Ken Kreisel Quattro Q125, TriFX, DXD-12012 - personal review

RickyDeg

Well-known Member
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Introduction
Most people with an interest in home theater know or have at least heard of Ken Kreisel. Until recently I myself actually hadn't, despite being involved with multichannel gear for almost 20 years. Embarassing? A little. Especially now that I know more about him. Some say Ken is a ‘legend’ in the industry and reading up on the man I understand what they mean by that. The Quattro series, introduced in 2013, is his first official collection of speakers while his subwoofers have been around a while. The line-up is rather flexible and can be tailored to individual needs, budgets and rooms with an assortment of fully voice-matched models. My own system reviewed here is a traditional 5.1 configuration in high-gloss black piano lacquer finish.

The speakers have been in my possession some 3 months at the time of writing. I’ve been using two different multichannel separates systems to drive them; firstly a set by NuForce (AVP-18 with MCH-300SEC7) and now recently by Primare (SP33 with A30.7). Two downscaled systems that focus on signal purity and performance fidelity over gadgets and features. No excessive post-processing or EQ have been used other than straight decoding and D/A conversion for a ‘direct’ audio path. I much prefer the transparency of an unaltered signal simply because I think it often sounds best. My room is measured approx 4x5 meters and untreated as far as acoustic panels are concerned (will soon be added). Despite this my room is fairly well-damped with thick rug, curtains and soft furnishings. The speakers took a while to break-in (the subwoofer in particular), about a week or so of continuous playback. Like most speakers the Quattro’s simply need to loosen up until they come into their own and perform as they should. Cut-off frequency is set to 80Hz for all channels. Distances meticulously measured and levels manually calibrated with a sound pressure level meter.

The system

I think the Quattro speakers have a striking look both eye-catching and discreet at the same time. They are fairly compact creations and easy to accommodate. Build quality is high and their weight alone lets you know they mean business. The cabinets are virtually ‘dead’ which is always a good sign. The four tweeters (hence the name; Quattro) undeniably make these speakers stand out, not just in terms of performance but how they look. Since I didn’t want to use the provided metallic grills I thought this odd tweeter arrangement would be a distraction but that concern quickly flew out the window as soon as I installed them. Fact is the tweeters make the speakers look really cool. The high-gloss piano lacquer finish make for a luxurious visual treat but is also highly reflective and prone to dust and fingerprints. Good thing Mr Kreisel saw fit to provide soft white gloves with each speaker - excellent for when you need to handle them and move them around. A nice touch. Worth mentioning is also the sturdy double-box packaging the speakers are delivered in. A serious approach evokes confidence.

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Q125 Front L/R
Every Quattro speaker have a purposeful angle of the cabinet intended to aim the drivers directly at the listener. This is meant to reduce reflections from room boundaries and minimize need for toe-in. It’s important to place the Q125 Fronts correctly as there are specific Left and Right versions. The speakers can be wall-mounted but really come into their own when placed on the dedicated floor stand that match the speakers visually. The stand is very heavy and provide sturdy foundation for the speakers, which in turn are bolted to the stand. Adjustable fixings on the back hold speaker cables in place. The supplied rubber feet underneath the bottom plate were a tad pathetic and quickly replaced with flat self-adheasive Soundcare SuperSpikes. This made the assembled speaker considerably easier to move around and improved overall focus and timing of the sound (like most well-made spikes often do). The cable terminals are angled upwards which can make installation using banana plugs troublesome while spades work fine. After e-mailing Ken for support he recommended using bare wire so I ended up doing exactly that. The terminals lock on to bare wire quite well. As I'm writing this I have yet to test bi-wire or bi-amping but I understand that every Quattro speaker, apart from the TriFX model, offer this possibility.

Q125 Center
There is a dedicated center speaker in the line-up which is essentially a Front R speaker flipped horizontally on a table base that is partially screwed into the cabinet. I didn’t like the look of that solution however and the downward angle of that particular version proved negative in my installation. Since my center speaker must be placed underneath the TV and lower than that of the Front L/R the angle of the center need to be upwards, not downwards or pointing straight forward like the dedicated center is restricted to. You could ignore the table base and screw the arrangement off and flip the speaker over but that would reveal the screw holes. Instead I chose a separate Front L speaker that I simply flipped with the angle pointing upwards towards me. This gave an improved perception of dialogue and better cohesion in the front soundstage. The speakers are equal and sound the same so this option works equally well. It’s simply the angle one needs to think about depending on the installation. Sadly not every region seem able to purchase a Q125 Front separately. Here I also use the same Soundcare SuperSpikes mentioned earlier.

Q125 TriFX Surrounds
I initially had a second pair of the Q125 Fronts stationed also in the rear, creating a system with identical speakers all-round. Normally that arrangement can work great but those speakers clearly did not belong in the rear dealing with surround duties so the TriFX eventually took their place. These speakers are smaller and of a different design than the front speakers, yet there’s no shortage of drivers. This model is essentially a tripole with midrange drivers on each side of the cabinet. There are multiple ways of using this speaker to control how it radiates the sound. Just as the Front L/R the TriFX are specifically intended as Left and Right. The purposeful angle of the cabinet is intended to direct the drivers directly at you when wall-mounted on each side of the listening position, or behind it. In my room I sadly could not do either so I had to place them ontop of speaker stands. Due to room limitations this was an unfortunate compromise I had no choice but to accept. Even though I picked the tallest stand I could find (that also looked the part) the speakers are still placed too low. I wish Ken would have constructed a nice floor stand to accommodate the TriFX (perhaps one that was height adjustable) but sadly he did not. For the tripole surround effect to reach it’s full potential these speakers also need walls to bounce the side-radiated effects off of. In my room there is no wall directly to the left (open-type architecture apartment). Still, the surround sound works so TriFX seem a rather forgiving speaker. Placed according to Ken’s recommendations I reckon more can be had from these though, provided one has the ‘right’ room - something rather rare in modern apartment buildings.

DXD-12012 Subwoofer
The DXD-12012 is currently the biggest subwoofer in Ken’s line-up, featuring a dual 12” woofer arrangement. I initially opted for the smaller DXD-808 but because I crave bass and wanted to be set for the future I ended up with the bigger brother. Plenty of in-depth information and reviews can be found online covering the technical aspects of these babies, including the upgrade option of having 2 or 4 of them stacked ontop of each other (!). This supposedly yields an improved end-result as I understand it. Ken calls it “DUO” or “QUATTRO” stacks. I have yet to experience that type of arrangement but can confidently say I don’t lack bass with just the one unit. This is a big and clunky subwoofer, for sure, but surprisingly easy to handle. They are designed to be placed directly in a corner which was perfect for me as the only area where I can actually house a subwoofer is in the front right corner of my rather smallish room. The build of the unit is a mixed affair with piano lacquer sides and the rest in standard black MDF. I think it works though and matches the other speakes nicely. The backside is well thought-out and feature little green dots at the recommended settings so I reckon it would be hard to do wrong here. Quality inputs are provided, including balanced XLR for higher-end systems. One omission is the lack of a 12V trigger input which I must say should be a given on all powered subwoofers, especially at this price. The same rubber feet as the stands came with this unit but replaced with Soundcare SuperSpikes.

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Listening impressions - Movies
In short – the Quattro system is effortless, immersive and powerful. Pop in the Blu-ray for “Pacific Rim” and the first thing that strikes you is the formidable transient response and dynamic range filling your entire listening space. The next thing that strikes you is the smoothness in which these attributes are delivered – nothing is allowed to screech or grate at your ears causing you to lower the volume. Something I welcome. Make no mistake - there’s plenty of ‘bite’ and ‘attack’, just without sibilance. The soundstage is very generous in width and depth. It becomes clear quickly that this system have the type of authority which demands your attention but without being aggressively forward. There’s plenty of headroom on offer which makes blockbuster soundtracks an absolute thrill. At this price there should be little-to-no compression of dynamics and these speakers deliver in that respect. In fact - it packs real punch with no sign of breaking up. There are similarly priced speaker systems that exhibit these traits but not all of them manage with so little distortion. The Quattro system stays clear, detailed and composed during the many massive action sequences in this particular film. One just has to make sure accompanying electronics are up to par because it’s evident this system thrives on quality signal and amplication. It’s not all about brute force however though – it’s just as much about delicacy and dynamic contrast. During subtler moments the system projects micro-detailing buried within the mix to great effect only to instantaneously explode with prowess when the soundtrack requires it.

Switching to my favorite sci-fi thriller “Sunshine” it became clear just how well this system deals with atmospherics and a sense of scale, or for that matter – a sense of claustrophobia. The speakers delivered a good dose of realism, almost like being onboard the Icarus space vessel. The system also have this eerie way of projecting detailed cues in the mix that makes it appear as though I have more speakers in play than just a standard 5.1 configuration. The expansive layering of effects in both the front and rear easily draw you in. Clearly the TriFX surrounds are in no small way a contributing factor to the generous bubble of sound. Another compelling aspect was the beautiful rendering of the score by composer John Murphy, sounding lush and nuanced through the Quattro's. I could pick out every note separately as the score almost became it’s own entity. Last time I got chills like this was when I saw the movie in the theater back in 2007.

Animated films of high quality often have reference soundtracks to accompany the visuals. Among those are my personal favorites “Finding Nemo” and “Toy Story 2”. There’s plenty of panning dialogue in these soundtracks with directionality of voices that travel not just from side-to-side but front-to-back. This can be a challenge for many speaker systems, even ones that claim they are voice-matched. Thankfully the Quattro’s excell here! I never find myself distracted by voices changing in tone as they move freely around the soundstage. Truly convincing! These two movies also contain a surprising amount of information in the surround channels and the TriFX were again up to the task. Not only do they disperse sound in the back of my listening room but help fill in the gaps towards the front. The effect is seldom one of distraction though, but rather one that hangs in space around the speakers and outward to the sides. This is surround sound unlike anything I’ve heard in my home before! Then again, I’ve only ever had direct-firing speakers in the rear and even though that can work well enough they often call attention to themselves. The TriFX offer the best of both worlds; immersiveness and directionality. A truly multi-talented speaker!

Getting back to the topic of dialogue (an oh-so important aspect of any home theater) the Quattro’s handle well-recorded male and female voices with great levels of poise and clarity. During the first month of owning the system I watched all three initial seasons of my latest obsession “Game Of Thrones” on Blu-ray and marveled at the dialogue reproduction. This show have very high production values with well crafted soundtracks (almost too good for a tv show). At times it was as though the actors were in the room! This is the kind of life-like reproduction that’s hard to come by, even for speakers at this price. Ontop of that I was once again struck by the whirlwind of enviromental and atmospheric cues projected around the listening space, not to mention the realistic clinging of swords and deep, heavy thuds of galloping horses. It’s surprising how much bass they’ve incorporated into these soundtracks but the DXD-12012 was happy to keep up the pace.

One of the most appreciated movies in terms of bass-content is probably Steven Spielberg’s “War Of The Worlds”. Virtually every tripod sequence is a testament to that. When the first tripod cracks the pavement open to reveal itself during the beginning of the movie the rumble of deep bass was excellent through Ken’s subwoofer. I could feel the bass as much as I could hear it, which is how it should be. You get plenty of powerful low frequency pressure with the DXD-12012, that’s for sure, adding to the sense of scale and tension. But the greatest aspect of this subwoofer is actually what you don’t get – distortion. It connects to the room in a way that seem to cancel out nasty room modes, or at least minimize them. There is less of that ‘boomy’ character I’ve been accustomed to with other more traditional subwoofers. This is a controlled beast that mesh with the Quattro satellites really well. And all this is without any room EQ applied. What you get here is clean and accurate bass capable of digging out plenty of low level detail.

Turning to a movie I love to hate - “Prometheus”, by Sir Ridley Scott, I was once again impressed by the level of musicality of the score and the immense atmospherics achieved by the Quattro’s throughout the movie. No matter what I may think of the story and the actors this is visual and aural filmmaking at it’s best. While nowhere near as creepy or scary as the original “Alien” the soundtrack alone helps to at least create a sense of excitement. And during the climax as the gigantic alien Juggernaut ship decend to it’s fate the immersiveness and room-shaking bass was absolute! This is on-the-edge-of-your-seat sound reproduction! The kind that grabs hold of you from the get-go and don’t let go until the very last frame. It’s a good sign when a speaker system manage to make you overlook the many flaws of a flawed movie, at least for the duration, and simply just go along for the ride!

Listening impressions - Music
Hearing how well the Quattro system dealt with instrumental movie score I was anxious to dig into live concert material. I enjoyed Blu-rays covering everything from Dave Matthews, U2, Roy Orbinson and Madonna to The Police and Adele. Sure enough - the transient response, dynamic range and smooth overall character shone through here as well, making well-recorded mixes feel like the live event. Instruments sound full-bodied and voices, while crystal-clear, sound as forward or subtle as needed be. The TriFX lends a nice feeling of envelopment to audience sheers and ambience without being intrusive. As long as the source allows threedimensionality is quite good. It’s fun to really crank the volume with this system because it’s so detailed and composed. It’s rather unusual for speakers mainly aimed at movie reproduction to be so well-rounded with music but Ken have succeeded.

Turning to regular 2-channel it’s evident that the Q125 Fronts can master this pretty well, delivering an enjoyable listening experience. They do need support from a subwoofer though, for sure, since they aren’t full-fledged full-range stereo speakers. Sound that fills my entire listening room is what I demand these days though which is why I find plain 2-channel hopelessly flat and boring regardless of speaker. Music can really come into it’s own in multichannel if you ask me and good recordings can have that amazing toe-tapping effect when pumping through every speaker around you. Norah Jones beautiful album “Come Away With Me” on 5-channel SACD never sounded so alive or breathtaking! The Quattro system breathed new life into her delicate voice. It was a joy to listen from the first track to the last.

Pink Floyd’s classic “Dark Side Of The Moon” was an equally enthralling listen. The regular 2-channel CD almost sounds dull in comparison to the more fleshed-out and dynamic SACD. The multichannel remix seem to have almost liberated the music and removed a layer of fog. Instruments have much more ‘air’ to them and are better defined when separated across several speakers. Additional detail and nuances can be heard on basically every track. The Quattro system delivered tight bass, clean and clear cymbals and excellent vocal presence.

One of my all-time favorite rock/pop/alternative albums comes from American singer Billie Myers, titled “Growing Pains”. It’s an excellent album with equally excellent recording qualites. This was actually the first multichannel music disc I ever bought and it excites me to this day. The Quattro speakers made re-discovering this album a really fun experience. Her rough and unique voice is made full justice, spread out over all three front channels, giving me chills. There are a couple of songs on this album with bass depth completely lacking on the standard CD and the DXD-12012 had me feeling the bass in my gut, but without overhang or thickness. Bass was quick and taught all the way through. The playful use of the surrounds was beautifully excecuted through the TriFX as well. It was the kind of enjoyment that had me closing my eyes singing along to the music.

Next up came one of my passions – isolated instrumental movie score. My ultimate favorite being Polish composer Wojciech Kilar’s classic work for Francis Ford Coppola’s Bram Stokers Dracula. I have mixed feelings about the movie but the score is sublime! Majestic, haunting, lush and romantic in every sense. Sadly there is no multichannel edition of this score, traditional 2-channel only, but thanks to Primare’s DSP-mode for spreading stereo in all channels I was able to enjoy the music the way I feel it was meant to – coming at you from all directions. Despire going against my own principles this DSP-mode works surprisingly well. The Quattro's belted out the aggressive tracks on this cd with believable, yet silky-smooth, authority. Low-key tracks sounded delicately beautiful. Instruments were defined in a way that I could almost sense the space between the musicians in the recording session. It’s been a while since I heard this score from beginning to end but enjoying it with this system that became inevitable.

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Summary
If memory serves me correctly this is my 9:th multichannel speaker system in 20 years. That’s a lot of speakers. Apart from the acoustics of the room no single aspect of our system have as much of an impact on the end-result as speakers. Electronics have their fair share but not to the same extent. And boy did the Quattros have an impact! Ken Kreisel have done an extraordinary job with this system and I’m officially a fan. Watching movies have elevated to a very exciting level and music is an enthusiastic experience difficult to switch off. Each satellite speaker works in unison with the potent subwoofer to deliver the goods; highs are extended and energetic yet smooth and non-intrusive, midrange full and lively and low frequencies room-filling but not over-blown. Simply put; there is great balance to the Quattro system. Nothing is ever perfect though and even if I have slight reservations about certain issues I have very few in terms of performance. You get what you pay for here. Are there speakers with better performance? Of course there are. But I’d say you’d have to pay a substantial fee, plus everything is subjective and in realtion to your personal preference. As for me, I’m glad I’ve found a system now that I can safely say I want longevity with. Perhaps not the next 20 years but then again who knows?

Positives
+ Strong dynamic capabilities
+ Excellent transient response
+ Large soundstage with perfect channel-to-channel coherence
+ Works with movies and music alike
+ Beautiful design

Negatives
- No matching floor stands for the TriFX surrounds
- Dedicated center with questionable angle and table base attachment
- No 12V trigger on subwoofer
- Useless rubber feet
- Prone to dust and fingerprints


Associated equipment
A/V processor: Primare SP33
Multichannel power amplifier: Primare A30.7
Blu-ray player: Oppo BDP-103D
Music server: Naim UnitiServe HDD
Cabels: Supra
Mainsfilter: Isotek EVO3 Aquarius
Resonance decoupling: Soundcare SuperSpikes / Nordost Pulsar Points

Disclaimer
This review is based solely on personal experience and opinions and should be judged accordingly. I am basing this on how the Ken Kreisel Quattro speaker system performs to my ears under my specific circumstances; using my associated equipment, in my particular room.
 
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RickyDeg

Well-known Member
^ Much appreciated! :) Glad you checked it out!
 

Member 116841

Distinguished Member
The subs were designed with studios in mind - hence no 12v triggers, and why there is no auto standby when connected with balanced XLR cables.

Nice review RD!
 

RickyDeg

Well-known Member
^ Thanks for checking it out, David!

I heard about the reason behind the 12V trigger omission but seeing as these are consumer products a trigger inclusion would have been a nice addition ;) But it's nothing major.
 

RickyDeg

Well-known Member
^ I'm not taking about what studios buy or what functions they may/may not be in need of. Yes, that might be the reason behind the omission, but that's still irrelevant here. This whole speaker line, and my review, is consumer related. Hence, I am using it in my home as a consumer, as would most people who visit this site to begin with. I am not a studio who bought a studio product. Even though we can't always have it all the fact that a 12V trigger is not part of the DXD line-up is an omisson however you choose to look at it. If you personally use that function or not is another issue. I normally would personally, because it offers the most energy-efficient solution and in some cases a more reliable start-up and shut-off.
 

Member 116841

Distinguished Member
No disrespect intended Ricky, but maybe a little more research would've unearthed this fact before your purchase - or at least a one on one with a dealer to point these things out - unfortunately, this doesn't seem to be the case in the UK.
 

Palpable

Active Member
No disrespect intended Ricky, but maybe a little more research would've unearthed this fact before your purchase - or at least a one on one with a dealer to point these things out - unfortunately, this doesn't seem to be the case in the UK.

Woosh

I think you've completely ignored Rickys' point.
 

Member 116841

Distinguished Member
I fully understand Ricky's point.

Ken hasn't put anything in these subs that could possibly detract from their sound quality, and that includes low end filters like most subs have.

The DXD subs and the Quattro speakers are the exact models that studios have been using so far. They were used for the Oscars for monitoring purposes, for example. Making "domestic "versions just adds to the cost.
 

RickyDeg

Well-known Member
No disrespect intended Ricky, but maybe a little more research would've unearthed this fact before your purchase - or at least a one on one with a dealer to point these things out - unfortunately, this doesn't seem to be the case in the UK.

It's fully alright David. But I in fact did make lots of research before my purchase. Almost two years worth of reading and chatting with owners as matter of fact lol. I saw photos of the backside of the MX-5000 Mk3, as it was called a while ago, and so I already knew it didn't have a 12V trigger input. It was not a deal breaker which is why I still made this purchase. No regrets.

That said, it's still a negative omission in my point of view - hence why I mention it as such in my review, alongside the other negatives. It's an honest review, from my side of things. That's all.
 

dinoprada2003

Distinguished Member
Great setup great review thank you Ricky !! :)


Sent from my iPad using AVForums
 

Ellisdj

Well-known Member
Nice review Ricky but to me the fact you are not getting full sound thrills from 2.1 and your switching to multi-channel shows me you've still got some way to go yet in getting things on top of their game.
Good focus on 2.0 or 2.1 playback invariably leads to Much Better 5.1 etc as well so is worth pursuing
There is no substitute for proper 2.0 or 2.1 with Music in my opinion.

Meridian try with Trifield and this logic was put out there by Linkwitz years ago that 3 speakers are better but this is very different to switching into mutlichannel modes on a processor which is adding digital processing which is the opposite of ideal.

Get the room acoustic treatments (know your planning it) - pay attention to the source of your music and how you feed the processor, has to be digital not analogue - this is all extremely important and using multichannel for music will be a thing of the past just like using EQ (you know I was on at you about that ages before you did it :)

All the best
 
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Ellisdj

Well-known Member
In addition first thing I would be looking to do is upgrade the power supply to the Unitiserv (if not done so already)
Thats a very expensive unit for what it is - inside its powered via a Pico PSU which is a £35 unit. Nothing wrong with these to a degree (got one in my audio pc) but they work much better off good quality linear power supplies. Teddy Pardot or These or These (have bought 2 LPSU from this company both excellent)
Or this one probs be best - If you do buy this one please say EllisDJ recommened you as I will attain recommendation credit rightly earned.
:) All the best
 
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RickyDeg

Well-known Member
Hey you! :) Thanks for checking my review out! :smashin:

Don't interpret me wrong; 2-channel in general can sound terrific and the Quattros are no slouches in terms of stereo (with sub) reproduction in my room. I actually put them on par with the capable qualities of my old JM Lab Electra 926 (and I enjoyed those). It's more a question of me being spoiled by the immersiveness of high-resolution multichannel that have done this to me. In comparison any 2-channel rig sounds hopelessly "dull". It may not be interesting for many others but I want to be immersed into the music, whether that's a live concert on Blu-ray or a record. It's nothing new. I been preferring music in multichannel for years, preferably high-resolution. This isn't something recently sprung up.

For traditional 2-channel music that is not available in multichannel I sometimes utilize DSP. What the Primare processor does with it's DSP-mode for stereo is basically to put the same stereo signal for front L & R in the rear L & R. That sounds very odd to purists and isn't how it was meant for stereo to be reproduced, I fully get that. Primare adds digital processing but it doesn't seem to loose any transparency. I love the music being pumped out like that all around me, and the feeling of immersiveness and three dimensionality is awesome. Carefully tailored (level-matched) it sounds tremendously more engaging than 2-channel and I can easily sit and listen for hours on end. Those rear TriFX speakers are wonderful at music playback, much more so than I dared to expect for such a speaker design frankly.

I know you're in love with your 2-channel rig and I wouldn't be surprised if it sounds stupendous! Not gonna rule out falling in love with plain 2-channel myself again but at present I can't see it happening. Room acoustic treatment is WAY overdue in my room (as you know by now, hehe) and I'm very much looking forward to that. We got repair construction work to do in this apartmentbuilding which is not yet finished, that's why I'm holding off installing things on walls or in the ceiling.

Great you mention the power-supply for the Naim UnitiServe! I'm currently using IsoTek EVO3 Aquarius for my entire system but wouldn't mind testing other alternatives. I'll check out your recommendation. I agree though - the UnitiServe is very expensive for what it does. I was lucky to buy it for a reasonable price however. I appreciate the simplicity, the quiet operation, convenience and interface for my iPad. I download more high-resolution to it these days than rip CD's and it works swimmingly! But multichannel DVD-A and SACD's are still my absolute favourites! There's a lot of pure audio Blu-ray coming now as well which is thrilling! Just spent the weekend with Amy Winehouse, Nirvana, Beck and Diana Krall. They all sounded great in high-resolution multichannel.
 

Ellisdj

Well-known Member
The Untiserv is a convenience product and your paying for software interface as much as anything there.
I had the exact same product but Meridians version - MC200. While these are good corners are cut to keep cost down and inevitably the overall performance suffers - not as good as it could be

Your Aquarius Mains Conditioner is a good unit - However the power supply to the Unitiserv is something very different. It probably comes with a standard plug in the wall or laptop style brick - these are rubbish for SQ. The links above are Linear Power Supplies that replace that brick. Power supply is all important - The Most Important factor of all kit - hence why Naim sell upgraded supplies for nearly all their kit and have Linears inside nearly all of their kit. Its one of their best factors and why they are expensive

If you get your setup right - bass performance and integration is key to everything and pay attention to the source then simple CD playback can rival what you get in multichannel high def from 2 (2.1) channel (to surprising degrees in its own way). This is far more rewarding because its difficult to achieve. Blu Ray content will sound pretty good no matter what because there is no compression and there so much sound it creates its own stage to a degree - the isolation of 2 speakers or 2 speakers and sub shows things up much more.
All work done here though benefits everything else so its worth investing time in - that's what I was trying to say
 

RickyDeg

Well-known Member
I'm aware of what you point was, that's not the issue. I have demoed several well-integrated 2-channel systems in acoustically treated rooms over the years (some costing astronomical sums of money, others more moderate) and was often very impressed. I know what good 2-channel can be like, and it's very good in my system today. Still can't give me the same immersion into the music that I was trying to get across above. Multichannel have spoiled me. My set-up right now with the Quattro's and Primare is more balanced and well-integrated in 2.1 and 5.1 than I even dared to hope for in my currently non-treated room. Once I have that part down it'll be icing on the cake. I'm spending more time listening to multichannel content than I ever have before and that's unlikely to change anytime soon.
 

Ellisdj

Well-known Member
Thats fair point - your preference is just that mate and I respect
My point is you can have the cake and eat it with AV good AV and Hifi.

if you consider what your listening to - when ever do you sit on the middle of a performance.
You always sit in front of it - hence the phantom soundstage in front that hifi creates.

You have spent considerable change to get the system to where it is, you care enough to do this - I have been there as well and just trying to help to take it up several knotches to where it can be. You are always resistive but will cave in the end :)
 

RickyDeg

Well-known Member
lol :laugh:
 

Ellisdj

Well-known Member
The only problem is - once you experience the benefit of a Linear Power Supply on something supposedly trivial like a pure digital source you will want one for the rest of your kit - more ££ :)
Been there as well. Swopping the Disc Drive for a SSD will bring sound benefits as well - however you need them to release a large version upgrade 1TB is largest SSD's I have seen

Glad your happy with the speakers, I would like to give them a go for a few months see how they fair up to MA Plat's. I was all set to get DXD1202 sub but the reviews and home demo of the SVS sold it to me.
Another very very good sub

PS about you being resistive - I said you only need 1 sub setup well to give good bass - you was adamant you needed 2.
2 will be better but its not essential. See I am always right :)
 

RickyDeg

Well-known Member
I've heard similar feedback from others about power supplies so I'll be looking forward to trying some out.

SSD would be awesome on the UnitiServe, and a 1TB most def!

Give the Quattro's a go! But those MA Platinums are amazing!!! Wish I could stop by to have a demo in your house. Would be very interesting. I'll hold off commenting on that subwoofer remark in terms of the DXD until I've experienced a stacked DUO or QUATTRO set of the 12012. But 1 works in my room!

I'll hold off commenting on that "I'm always right" statement too! :D lol
But granted, you've been correct on a lot I've found before. Don't inflate too much now :rotfl:
 

Ellisdj

Well-known Member
That's just me pulling your chain
ch0001068

Quoting Short Round - "I keep telling you, you listen me more you will listen longer" - well I changed that a little bit
Were all on the same journey I believe - however some care more than others, some are luckier than others. You care I can tell -I know you care about aesthetics more which is fine, I am in the opposite camp to a degree.
Its all about helping each other out and suggesting the way forward - up to the person reading to try it or not.
For example if you learned how to measure then setup a Hard Knee House Curve on your sub - you would never consider listening any other way again. I was resistive as first but cant imagine ever setting anything else up on the sub - its the way forward. Anthems new ARC does this as well - but done differently - that using specific data to plot a curve that was deemed the best sound based on studies of people from all backgrounds all over the world to my knowledge.
 

siamsquare

Active Member
Thanks for the great review!

I was wondering what RMS power the Q125 has....can't seem to find anything about it!
I have a Parasound Halo A51 5x250w/8ohm now , would the Q125 be powerfull enough to play at reference level with this amp?
Also own a SVS PB-13 ultra sub....do I really need to buy the matching sub?
I was also looking into the XTZ Cinema Series which look like copies of the Kreisel Quattro set:
XTZ Cinema Series - Compact hifi cinema experience.
One thing interested me and that was their new XTZ Sub 3x12 SUB 3X12 Matt/Studio Black with 3 12" drivers and 3x500watt class D amps.
I rather buy this one as it has the same pricing as the SVS PB-13 but with more SPL!
In an ideal world I would be buying the new M&K S300 but they are a tad too expensive for my wallet!
Any advice would be welcome...

Thanks!
 

RickyDeg

Well-known Member
^ Thank you for checking it out!

Technical data on the KK Quattro's are (unfortunately) a bit scarce. Would honestly be nice to have a complete fact sheet on them, like most speaker manufacturers have for their products. I assume you were refering to what recommended amplifier requirements are stated for this model? I'm sure if you wrote to Ken Kreisel (via his website) he will be accomodating and reply to you (he has done so to me several times).

Your Parasound seems powerful on paper. What I can reassure you of is that the Quattro's love power, and thrive on that. Quality power and plenty of current will reward you with dynamics and plenty of transients, not to mention headroom. I wouldn't say limitless (every speaker have limits!) but pretty darn amazing! I have not played at reference level myself simply because I have no such need and my ears would bleed.

How the Parasound Halo A51 and the Q125's would sound and perform together I have no idea about as I have no experience of that combination. I will say though that I've heard many good things about the Halo A51. If you can demo the amp in combination, either the KK or the XTZ systems, that would of course be the best suggestion I could give you.

In terms of your choice for subwoofer, most people would say in broad terms that you don't have to have a 'matching' subwoofer to get a good result. I'd say this depends. Mostly in terms of aesthetics. I'd want the same brand and mathcing looks through-and-through. And as I was very much impressed by how well the DXD-12012 performed together with the Quattro satellites I made the right choice in both aspects I believe. It's the best performing subwoofer I've owned thus far in any home theater set-up. But also the most expensive. Have never heard any SVS subwoofers, unfortunately.

Oh yes! The M&K S300! WOW! I hardly dare demo those! I want to though! LOL! I would strongly advice you to demo both the KK Quattro's and the XTZ Cinema System if you can. The latter preferably with a stack of SUB 3x12. I just had a private demo of the Cinema System at a colleague house this past weekend (one that featured two SUB 1X12, not the stack of three).

Did you read my thread on the XTZ Cinema Series? If not, have a look! XTZ Cinema Series speaker system - impressions by a Ken Kreisel Quattro owner | AVForums

Good luck with your demos and your choices!
 

siamsquare

Active Member
Thanks for the quick reply! Just read your comparison with the XTZ Cinema series where you tend to say the Quattro is a bit better? The surrounds not as good as the Quattro?
 

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