed for that length of time is "not normal usage". Watching 500 hours of youtube videos would be fine, but having that yellow button on screen for 500 hours..not sure that is all that easy to do.

Of course there are examples of this damage, but be careful, even from the vocal online community its a fraction of owners reporting burn in. It could be that some are unlucky and suffer prematurely aged pixels rather than it being a systemic problem.
 

Gotan

Standard Member
But to wear pixels like this the yellow element needs to be on screen for somewhere close to 500 hours. LG will argue that having that displayed for that length of time is "not normal usage". Watching 500 hours of youtube videos would be fine, but having that yellow button on screen for 500 hours..not sure that is all that easy to do.

Of course there are examples of this damage, but be careful, even from the vocal online community its a fraction of owners reporting burn in. It could be that some are unlucky and suffer prematurely aged pixels rather than it being a systemic problem.
We are talking a few hours a week tops of watching/browsing YouTube ... to see how quickly bright yellow even causes considerable image retention see the following video ... around 47 seconds and the players shirt is clearly visible above everything else ...
 

SimonST

Member
Thanks for your input! In my case, my argument is that the damage on my B6 has been caused by use of the built in YouTube app. It’s static yellow & green buttons on the GUI never move & are not disabled while you’re browsing the channels. Hence the TV doesn’t think there is a static image & kicks in the screen saver to protect the panel.

It’s not like I’ve been abusing the B6& using it as a computer display, leaving static images onscreen for hours at a time.

The damage was caused by an internal app, and after only 6 months use of a £3000 set, this is not an isolated issue and complete unacceptable.

This morning I received formal communication from the Citizens Advice Consumer Department who are assisting me and I am fully documenting & building my case. If I receive no assistance from either Richer Sounds or LG, I definitely plan to pursue this through the small claims court for resolution shortly.

Sorry if this has been mentioned before, but have you tried speaking to Richer Sounds on here?

Richer Sounds

John Clayton, their Operations Director^^. He's usually very willing to try and help sort out any problems people are having with a RS purchase, and I'm sure he'd be interested to hear your case. Unless of course you'd prefer not to :) Best of luck though getting it sorted.
 

Gotan

Standard Member
Sorry if this has been mentioned before, but have you tried speaking to Richer Sounds on here?

Richer Sounds

John Clayton, their Operations Director^^. He's usually very willing to try and help sort out any problems people are having with a RS purchase, and I'm sure he'd be interested to hear your case. Unless of course you'd prefer not to :) Best of luck though getting it sorted.
Thanks, yes. I’m waiting a reply from John & am hopeful that we can come to a mutually amicable resolution.

Still, while I’m waiting I’m documenting my case should I sadly have the need to pursue things through legal channels (which is my absolute last resort).
 

iwb100

Distinguished Member
We are talking a few hours a week tops of watching/browsing YouTube ... to see how quickly bright yellow even causes considerable image retention see the following video ... around 47 seconds and the players shirt is clearly visible above everything else ...
The mechanism in this TV that causes IR and the sort of permanent damage you see is entirely different.

IR is caused by temporary higher current passing through pixels producing yellow (or red or orange) and the TV failing to correct once that colour disappears. The variance in current passthrough is usually corrected quickly, but almost always corrected by the auto compensation cycles (that is what they are there for). This sort of IR is more akin to the "stuck images" you'd see on plasma TV's. Running slides will like with plasma, usually remove any more stubborn IR of this type.

The mechanism that has caused your damage is cumulative hours of displaying a bright colour (so those pixels being driven harder) cause a permanent drop in luminance of those pixels relative to those surrounding them. Basically all pixels over time dim. But what causes this damage is some being driven harder (being asked to display yellow/red/orange) for a significant period of time more than others.

The two phenomenon are entirely unrelated. The yellow shirt causes temporary IR because the current passing through the pixels driving them harder is equalised immediately following removal of the image. But unless that same shirt is present for hundreds of cumulative hours there won't be permanent damage.
 

Similar threads

Trending threads

Latest News

Panasonic launches SC-HTB600 and SC-HTB400 soundbars
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
Panasonic launches HX940 and HX800 4K LCD TVs for 2020
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
Elipson launches 3230 loudspeaker at Bristol Hi-Fi Show
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
AVForums Podcast: 17th February 2020
  • By Phil Hinton
  • Published
Top Bottom