Keeping up with the latest Brexit News

Which option would you prefer?

  • Leave with no deal

    Votes: 122 74.4%
  • Leave with the WA without the backstop

    Votes: 42 25.6%

  • Total voters
    164
  • Poll closed .

Sonic67

Distinguished Member
I note percentages were used as they sound bigger. Doesn't sound a lot considering the entire population of the UK.


1574973583574.png
 

Har-One

Distinguished Member
I note percentages were used as they sound bigger. Doesn't sound a lot considering the entire population of the UK.


View attachment 1225690
stop using crap and meaningless statistic to justify your position!
It is safe to assume that you are neither Muslims nor women.

Johnson wrote the article to defend the right of women to wear whatever they wanted. However, he used extremely poor language, especially for a man of his position and education. This was not something that he said without thinking. It was something he wrote at leisure, re-read and still thought that it would be fine to use that poor selection of words.

Statistics have been used and abused in that manner for everybody but that it is not the point. It might seem insignificant an increase of 30 reports only if you are not one of the persons receiving the attacks. Needless to say that the statistics mention only the reported attacks not the actual attacks which more likely than not were far greater.

I personally believe that women should not cover their faces. Even when this is their choice, it is based on a patriarchal religion. Why men do not need to cover their faces? Saying that, I would not go writing that sort of phrases comparing women with letter boxes and bank robbers. I neither feel the need to confront these women to convince them otherwise let along shouting insults or telling them to go back to their country, especially when they already are.
 

Sonic67

Distinguished Member
It is safe to assume that you are neither Muslims nor women.
In this thread there's a lot of people who are trying to downplay Labour and its antisemitism.

By people who aren't Jewish.
Saying that, I would not go writing that sort of phrases comparing women with letter boxes and bank robbers.
And the comments have been done by many.

But oddly it's only Boris who keeps coming up.

I guess the left can always get away with it. Or people have short memories.

Polly Toynbee:


The top-to-toe burka, with its sinister, airless little grille, is more than an instrument of persecution, it is a public tarring and feathering of female sexuality. It transforms any woman into an object of defilement too untouchably disgusting to be seen. It is a garment of lurid sexual suggestiveness: what rampant desire and desirability lurks and leers beneath its dark mysteries? In its objectifying of women, it turns them into cowering creatures demanding and expecting violence and victimisation. Forget cultural sensibilities.


7. Relaunch the postbox

Since the burqa eye-opening has been called a letterbox slit, and with the privatisation of the Royal Mail, seize the moment to set up an independent mobile mail service, AKA The Burqa Post
.


You don’t hear the outraged of Twitter going on about the BBC and the Guardian mocking the burka. Stephen Fry made the same joke as Boris on Have I Got News For You, before Ian Hislop and Paul Merton joined in:

Stephen Fry: “I just posted something in that.”
Ian Hislop: “We must stop meeting like this, Camilla.”
Paul Merton: “Prince Charles is surprised when a pint of Guinness looks at him in a funny way.”


Jack Straw:


'I felt uneasy talking to someone I couldn't see'


Blair:


Tony Blair has said the wearing of full face veils by Muslim women is a "mark of separation" and made some "outside the community feel uncomfortable".

Gordon Brown:


Gordon Brown threw his weight behind Jack Straw last night and declared that it would be better for Britain if fewer Muslim women wore veils.

The Chancellor broke ranks to become the first Cabinet minister publicly to endorse Mr Straw's call for women to discard the veil, which he described as a symbol of separation.


The Government was plunged into disarray as a senior Minister accused Muslim women of being 'selfish' by refusing to stop wearing veils.

Amid growing signs that the controversy is causing civil disorder, Commons Leader Jack Straw's deputy Nigel Griffiths claimed that women who cover their faces in public are ignoring the feelings of others.



Labour yet again:



MUSLIM women who cover their faces with veils can be "frightening and intimidating", says Britain's Race Minister Phil Woolas.

And Labour's Emily Thornberry:


Jeremy Corbyn’s Shadow Foreign Secretary Emily Thornberry has been dragged into the row over Boris Johnson’s controversial comments about Muslim women, after it emerged she told a television audience: “I wouldn’t want my four year old looked after by somebody wearing a burka – I wouldn’t want my elderly mum looked after by somebody wearing a burka."
 

Bl4ckGryph0n

Distinguished Member
And Boris was actually defending their right to wear it. Just unbelievable the reactions to that compared to the list above.
 

domtheone

Distinguished Member
See Boris has been talking about the new points based immigration system coming into place on 1st Jan 2021. Assuming everything else goes to plan.

Long long overdue sensible policy should really be getting cross party support.

Chance of that happening lol....
 

Greg Hook

Moderator & Reviewer
Typical example above of how you can twist statistics to suit your argument by selecting the most sensational figures.

If 10 instances happened, then the next week there was 20, that's not really of any concern.
But say instances increased by 100%, then it gets everyone triggered.

In fact, you could actually say that in a four week period BoJo saw a 25% decrease in anti-muslim attacks.

Both are correct. Both are meaningless.
 
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Har-One

Distinguished Member
In this thread there's a lot of people who are trying to downplay Labour and its antisemitism.

By people who aren't Jewish.
And the comments have been done by many.

But oddly it's only Boris who keeps coming up.

I guess the left can always get away with it. Or people have short memories.
...
Antisemitism, Islamophobia or whichever form of discrimination should be criticised in very strong term.

All those examples that your posted and good examples of what NOT to do.

Labour has the antisemitic problem and the Tories the islamobia but both are a collective. When we use the term Labour or Tories, we cannot single out a particular person.

In the cases where you put examples of individuals, we could single out a person, but the reason Johnson keeps coming back is because he is the PM and potentially a next PM. Please do not misunderstand me, I am NOT justifying them. I will condemn them. I am just trying to explain why people keeps coming back to Johnson’s article.

If any leader of a party would have written something similar most likely they will be getting the same kind of fire because they are potentially PMs. Although, even the chances for Corbin are very slim.

It is not a matter of left or right. It is matter of using language that it is inflammatory and could cause serious harm.
 

Sonic67

Distinguished Member
In the cases where you put examples of individuals, we could single out a person, but the reason Johnson keeps coming back is because he is the PM and potentially a next PM. Please do not misunderstand me, I am NOT justifying them. I will condemn them. I am just trying to explain why people keeps coming back to Johnson’s article.
A lot of what is quoted regarding Boris has been said a long time ago.

As to his comments about burqas which was more recent not only have others said the same but a, he didn't call for a ban, b, a lot of people do have issues with it.

I don't see any men wearing a burqa.
 

Aj33

Well-known Member
A lot of what is quoted regarding Boris has been said a long time ago.

As to his comments about burqas which was more recent not only have others said the same but a, he didn't call for a ban, b, a lot of people do have issues with it.

I don't see any men wearing a burqa.
the burqa also has nothing to do with the religion.

Majid Nawaz has some good thoughts on many of these issues. Although even he isn’t safe from being called Islamophobic and Uncle Tom etc.
 

Sonic67

Distinguished Member
Remember this?


Nish "Mash Report" Kumar pelted with bread rolls.


According to an eyewitness at the Lord’s Taverners Christmas lunch, which raises money for cricketing charities, Kumar was drowned out by booing and had food hurled at him.

He reportedly had made a joke about Brexit which incensed the crowd, proceeded to argue with the audience, then claimed to be like former Commons Speaker John Bercow in his obstinate refusal to leave the stage.

“It was the most embarrassing thing I’ve ever seen,” said Jon Austin, who attended the dinner at the Grosvenor House in London yesterday to help raise money for young and disabled cricketers.

“It was Brexit straight away. He came on and he killed the audience. It took less than a minute.
 

ostewart

Active Member
Remember this?


Nish "Mash Report" Kumar pelted with bread rolls.


According to an eyewitness at the Lord’s Taverners Christmas lunch, which raises money for cricketing charities, Kumar was drowned out by booing and had food hurled at him.

He reportedly had made a joke about Brexit which incensed the crowd, proceeded to argue with the audience, then claimed to be like former Commons Speaker John Bercow in his obstinate refusal to leave the stage.

“It was the most embarrassing thing I’ve ever seen,” said Jon Austin, who attended the dinner at the Grosvenor House in London yesterday to help raise money for young and disabled cricketers.

“It was Brexit straight away. He came on and he killed the audience. It took less than a minute.
Ahhh good old snowflakes ;) oh wait, I thought that's what they called the left when they get offended.
 

gamerste

Well-known Member
As its election time I haven't really concentrated on this terrible concept (brexit)
When Boris rocked up with his deal I did say it was terrible.
Turns out it's 70bn a year terrible.
Let's get brexit done.
 

philbot

Well-known Member
As the majority or ordinary working class people voted to leave the EU, it's not particularly clever for comedians, actors, singers and general smug media types to constantly belittle Brexiteers. Maybe in their circle of friends the thought of voting leave is unthinkable, but we had a referendum and that's the result. The sooner they get used to it the better.
 

Sonic67

Distinguished Member
To his credit, it's the first time I've laughed with anything related to him so he did do something right.
 

Aj33

Well-known Member
As its election time I haven't really concentrated on this terrible concept (brexit)
When Boris rocked up with his deal I did say it was terrible.
Turns out it's 70bn a year terrible.
Let's get brexit done.
yep let’s get it done!
 

ostewart

Active Member
As the majority or ordinary working class people voted to leave the EU, it's not particularly clever for comedians, actors, singers and general smug media types to constantly belittle Brexiteers. Maybe in their circle of friends the thought of voting leave is unthinkable, but we had a referendum and that's the result. The sooner they get used to it the better.
However those who were younger and will be most affected by Brexit mostly voted to remain. Along with those who had a higher level of education.

And if you class ordinary working folk as 25-49 years of age then they actually voted majority remain, by a small margin.

Sadly those ordinary working class were played by the media and also felt disenfranchised by the conservative government so some used it as a protest vote.

 

Aj33

Well-known Member
Even though the deal is crap.
You go on about labours election policy but 70bn shortfall with boris deal is fine and dandy.
The price of everything and the value of nothing.
 

Aj33

Well-known Member
However those who were younger and will be most affected by Brexit mostly voted to remain. Along with those who had a higher level of education.
that is incredibly patronising and insulting to many.

older people’s views shouldn’t count or count for less and the rest - thick as pigs muck.

I am young, around 30 (too old?) at vote time and have a Bsc (Hon) with published scientific papers (too thick?).
 

EarthRod

Distinguished Member
As its election time I haven't really concentrated on this terrible concept (brexit)
When Boris rocked up with his deal I did say it was terrible.
Turns out it's 70bn a year terrible.
Let's get brexit done.
Brexit is costing about £20bn per year, so far costed us about £66bn. The UK economy is about 2.5% smaller than if we had remained in the EU.

The future costs are of course unknown, but can assume it would be at least £20bn per year.
 

SteakAndCake

Distinguished Member
Even though the deal is crap.
You go on about labours election policy but 70bn shortfall with boris deal is fine and dandy.
It's clear that many voters have no trouble voting for fiscal recklessness, rich elites, racists, or just lazy idiots if it delivers Brexit. There is no limit to what they'd pay. It transgresses from a political outlook toward the lack of objectivity and delusion often seen in cult members.
 

ostewart

Active Member
that is incredibly patronising and insulting to many.

older people’s views shouldn’t count or count for less and the rest - thick as pigs muck.

I am young, around 30 (too old?) at vote time and have a Bsc (Hon) with published scientific papers (too thick?).
I've literally just posted a link to stats that show that was the case. It's not saying everyone who is well educated voted remain, and everyone who is old voted leave. It's numbers and statistics.
 

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