Interesting article about Vista....

ManicRobot

Active Member
Sorry, my attention span is not long enough to get through that articl . . . . . . . . . :boring:
 

Singh400

Distinguished Member
1) This article has been in the public domain for ages.
2) Microsofts Vista Dev Team official posted a reply back
 

treacle

Active Member
Interesting word springs to mind "SPOOF"

Its only gullible people that allow this stuff to exist.
 
A

ancientgeek

Guest
Like it or not, Microsoft hoped to be the gatekeepers on your access to video and audio content, and to tighten the controls in Vista so they could collect content fees for ever. But it's virtually impossible to enforce DRM on a general purpose computer without spoiling it. That article simply explains some of the details. Video chip makers in particular find it very difficult to write Vista compliant drivers.

Just read the reviews. Not surprisingly, Vista has flopped in the market, with retail (upgrade) sales a fraction of the intended level. But MS were ready for this problem. Nearly all the 20 million purported sales are (a) XP OEM sales with upgrade voucher (which MS deferred recognising in their accounts so they could call them Vista sales with temporary XP license) and (b) OEM Vista sales that are the only choice on most new retail PC's, many of which which haven't yet shipped to customers, even though MS has counted them a sales.

When Vista flopped, the price paid by manufacturers for DRAM, hard drives, LCD panels, and CPUs all fell sharply. Watch for the big manufacturers to declare lowered sales, but better margins in their next quarterly results, now that a new PC is a Vista PC.

Nevertheless, Microsoft is a monopoly, strongly supported by the UK government and education system among many, so MS fans have nothing to worry about. Vista will be the standard PC operating system.
 

father alice

Active Member
2) Microsofts Vista Dev Team official posted a reply back

Details of the reply are included within the article ( and debunked in most cases....)

I admit it may not be scintilating reading, but I feel it does raise some serious questions about vista and other pc platforms for future development, and the issue of driver support.
 

treacle

Active Member
Just read the reviews. Not surprisingly, Vista has flopped in the market, with retail (upgrade) sales a fraction of the intended level. But MS were ready for this problem. Nearly all the 20 million purported sales are (a) XP OEM sales with upgrade voucher (which MS deferred recognising in their accounts so they could call them Vista sales with temporary XP license) and (b) OEM Vista sales that are the only choice on most new retail PC's, many of which which haven't yet shipped to customers, even though MS has counted them a sales.

Try using a little logic, logically it doesn't matter which version is bought, or in which form, its a sale,
Any PC with Vista installed is a sale,(need to puchase to install)


When Vista flopped, the price paid by manufacturers for DRAM, hard drives, LCD panels, and CPUs all fell sharply. Watch for the big manufacturers to declare lowered sales, but better margins in their next quarterly results, now that a new PC is a Vista PC.


.
Again you post on a false premise.Vista is growing every day,

"intel Mac mini" in setup, possible reason for posting..
 

WelshBluebird

Well-known Member
Just read the reviews. Not surprisingly, Vista has flopped in the market, with retail (upgrade) sales a fraction of the intended level. But MS were ready for this problem. Nearly all the 20 million purported sales are (a) XP OEM sales with upgrade voucher (which MS deferred recognising in their accounts so they could call them Vista sales with temporary XP license) and (b) OEM Vista sales that are the only choice on most new retail PC's, many of which which haven't yet shipped to customers, even though MS has counted them a sales.

its always bean like that though. The majority of all windows OS's are sold preinstalled on PC's you buy from dell and PCworld etc. It was no different when XP was released.
 

severnsource

Active Member
Again you post on a false premise.Vista is growing every day,

It's only growing because that's what most PCs are supplied with.


"intel Mac mini" in setup, possible reason for posting..

Maybe, but to the unbiased the Mac OS is much less frustrating than Vista and a much better designed user interface. (Speaking as someone who has lots of PCs running 2000/XP and one Mac mini that doesn't get used much.)

Bill
 

treacle

Active Member
It's only growing because that's what most PCs are supplied with.




Maybe, but to the unbiased the Mac OS is much less frustrating than Vista and a much better designed user interface. (Speaking as someone who has lots of PCs running 2000/XP and one Mac mini that doesn't get used much.)

Bill

Like I said its doesn't matter what version its sold in, retail, OEM, pre-installed PC, home build, they are all sales, its growing and it will gradually become THE SYSTEM to have.

Macs may be a decent system in your opinion but your only a small part of the world market,
Its too restrictive for usable applications and all equipment for it is resticted to Apple prices and supply..

Incidently do you know if anyone has done a home built Mac.

Your experinces with 2000/XP are probably like mine,but they hardly qualify you to compare, without actually having experience of using Vista.
 
A

ancientgeek

Guest
Again you post on a false premise.Vista is growing every day,
What is the false premise on which I post? I mentioned MS motivations in the design of Vista, and pointed out that customer demand is not driving Vista adoption, but the MS monopoly ensures that lack of demand makes little difference to the final result. I mentioned things MS has done to give a false appearance of customer demand. Of course Vista (installed base) is growing every day. For most PC buyers, there is no real choice.
"intel Mac mini" in setup, possible reason for posting..
If what you are saying here is that it looks as though I would prefer not to use Vista, you are right. I use Windows 2000 and Mac OS X. The Mac mini is in fact rarely used.
 
A

ancientgeek

Guest
they are all sales, its growing and it will gradually become THE SYSTEM to have.
I disagree. Vista is now irrelevant to MS's attempt to prolong its monopoly, and MS has lost the battle for the living room. We just have to watch this play out over the next few years. The PC era is slowly ending, and MS have made major strategic errors in recent years. As a proven monopolist, MS is constrained in what it can do to extend its monopoly. For example, MS would love to block Quicktime/iTunes under Windows. But that would be stopped in the courts. For the consumer and the living room, MS now has to accept competition. Certainly Apple is currently the leading PC competitor, but with Linux and open source software, any manufacturer can offer a presentable consumer solution without paying a Microsoft tax.
 
Now ladies before I strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who can not play together. ;)

This is a friendly forum and I hope that someones view and option can be that and that only, it belongs to them.

Vista is with us and will be staying with us. For a while, I would only use windows 2000. I am now happy using xp and think I will give Vista some time to grow before I use it.

Regarding having Vista pre installed you can then decide to remove it for something else. I belive you should have an option regarding what OS you would like. Looks like the likes of Dell now give more OS options. :smashin:
 

treacle

Active Member
Sorry PP
But it gets a little wearing that the opposition to Vista is from the sidelines,
No actual experince of it.

Just rhetoric without real content.
 

tapzilla2k

Distinguished Member
Never write off Microsoft. They have moved into the living room via the Xbox and the Xbox 360. The PC is not dead yet, in fact it'll probably still be around for at least another decade and beyond. Computers will still be needed in the workplace and in server form to run large networks and of course the internet. The devices we have at home will most likely shrink in size and be used in the living room. Windows may become a modular Operating system, as has been mooted by some technology reporters and bloggers.

Vista is very stable, once you have all the drivers for your hardware. I think Vista is over priced (which may put people off), though MS were virtually forced into adding DRM into Vista to keep the Hollywood studio's happy. I'm sick and tired of the Hollywood studio's treating every consumer as a probable pirate. But that's another debate entirely.
 
Sorry PP
But it gets a little wearing that the opposition to Vista is from the sidelines,
No actual experince of it.

Just rhetoric without real content.

I see your point, but like other subjects do you require experience to talk about something? What about those who ask how does this and that feture work ? Is this not what this forum thrives on ? The New, The Old and The Wise !

Yes I have had a few goes on a few different machines running vista and to me its not for me not at this moment in time. :(

I use a few Adobe products in my spare time and I did read about Adobe stating that they will not bring any updates for Vista out yet. As this is mainly what I use my computer for, this is why I am leaving Vista be and my system is the most stable it has been for a while. Everything does what it says no need to rock any boats.
 
A

ancientgeek

Guest
Despite the money spent on it, Vista is not much more than XP SP3 with a new name. That's one of the burdens of being a monopoly - you have to stay compatible.

It's what Vista reveals about Microsoft and the content distribution and IT industries that this thread is about.

I just came across this essay, Microsoft is Dead which broadly speaking I agree with. Don't mind the title; the point is, no-one in the IT industry is frightened of Microsoft any more. That's new.
 
S

SquintingBadger

Guest
Despite the money spent on it, Vista is not much more than XP SP3 with a new name. That's one of the burdens of being a monopoly - you have to stay compatible.

It's what Vista reveals about Microsoft and the content distribution and IT industries that this thread is about.

I just came across this essay, Microsoft is Dead which broadly speaking I agree with. Don't mind the title; the point is, no-one in the IT industry is frightened of Microsoft any more. That's new.

By that logic you could say XP is just 2000 with a service pack. There has been a lot of new code in Vista, not least of which is the brand new display driver model (which was sorely needed).
 
A

ancientgeek

Guest
. . . MS were virtually forced into adding DRM into Vista to keep the Hollywood studio's happy.
Not really fair. How could they be forced? They're a monopoly. If the studios want distribution on the MS platform, they have to accept whatever MS offers.
 

tapzilla2k

Distinguished Member
Not really fair. How could they be forced? They're a monopoly. If the studios want distribution on the MS platform, they have to accept whatever MS offers.

While Microsoft is a very rich company with a powerful reach in the PC industry, it is however put in the shade by the combined might of the Hollywood studio's.
It's the Hollywood studio's that want copy protection on HD-DVD and Blu-Ray. Microsoft would happily not bother with DRM as it costs them money to keep it secure. There is a lot of murky politics going on.
 

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