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Just joined the plasma gang!

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs' started by Pug72, May 18, 2003.

  1. Pug72

    Pug72
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    I took delivery of a Sony 42" plasma today and I gotta say I am well chuffed.
    I have my Sky Plus box and DVD/Xbox/PS2(sharing a scart switch) plugged into the two RGB scart sockets. The DVD is great, but Sky is a bit poor. Would I benefit from one of these RGB to component widgets I have read you guys talking about?
    If so, how much and where from?
    My plasma is a Sony KE42TS2E which I got for £4000 interset free for 3 yrs with a free Sony DVD and speaker system(£450 in Dixons,gone in the bedroom as I already have a good audio set-up).
    Cheers in advance:smashin:
     
  2. briandzo

    briandzo
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    pug,

    you wont improve the sky picture by switching to component.
    well maybe very very slightly.
    i feel your just seeing sky's compression on its broadcasts.
    that big screen highlights the poor quality of some channels.

    the general feeling is
    to get a deinterlacer.
    technically this will improve things.
    but remember you cant make magic numbers out of thin air.
    deinterlacing will give you the ability to see
    25 full frames a second (pal)
    as opposed to each frame split into 2 fields.

    ive not got a deinterlacer as yet, but its on the shopping list.
    there going rather cheap at the moment.
    mind you, your need to do your homework as far as intergrating it
    goes. you know all the ins and outs. cables etc.

    what sort of signal stength are you getting on your sky box?
    mines at 50%. im not sure if getting someone in
    to tweak the dish will improve things.

    anyone tried a dish tweak ?
     
  3. StooMonster

    StooMonster
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    Well there's deinterlacing and there's delinterlacing.

    Some units simply do what they say on the tin, others have more advanced features (edge enhancement, chroma filters, motion adaptive, etc.) and produce a much better picture.

    This is why the iScan Ultras are well respected -- and same chipset is used in Denon's prog-scan DVD players, and Arcam's top end DVDs, more expensive scalers like those by CenterStage -- and gives better results than the plasma screen's built in progressive scan chipset.

    This article has good comparison of chipsets
    http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_7_4/dvd-benchmark-part-5-progressive-10-2000.html

    and here, talks about iScan Ultra in particular
    http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/cgi-...urer=22&maxprice=0&deInt=Silicon+Image&mpeg=0

    StooMonster
     
  4. symanski

    symanski
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    Just to check, you have switched RGB on with Sky? And the DVD?
    Are you using an advanced SCART lead with the XBox?

    All the best,

    Dr John Sim.
     
  5. Pug72

    Pug72
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    Thanks for the advice.
    Yes, yes and yes.

    Decided plasma isn't for me and it is going back.
    Thanks again anyway.
     
  6. symanski

    symanski
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    Thought I should check anyway.

    Don't give up on plasma yet, yes they're different from a normal TV, but what else is only 4" thick and gives you such a picture?

    Try and get a demo of something such as the Panasonic or Pioneer.

    All the best,

    Dr John Sim.
     
  7. Pug72

    Pug72
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    I will be keeping a close eye on how plasmas improve.
    I'm just really fussy. £4000 is a lot of money and if it aint 100% perfect then I'm keeping the money.
    I new the picture wouldn't be as good as a CRT, but I thought I would give it a go. Just wasn't impressed enough to spend that sort of money.
    When I posted 'Just joined the plasma gang' I was still excited about its arrival, but after trying hard to get a 'perfect' picture my heart sank. The pixel going was the last straw.
    Thanks again for the advice guys it was much appreciated and I hope you have happy viewing.
    Cheers.
     
  8. harrisuk

    harrisuk
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    Well there is a lesson to be learned here. Firstly shop around. Much much better screens available for £1000 less than this.

    Secondly they are not for everyone. I have been saying for a while there are people buying these things who really should not be. Until you get panels with integrated RGb scart etc available not for the novice in my opinion.
     
  9. cybersoga

    cybersoga
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    Well, my new Sony 32" Plasma has motion adaptive deinterlacing built in (they call it pixel by pixel IP conversion) as well as 2 RGB scart sockets (and component, RGBHV, s-video etc too). here's a little diagram...

    [​IMG]

    It works really well, even on horizontal scrolling text, looks as smooth as a CRT, and on films, well they look film-like!

    Definately a plasma I can reccomend to people who dont want to trouble themselves with deinterlacing boxes, progressive scan dvd players etc, it just works :)
     
  10. Pug72

    Pug72
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    Mine too had 2 RGB's integrated aswell as 3 other inputs(including component and s-video).

    It was mainly due to the blacks not being dark enough and the pixel going that put me off.
    If one pixel went after less than 24 hrs, how many would go over the next few yrs?
    Even that one pixel was catching my eye and the manuel says that this is normal and is not covered in the warranty.
    Nor was screen burn.
    If they exclude these from the warranty then it must be very common and as I said, I am not forking out thousands of pounds for a less than perfect picture.
    I didn't go into the purchase blindly as I had read up extensively about plasmas and thought I'd give them a go.
    I wonder how many of you are fooling yourselves into thinking your tv's are brilliant because you have spent a lot of dosh on them?
    Over the years I have amassed a good av set-up and just 'coz I am a newb on this forum doesn't automatically make me a novice!
    Don't get me wrong though as I have found EVERYONE who has answered my questions to be very helpful and informative and like I said earlier, I will be keeping an optimistic eye on the plasma scene and wil most definately consider purchasing one in the future.
     
  11. cybersoga

    cybersoga
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    I'm not saying my Plasma is without inherant faults (image retension, dithered blacks, dottyness on some moving images, slight horizontal streaking when black text is displayed on white background), but i'd never fit a 32" screen in the space that it currently occupies, basicly it was either this or LCD, and I do love a geometricly perfect picture and progressive scan.

    I've not got any dead pixels.
     
  12. mikeq

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    I still can't get over how good my plasma looks, worth every penny.
     
  13. harrisuk

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    Touch wood I dont have any dead pixels.

    I am well happy with mine. The blacks are fine. Black is Black.

    And as I said I have played video games for hours. No screen burn. My point is at £4000 there are better screens for alot less money in my opinion. If you are paying that much I am not suprised you got peeved with a dead pixel. I just dont see that it is neccessary to pay that money for a 42" plasma in the current market to get a stonking good picture.

    If you shop around and know what you are doing setup wise that is. I have seen most of the panels available at one time or another. Personally the best panels I have seen are the latest offerings from Fujitsu and Pioneer in that order.
     
  14. Bernard Barnett

    Bernard Barnett
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    Harris - You say "much better screens available for £1,000 less." I would like to know what experience you have of the Sony as it's a brand new machine and there are hardly any of them in the country. I'm not necessarily arguing with your conclusion, just want to know what you're basing it on.
     
  15. cybersoga

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    Black is as black as the cinema is on my Plasma, so it's good enough for me, but it does dither the fine shades between black and dark grey, but at normal viewing distance you cant see the dithering, only if you look real close. And regards to the horizontal streaking with black text on white, every plasma does it and it's ever so slightly visible when you connect it to a computer and the room is dark, but in normal use (TV/movies) you cant see it. My friends 42" Pioneer plasma does the same thing, it also dithers dark grey to black and has the same streaking when connected to a PC even via DVI-D or RGBHV. I'm pretty sure its just the way that Plasmas work, and nether artifacts particularly bother me.
     
  16. wilber

    wilber
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    I've seen the Sony and the Hitachi head to head & I have to say they are both brilliant (I wouldn't like to say which was "better"), but the Hitachi can be bought much cheaper (that was the killer for me)

    Incidentally Bernard, does the Sony have a fan inside? If so do you notice it. Only asking 'cos there must be some heat built up inside the one box solution
     
  17. cybersoga

    cybersoga
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    Mine has a fan inside it, it's a big fan running at slow speed and it's pretty much silent.
     
  18. Bernard Barnett

    Bernard Barnett
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    Wilber, yes there is a fan but as Cybersoga says it's not noticeable. But I have the 32-inch version so I can't say what the 42's would be like.
     
  19. Pug72

    Pug72
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    I still have my 42"(waiting for couriers to call) and the fan is inaudible.
    And as far as 'you can get better tv's for £4000', I agree, you could get 2 excellent 36" CRT's for that. I will get just one.
     
  20. Bernard Barnett

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    Pug, I think you've made the right choice. For me it was a matter of space - I didn't have room for a CRT any more. Having researched the market very carefully, I concluded that the Sony plasma I eventually bought is as good as any. But I miss the sheer clarity and depth (in PQ terms) of my CRT. Having said that, the plasma is a very handsome and elegant piece of kit The other caveat to your decision is that it's very hard to find a problem-free CRT. Good hunting!
     
  21. Pug72

    Pug72
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    Cheers buddy.
    I agree with you about the look of plasmas, they are very stylish looking indeed. I do believe though that the PQ will rival CRT one day and once that happens and the pricing becomes more sensible the format will really take off.
    As far as hunting for a good CRT- lol, you're right.
     
  22. harrisuk

    harrisuk
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    I think considering what you paid you are well done getting rid. Well OTT.
     
  23. Pug72

    Pug72
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    Well I thought it was agood deal.
    £4000 interest free for 3 yrs and a free Sony wega home cinema system(£450 in dixons) which would of gone in my bedroom.

    £4000-450= £3550.
    I would have paid more for a £3000 plasma with store or credit card interest.
    Either way it's going back.
     
  24. harrisuk

    harrisuk
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    If you need the cinema setup and credit you are right it is not a bad deal.

    I was just looking at it from the angle that the Fujitsu / Pioneer panels seem to be about the best out there and in my opinion produce better results than the Sony Panel. I have seen people picking them up these panels for £3000 - £3200 with a bit of shopping around and hagling. On that basis it is expensive but not if you take the fiance and cinema setup into the equation.

    Just my opinion though. You are getting rid anyway so it dosnt really matter.
     
  25. Bernard Barnett

    Bernard Barnett
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    I suggest Harris's opinions should be treated with caution until he explains on what basis he concluded there are "much much better screens" than the Sony. I asked a while ago and he hasn't replied.
     
  26. harrisuk

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    Well I missed that first time around. Of course this is in my opinion it dosnt make it so. In reply to you question :

    (1) Viewing the various screens (Selfridges) OK I accept this is not very precise. I will be the first one to admit this. They are not setup right but they have them all together pretty much side by side so easy to make a comparison. They also tend to run the same stuff (Mainly Attack of the Clones) Ok it is via crap leads etc but still telling in my books. I have looked at them quite a few times. The Fujitsu looks a class apart to me. Then the Pioneer very close second. The Panny also looks great. But I demod the Tosh clone carefully when I bought mine and was not that keen plus I know someone who has a Panny and is not happy with it so you could say I am a little baiased. But most people on the forums seem to love them. JUST MY OPINION.

    (2) Virtually every thread I read on this site says the best panels are Pioneer / Panasonic. I know someone who has the panasonic and has had problems with his. There are also quite a few posts from owners citing problems (Flicker, noise, lyp synch etc) therefore I subbed in the Fujistsu as I have been really impressed when I have seen it.

    My main point is that common opinion seems to be that there are better screens than the Sony. And £4000 is top dollar no. Almost £1000 more than people seem to be picking up the screens I have mentioned.

    What I have been trying to get at is that it is not really fair to say "Plasma quality is not good enough" based one one guy paying £4000 for a Sony Plasma he had for a few days and is getting rid of due to a dead pixel.

    Not when there would seem to be better screens available for almost £1000 less. Is this a fair point ? I have substitued Better for much better. I conceed that this is not really fair as how much better is better ?

    Maybe you could explain why you think it is better than the panels I have mentioned ?
     
  27. Bernard Barnett

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    Thanks Harris, good reply. With respect, though, I suggest a viewing in Selfridges (which I visit at least once a week) isn't a sound basis for forming an opinion because, as you say, the feeds are invariably rubbish. Actually I don't think the Sony is better, I suspect they're all pretty good once you get them home and set them up properly. I went for it because I only have room for a 32 and it was therefore either that or a Hitachi, and (unlike many people on these forums) I have never had a Sony product that's failed to give peak performance.
     
  28. harrisuk

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    Its still a great screen dont get me wrong. Just a little harsh to say Plasma is not much cop based on one bad experience from what most people would agree is a very expensive panel at £4000.

    At that price you are definately heading towards 50" Pioneer country and what a beutiful piece of kit that is. I am sure I have seen the 50" Pioneer for £4300 - £4500. That is what I would be getting if I could justify £4000 - £4500. And that will be my next step in a couple of years I think.

    I will have a think about where I saw it at that sort of price......
     
  29. cybersoga

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    Harris, i'll bet you havn't seen the brand new Sony TS2 plasmas (one of which I have), there arn't many in the country yet, so dont write them off that quickly. And I agree with Bernard, you cant judge a plasma by seeing it in a shop unless you have a chance to connect it to the source of your choice and set it up correctly. I went for Sony because it was the only plasma that fitted, it was the only 32" that didn't have useless speakers joined to the sides. And I like Sony gear in general.
     
  30. wilber

    wilber
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    Mind you it does have useless speakers underneath the screen :)

    TBH I think having the speakers is ok - there are times when running everything through the av receiver gets a bit "too much"
     

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