Answered KEF Kube 2 with Pioneer receiver, setup help.

Discussion in 'Subwoofers' started by ggp559, Jul 4, 2015.

  1. ggp559

    ggp559
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    Hello i have Kef's 2005.3 package. My receiver is Pioneer VSX-819. Kef's manual suggests to use 100-120hz crossover on the receiver for the sub . My receiver has 100hz and after that is 150hz so i set it to 100Hz. What about the crossover knob on the sub itself though? Where that should be? There is no clear indication as to where 100hz is on the knob exactly. It ranges from 40hz to 140hz. Which of these settings is the active one? What i mean is if i set crossover for 100hz on the receiver and 140hz on the subwoofer which of the two frequencies is effectively being used? Thanks for any help greatly appreciated
     
  2. Best Answer:
    Post #4 by paulst10, Jul 5, 2015 (1 points)
  3. paulst10

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    Hi, if you're using low level (which you are) then the crossover in the receiver is active. The crossover on the sub itself should be set as high as it can (ie: 140hz or off).

    Your Kef speakers should be good down to about 80hz, so either 80hz or 100hz should be fine.. I'd try 80hz first and see how it goes.
     
  4. ggp559

    ggp559
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    Thanks for the reply. The sub's manual suggests 100hz-120hz for the receiver. I dont have 120hz on mine so i settled for 100. I took your recommendation and turned the knob on the sub all the way to 140hz. Is it normal to turn the volume on the sub as high as possible too? Thats what the kef manual suggests. Thanks
     
  5. paulst10

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    Best Answer
    Yes, 100hz should be Ok, but some people can localize the bass above 80hz and on the Kef site, the speakers are rated for 80hz, so if you find you are hearing where the bass is coming from, you can always opt for 80hz.. Home Theatre Speakers - KHT 2000 - Fact Sheets - Systems - KHT2005.3 - KEF United States

    The subs gain or volume, should be set reasonably high, depending on the amp.. I'd try between 12 o'clock & 3 o'clock to start with, run your receivers auto setup, then see what trim levels it applied. Ideally you want a higher gain in the sub and the subs trim level in - (minus) numbers.
     
  6. ggp559

    ggp559
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    Thanks for the great explanation. Will try to run auto setup again using higher sub volume. Currently the sub has been set by the auto setup to -13db.
     
  7. paulst10

    paulst10
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    What's the maximum trim your Pioneer will do? Is it -15db for the sub? If so, as it stands your subs gain is probably a touch too high as it's giving you a big trim of -13db.. But most people run their subs a tad hotter than Audyssey suggests, so you could always up the trim to around -9 or -10db and run it a little hot if you find the bass underwhelming..
     
  8. ggp559

    ggp559
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    Yes the maximum is -15db. I had the volume on subwoofer around 2 o'clock when i took the measurement that resulted in -13db. I have attached a pic of the room from the listening position. I dont know if it helps. IMG_1108.JPG
     
  9. paulst10

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    I'd leave it as it is, and if you start to feel the bass is a little too low for your tastes, then up the trim in the receiver.. I run mine 3db hot, and some prefer hotter still, so whatever sounds good to you.. :)

    Your room layout looks like it is an open plan type? What are the dimensions? If so, making any recommendations would be a bit pointless with regard to subwoofer positioning other than experimentation within the room itself. There is a room sim.. search for Room EQ Wizard (REW) that will simulate the frequency response your room would generate but its accuracy would depend on the dimensions of the room itself as it doesn't seem to cater for out of the ordinary room shapes so could be hit n miss for some.

    Failing that, if you're serious about getting a decent response, then you could buy an SPL metre or USB mic and use REW to position your sub optimally. Also could be worth considering an Anti Mode which is an auto EQ device and certainly less time consuming than learning how use to use REW, but see how it goes first ;)
     
  10. ggp559

    ggp559
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    Thanks for the great advice. Seriously this is very informative. I ll get back to you on the dimensions. Can you recommend a good spl meter? thanks
     
  11. paulst10

    paulst10
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    I have a Umik-1 and an old analogue Radioshack SPL meter, but also they do a digital one now if you search for it.
    Radioshack Analogue SPL..
    7-Range Analog Sound Level Meter: Amazon.co.uk: Electronics
    Umik-1..
    MiniDSP UMIK-1 | Kalibrate Limited | Home Cinema products, Calibration, DVD Players, 3D Glasses | Audio Systems | Cinema Systems


    There's also another option which would only include an SPL meter.. This is the old, old way we used to do it :) Right, if I can remember, you need to download subwoofer test tones (see 1st post in link below) and either burn them to a CD or copy to a USB stick. Then you need to download the XLS spreadsheet (see 3rd post in link below) and then play the test tones through a CD/Media player and input the SPL for each given frequency into the spreadsheet which will generate a graph of your frequency response.. This is very time consuming this way, but it's simple and cheap..

    Subwoofer and full range test tones | AVForums
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2015
  12. ggp559

    ggp559
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    Thanks. I have noticed something today. When i do the mcacc setup on my receiver the volume of the receiver changes to 59. Not 59db just 59. So the measurements from mcacc are taken with that volume. The maximum i use every day is like 48-52 for volume. 59 is way too high. Maybe thats why the results of the calibration for my surround speakers and subwoofer are always -x db? I find the bass and surround speakers lacking at the volume i use the receiver. Can i change the volume before the measurement is taken or am i messing with something that has to be at a fixed value? Thanks lot.
     
  13. paulst10

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    That should work to be your reference level, so if you listen around 48 ish then you listen around 10db below reference level..
     
  14. ggp559

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    Is there a way to fix this? Can i change the volume before the mcacc measurement?
     
  15. paulst10

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    It should be fixed although some receivers let you manually select the volume first, but I wouldn't worry too much about it
     
  16. ggp559

    ggp559
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    it should be fixed if i lower the volume before the setup? Otherwise if i leave the volume at 59 and take a measurement the sound is lacking at my listening level.
     
  17. paulst10

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    Not too sure, try it and see if you can. Most receivers use the THX method in that the volume goes from -80 - 0db and when doing the auto setup or checking speaker levels using the internal test tones then the volume is automatically set to 0db..
     
  18. ggp559

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    Managed to get an spl. I tried the pink noise tones on my receiver manually. At a voice level that am comfortable with. Is it bad for the receiver if i adjusted the trim for the receiver to +9db - +11db for the speakers. Subwoofer is at 0db. Am i driving too hard? thanks
     
  19. paulst10

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    Way too high for trims.. You really want everything in minus numbers. What db reading were you getting? And did you manage to set the test tone volume differently?
     
  20. ggp559

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    The db am getting is from 73db-75db on the spl meter. I managed to lower the volume when playing back the test tone. Automatically is set to 59 but i took this measurements on 52. I switched the spl to c band and slow response. My spl has a low and a high band switch though. Low is 30db-100db and high 60db-130db. I used the low setting. Maybe am wrong? Another thing is that the spl meter before playing back anything shows ambient noise around 50db. Test tone + ambient noise must equal 75db? Thanks for all the help.
     
  21. paulst10

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    I would set the volume to around 70 then run the test tones and you should end up to with all speakers into minus numbers.
    I would try the high band and see if it makes any difference
    Essentially all you're doing is setting your reference level and as long as your speakers are all at the same level and you're not boosting the trims you should be fine
     

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