JVC X3/X7/X9 Owners Thread

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JonStatt

Well-known Member
I can proudly announce that courtesy of Musical Images in Edgware I am the new owner of the JVC X7, perhaps the first owner in the country! I have been a customer of Musical Images because of their service for many many years and never go anywhere else.

I just finished putting it up on the ceiling with a Unicol mount. Let me warn you now, that it is VERY heavy compared to a 350/750 etc and then add the weight of the Unicol bracket and it becomes almost unbearable. I had to hold it above my head while someone else went and put the bolt through the column. I was right on the edge of my strength limits but admittedly I am no muscle builder.

I have only had enough time to validate it works including the 3D. So far, on my 80" diagonal screen, with Sky 3D, the image was definitely bright enough on my 0.95 gain material. But I wouldn't say the end image was "wow" bright. It was bright enough. The trouble is as the bulb ages, will it still be bright enough?

Uniformity no problem. Focus no problem. Convergence is good but not perfect. I think my 950 was actually slightly better for convergence but I will do some more fiddling later.

Naturally I will report much more findings over the weekend.

Jonathan
 
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JonStatt

Well-known Member
I ordered 4 glasses, but only the 2 that are bundled came to the shop today. So I can't share with friends as I want to yet! I guess there is a shortage, not just of the projectors!

I just tried a few moments of the blu-ray of Avatar 3D and was blown away. I was running with an Acer H5360 with cables dangling down my stairwell from my nVidia 3D PC, and this is so far ahead of the image I got from the Acer. The depth certainly added to by the improved contrast makes a huge difference.
 

howieeb

Active Member
Nice one :) Keep the impressions coming. What projector did you have before btw?

//edit just read the 2nd post :) An Acer.
 

JonStatt

Well-known Member
Nice one :) Keep the impressions coming. What projector did you have before btw?

//edit just read the 2nd post :) An Acer.
Actually I had a JVC HD950 as well. I added the Acer because I really wanted 3D. I will of course give comparisons against my 950 as well, but I don't have them side by side so it will be difficult to be precise.
 

howieeb

Active Member
I'd be interested in any comparison, subjective or not :)

I'm toying with making the jump from an HD750, but am not fussed much with 3D (that may change!) and would want a relatively significant jump in 2D performance. My main gripes are motion handling and black levels - not that they're bad, but when something in the image bugs me 9/10 it's one of these.
 

iamsludge

Active Member
am looking forward to chiming in when my x3 arrives - in the meantime am eager to hear opinions of those that receive before me...
 

JonStatt

Well-known Member
Just some quick tidbits of information; for 3D the JVC X7 is brighter (considerably) right now than the Acer H5360 wearing their appropriate 3D glasses.

However, we know the bulb will become dimmer. I suspect they will end up similar as the H5360 has about 150 hours on it.

There is occasional ghosting and I really mean occasional. And I wouldn't normally pick up on it if I wasn't looking for it. However I was intently looking for it. Overall, the ghosting is near non-existent with the materials tried so far.

Typically the best way to show ghosting is with animations where you have solid blocks of colour with 3D dark objects that are either set far in or far out from the screen.

An example where I do see it, is with the indoor tennis demo on the 3D loop that Sky 3D keep showing over and over. On scenes where you see the line judges against a solid light blue floor, you can observe a slight ghost around the judge. I also saw one instance in the animation Open Season 3D.

I must emphasise that when I relax, not looking for ghosting, I have not picked up on it and been distracted yet.

For some reason in the special 3D preset, they whack the sharpness by default to 30 which does cause its own ghosting/halo (as any sharpness adjustment does). I am trying to figure out why they put such a high default.

Also, it is worth noting that it is an absolute PAIN to get into side by side 3D mode for Sky. You have to press menu, move to the input panel, choose HDMI settings, and then go to 3D mode, and then choose side-by-side. This absolutely should have been a single button press, and will no doubt be infuriating.
 

Manni01

Well-known Member
Hi Jonathan,

Thanks for the feedback. Re the Sky side by side issue, is the 3D mode on auto on the PJ, and do you have an HDMI 1.4 compatible AVR?
 

JonStatt

Well-known Member
Hi Jonathan,

Thanks for the feedback. Re the Sky side by side issue, is the 3D mode on auto on the PJ, and do you have an HDMI 1.4 compatible AVR?
On Auto, side by side cannot be detected. It only detects frame packed. This is the same as all 3D devices I have seen so far. I don't believe there is a fool proof way for the device to detect side by side.

I do not have an HDMI 1.4 AVR. However I use a DVDO Duo, which has 3D pass through and 2 video HDMI outputs + 1 audio HDMI output.

Of course most 3D blu-ray players do have dual outputs as well negating the concern of an HDMI 1.4 AVR
 

Manni01

Well-known Member
On Auto, side by side cannot be detected. It only detects frame packed. This is the same as all 3D devices I have seen so far. I don't believe there is a fool proof way for the device to detect side by side.

I do not have an HDMI 1.4 AVR. However I use a DVDO Duo, which has 3D pass through and 2 video HDMI outputs + 1 audio HDMI output.

Of course most 3D blu-ray players do have dual outputs as well negating the concern of an HDMI 1.4 AVR
Did you try connecting your Sky box directly to the X7, to rule out the influence of the rest of the HDMI chain? It would be a real pain if even with an 1.4 AVR the PJ couldn't detect a 3D Sky signal automatically.

I wouldn't say that most Bluray players have dual HDMI outputs, plus the point of an AVR which is 1.4 compatible is to be able to deal automaticaly with non HTPC / non bluray 3D signals, like Sky...

Of course your DVDO Duo should be fine, but it would be interesting to take it out of the equation, just to make sure the problem lies with the X7 inability to detect the side by side 3D signal.

EDIT: I guess it would be easy to add a macro to a Harmony remote or equivalent. Also I suppose the problem with side by side is that unless you analyse the content of the picture, it is a standard 2D picture.
 
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JonStatt

Well-known Member
Did you try connecting your Sky box directly to the X7, to rule out the influence of the rest of the HDMI chain? It would be a real pain if even with an 1.4 AVR the PJ couldn't detect a 3D Sky signal automatically.
I tried it, but there is no difference. Sky 3D is not auto detected. A Sky box isn't 1.4 though anyway. I think its actually only HDMI 1.1. As you noted, how would the projector know that it was receiving a side by side signal?

So JVC really should have put a button on the remote to quickly access the 3D parameters.
 

JonStatt

Well-known Member
For those who have memorised the layout of the buttons on the remote of previous JVC models will have to re-learn. Lots of buttons have moved such as the test pattern button is now the hide button.

In fact there are no test patterns that I can see outside of the service menu.

However, in the service menu area, the test patterns now contain a much expanded set.

The familiar convergence test screen, grey and colour ramps, checkerboard and full page colour and grey screens are all still present. However in addition are some test patterns that I have no idea what use they serve, but there are a couple of useful ones. In particular there is now a shadow and highlight test screen. A black (0) screen is shown with boxes overlaid covering the next deepest shades (1, 2) etc. Similarly a white (255) screen is shown with boxes overlaid covering the next lightest shades (254, 253) etc. This provides good confirmation of a set-up.

I am pleased to say that on the test screen, out of the box, both shade level 1 and 254 were just visible.

Naturally there is little point in me calibrating with only 4 hours on the bulb, but it is worth noting there are now many more options to fiddle with. Even the CMS features 7 colour points instead of 6. The additional colour is Orange. It seems to be option overload, with all sorts of white balance presets simulating Xenon bulbs, Fuji vs Kodak film, HD and DCI standards and more. They seem to be focussing more on emulating industry usage rather than just inventing presets that they liked in a play session at JVC HQ in Japan, although a few of those are still present.

At this point I think its good to also clarify the differences between the X3, X7 and X9. The contrast ratios (on/off) are 50000, 70000, 100000 respectively. This means each increment in model is a 40% improvement in contrast.

Additionally the X7 and X9 both feature a VGA and LAN port. More interestingly, the X7 and X9 feature a dual iris which the X3 does not have. One aperture/iris is located infront of the lamp itself. The other is infront of the lens as previously. It is unknown exactly what advantage this brings, although the theorists have suggested it may help maintain ANSI contrast even when stopped down. With those extra lumens on hand, stopping down the aperture is bound to be neccessary so this may be an important distinction in models. When adjusting the iris now, the first click, you hear the familiar brief "click" from the front iris, then you stop down again, and you hear the most peculiar, almost ill and longer sounding buzz as something moves further inside. It continues to alternate between the two irises. Suprisingly the X7 and X9 are almost half a kilo heavier!

The X7 and X9 feature CMS but there are also quite a few other picture options not found on the X3. These include a bunch more options in simulating standards and separated controls for handling specifically the bottom (dark) and top (light) shades. I think in essence this is an over-ride to tweak the gamma at the very top and bottom of the curve which could prove useful.

Here is a request for Gary. There is a screen adjust setting just like previous models. This helps adjust for grey materials for example. Even though there is a CMS, this setting helps make sure all the other presets are closer than they would otherwise be. On previous models this was simply a setting of 0,1,2,3 and the manual detailed each one. But on the new projectors this are two adjustment numbers from 0 to 9 and it is NOT documented anywhere in the manual what these do. The manual just says adjust to your preference...not useful!!
 

marasco0815

Standard Member
At this point I think its good to also clarify the differences between the X3, X7 and X9. The contrast ratios (on/off) are 50000, 70000, 100000 respectively. This means each increment in model is a 40% improvement in contrast.
Yes- and the question we all have is what is the real world difference between the x3 and x7. I have not seen that articulated anywhere yet. Of course haven't seen and x3/rs40 in the wild yet neither.
 

GaryB

Distinguished Member
Here is a request for Gary. There is a screen adjust setting just like previous models. This helps adjust for grey materials for example....it is NOT documented anywhere in the manual what these do.
There is supposed to be a list of screen type vs setting number on JVC Japan's website, but it hasn't appeared yet. I'll chase it up on Monday.
 

GaryB

Distinguished Member
I posted this in the the other JVC thread, but I suspect that a lot of the activity will transfer over here now, so I thought it worth repeating.

The latest version of my D-ILA Projector Remote Control Guide is now available. This has been updated with around 75 new remote codes for the new models as well as LAN control and multiple projector control information.

It is available from:

JVC D-ILA Projector Remote Control Guide Download
 

JonStatt

Well-known Member
At this point I think its good to also clarify the differences between the X3, X7 and X9. The contrast ratios (on/off) are 50000, 70000, 100000 respectively. This means each increment in model is a 40% improvement in contrast.
Yes- and the question we all have is what is the real world difference between the x3 and x7. I have not seen that articulated anywhere yet. Of course haven't seen and x3/rs40 in the wild yet neither.
There is a more important comparison for 2D between say a 750/950 and an X7. People will want to know if they should consider upgrading just for 2D. I want to give this a considered response after running some more tests. And I will give an update on my thoughts during this weekend.
 

kckckc

Novice Member
Just wanted to post some thanks to JonStatt. My X3 on order with Kent Home Cinema (sufferd some of the worst snowfall :-(...) has no sign of appearing. As of yesterday they had received nada.

So reading the experiences of those lucky X projector owners is 2nd best :thumbsup:

Interested in the variety of test patterns JVC have programmed into the new range. My friend is bringing back a Disney WOW Blu Ray next week from the USA... so I'm planning on using that once I've done 100hrs on the bulb (shouldn't take me long over Xmas!!)
 

linnite

Novice Member
Just wanted to post some thanks to JonStatt. My X3 on order with Kent Home Cinema (sufferd some of the worst snowfall :-(...) has no sign of appearing. As of yesterday they had received nada.
The UK weather is not to blame. As I understand it very very few have even made it to the UK, fewer than planned even for the initial batch. I presume the production line hasn't rolled as quickly as expected. An initial batch came but with significantly reduced quantity - GaryB, is that correct?

I think people who thought they were getting one of a first batch will now be prioritised as getting one of the second batch (meaning some people expecting to get one of the second batch might have to wait till the third etc etc).

GaryB, I wonder, if you know, could you tell us the latest about the second batch. Even bad news is better than no news - people might assume a worse scenario than the reality.
 

KelvinS1965

Distinguished Member
There is a more important comparison for 2D between say a 750/950 and an X7. People will want to know if they should consider upgrading just for 2D. I want to give this a considered response after running some more tests. And I will give an update on my thoughts during this weekend.
Is there any way you will be able ensure that you are watching at the same fL level as previously? I know if I change my iris to fully open (up from the current '6' or so for 12-14fL), apart from looking too bright for my taste, it does tend to look sharper and more vibrant.

Thinking about it, I seem to recall that you've sold your old model before getting this? I guess a side by side won't be possible then...

I thought that the X7 demo last week seemed a bit disapointing in dark scenes due to black crush (and that the screen wasn't masked down to fit the smaller zoom), so I'd be interested to hear what one looks like once it's been properly adjusted. I watched some ITV HD stuff (1080/50p after deinterlacing in the Edge) on my HD350 last night and noticed that the motion seemed smoother; last week's demo was also shown at 1080/50p due to some issue with the Arcam BluRay so I'm also wondering how 1080/24p stuff will look compared to the last generation in terms of motion (not necessarily using the frame creation/black frame options though).

I think you're lucky having this X7 already...I'll be waiting until next year at least for the X77 (or whatever) to launch before looking for a good used/ex demo deal I think.
 

JonStatt

Well-known Member
Is there any way you will be able ensure that you are watching at the same fL level as previously? I know if I change my iris to fully open (up from the current '6' or so for 12-14fL), apart from looking too bright for my taste, it does tend to look sharper and more vibrant.

I think you're lucky having this X7 already...I'll be waiting until next year at least for the X77 (or whatever) to launch before looking for a good used/ex demo deal I think.
Hi Kelvin,

You are right that I have to be careful to evaluate with similar light outputs. I have had to do this by eye/memory I'm afraid. I have not noticed any black crush at all (see my comments regarding test patterns and black shadow test also).

I am extremely lucky to have my X7 and I am glad those that are waiting take some comfort from my reports in the meantime. Musical Images would normally have kept the X7 as a demo. I pursuaded them to sell it to me on the condition I would let the staff come around to my home to see it. I am alone in the owners club right now (at least on these forums), and while I feel privileged I would love to be able to share settings and ideas with other owners.

As I mentioned earlier though, I cannot share 3D with my friends right now as I only have 2 glasses. There seems to be a shortage of everything which is surprising as the glasses are not made by JVC.

I am a little surprised, that none of the other X3/X7s that have gone out have reached anybody that would typically post on here (dealer or owner). The snow may have affected deliveries to some dealers though.
 
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JonStatt

Well-known Member
The UK weather is not to blame. As I understand it very very few have even made it to the UK, fewer than planned even for the initial batch. I presume the production line hasn't rolled as quickly as expected. An initial batch came but with significantly reduced quantity - GaryB, is that correct?
While I don't know the exact number that came into the UK , Gary did announce that the first batch was even smaller than planned. He also mentioned that JVC UK is frustrated as the demand is there and they cannot fulfill as quickly as they want to. This is a global issue, and I imagine it has become very political with different JVC regions pushing for stock. It does seem that JVC UK has been hard done by in the first round.

Retailers in the UK must be getting harassed by eager purchasers waiting to find out where their projectors are. I hope the delivery JVC UK are expecting within the next week doesn't end up smaller than expected too.
 
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andicapped

Banned
well I`ve just come back from my dealers who has a new jvc on demonstration and quite simply it really is better than I thought it would be, coming from someone who is/was intially anti 3D thats quite a statement.

Between us we messed about with the settings whilst watching a 3d movie (Christmas Carol which looks fantastic by the way) before several customers arrived at around 11 o`clock and I was very impressed.

I managed to get a little bit of 2d watching done beforehand as well and was certainly very impressed with every single aspect of the image using the THX setting as no calibration had been carried out as yet.

i hung around a little in the background and left before the others, but could hear nothing but praise for the JVC`s image, the Imax scenes of the grand canyon looked stunning in 3D.

i can see me having one of these before long, but kitting out a nursery and pram are high on the spending agenda atm

Andy

PS. Jon

can I ask you to post what settings you`re running in 3D please as well if you wouldn`t mind
 

flyinmunky1

Active Member
Out of curiosity would the Epson tw-5500 stack up against the X3 in 2D performace? I was lucky enough to grab one cheap so selling it and putting up a bit of cash for 3D may be a option.

I just dont know where the X3 stands in terms of 2D performance.
 

KelvinS1965

Distinguished Member
I just dont know where the X3 stands in terms of 2D performance.
Pretty much up with the old HD750 and HD950 at least in specification terms (apart from not having a CMS, but it does have a more accuate gamut to start with). It should comforatably beat the Epson as the contrast is native compared to the Epson using a dynamic iris to achieve similar figures on paper. Not really any out in the wild yet, but I'm looking forward to some reviews to see just how close the X3 measures as it could well quell those 'oversaturated colours' type remarks about the cheaper JVCs.
 
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