Interested in some advice

BritishDave

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Hello all,

I'm new hear. Will you show me around?

I'd be interested in getting some advice from some more experienced people than me as I'd like to upgrade my modest hifi setup, mainly the speakers, which is currently as follows.

Scoot R-36S
Martin 208S
Thorens TD 160

The speakers i've been looking at are :

Dynaudio M10
Monitor Audio bronze 1

My thoughts are that the amp is possibly too weak to be paired with the Dynaudio speakers?
is it worth investing in a new amp or going for the less powerful speaker that is the MA BR1?

Thanks for your help and comments.

D
 
If I have read correctly your amp is just 30w into 8 ohm per channel. Both speakers you've suggested could be driven by it but not to very loud listening levels although the MA has the highest sensitivity.

It's more than matching a speaker to an amp. How big is your room? Where can you locate the speakers? What type of cartridge do you have on the TT? A bit more information would be appreciated.
 
Hi Gibbsy
My room is about 20m2 and the speakers located either side of the amp and turntable with their backs to the wall. I want something smaller than the Martins with a quality upgrade but nothing too professional, hence the smallish budget. I also don't play music really loud as i live in an appartment.
I read that the Marrantz PM6006 could drive the Dynaudios but I wonder if my (fantastic looking amp) would do the trick?
Can't think of anything else right now
D
 
Your amp will drive them, just not to very high levels without the fear of clipping and distorsion and at 20m2, roughly the same size as my listening area, then at reasonable levels your amp should be fine. At 45 watts into 8 ohms the Marantz isn't that much more powerful.

You will probably hear a different in audio quality by changing the speakers first, although you should try and get some auditions, taking the amp with you. The Dynaudio will not like being pushed back against the wall and the MAs might perform better in such a location.
 
Get powered speakers!
you get more value for spending little money.
Otherwise both amp and speakers need replacing, or alternatively
"Live with them".
 
I listened to both speakers at the local dealer and the Dynaudios sound great. I'm think my amp might not be powerful enough to get the best out of them. I have a look round and budget wise i've read good things about the cambridge cx60 but the two could be difficult to pair up and I need a phono stage. The Marrantz PM6006 seems fairly versitile too. Any other ideas? Tx
 
...I'd like to upgrade my modest hifi setup, mainly the speakers...

I want something smaller than the Martins with a quality upgrade

Are you dissatisfied with the sound quality of your speakers or is it more of a size issue?

I've no idea about the amp & speakers but the turntable is still revered today. Do you know what tonearm is fitted (maybe one of Thoren's own 'TP' range or maybe 'SME')? And what cartridge? Not all cartridges output the same signal level so have different amp phono input requirements.

I also don't play music really loud

A quality 30W/channel into 8 Ohm amp would drive both these speakers to reasonable (though not party) levels in a room of your size. The MA's are reasonably efficient and the Dynaudio's are of 4 Ohm impedance which would allow a quality 30W/channel into 8 Ohm amp to output around 40 to 50W - enough to drive these slightly inefficient speakers to reasonable levels - but as I know nothing about your amp, I can't say the same about it.

The MA Bronze 1 sells for around half the price of the Dynaudio Emit M10. Have you listened to any other speakers nearer to the top end of you budget (of £500?). The speakers under consideration have 5" bass/mid drivers which may be a little marginal in your room. Speakers with a 6 to 7" bass or bass/mid driver should be ideal in a 20 sq.m room, IME. I think this may be important because even speakers with 6 to 7" drivers may sound bass light in comparison with the Martin 208S and its 8" drivers - unless of course, you want less bass.
 
How far can you push the budget for the amp. There are very few that can trouble the Rega Brio at it's price point for a new unit. MM phono stage. It's new price is around £599.

http://www.rega.co.uk/brio-2017.html
 
Budget?
 
@dogfonos > The Martins are nice but not very versatile. Plus the fact that they're not in great condition. I just think it's time to upgrade and take my listening experience a little further. As I said the DA sounds very precise and powerful for their size but I don't think the amp will pair well with them.
@gibbsy and @Don Dadda > No real fixed budget. I'd say 500 quid.

Also i measured my lounge and it's more 15/18 m2 than 20. Would the M20s be a better fit for that size room as they will be the main speakers?
 
How far can you push the budget for the amp. There are very few that can trouble the Rega Brio at it's price point for a new unit. MM phono stage. It's new price is around £599.

http://www.rega.co.uk/brio-2017.html

Looks nice. Can I plug the iphone into it?
Does the Cambridge CX60 have a phono stage? I can't see one on the specs.

The amp would need to be versatile in terms of source > Turntable/Iphone/Cassette and CD deck.
 
I know absolutely nothing about using a phone for music, I am a very basic analogue person and only the analogue side of the amps are of real interest to me. The Cambridge does have a USB connection on the back, but like you I cannot find out if it has a phono stage. No doubt someone with the Cambridge will tell you.
 
Hi Gibbsy
I might be naive here but how do you adjust the bass, treble and such on the REGA BRIO?
None of the Rega amps have tone adjustments. My Elicit R has a tremendous grip on a very fast and agile bass with the KEF R300s which was the main reason I choose Rega over a Naim Nait that I auditioned.
 
None of the Rega amps have tone adjustments. My Elicit R has a tremendous grip on a very fast and agile bass with the KEF R300s which was the main reason I choose Rega over a Naim Nait that I auditioned.

So what happens if there's too much bass in the song for example? Does it auto-adjust?
(Sorry if my questions seem daft)
 
No. The source is portrayed as it is mixed. Poor recordings are really exposed, perhaps the worse I have is a Haim CD Something to tell you. Then you play a really good recording such as my recently delivered SACD of Supertramp's Breakfast in America and it sounds simply superb.

A lot of retailers stock the Brio and I'm pretty sure you could get an audition of one with the speakers you decide on. I was really surprised by the Elicit when I auditioned it. Going into the audition is was not my first choice, that was the Nait Nait 5si or XS2 at a push and AudioT suggest listening to the Rega. I left with the amp that put the biggest smile on my face and that was the Rega and by some margin.

I don't find the bass overpowering with the Rega, although I'm certainly not into those recordings that have heavy bass as a major part of the sound. What the Rega does portray is the deep bass of drums and seems especially good at bass guitar where you hear the note starting and finishing and is not just a blur of sound. This is also a trait of the KEF R300s where with the Rega the bass is portrayed in a clean fast manner.

Orchestral work is also very good with the Rega with good instrumental separation although all of my meagre classical collection is confined to redbooks.

I strongly suggest you get auditions, if buying new, of any amp you are interested in and not buy blind.
 
Also i measured my lounge and it's more 15/18 m2 than 20. Would the M20s be a better fit for that size room as they will be the main speakers?

There's a bit more to matching a speaker to a room than size alone. Furnishings, room shape, room construction, speaker bass loading techniques and personal preference all play a part (often an unpredictable part) so there are no definitive rules but I have used several different sized speakers in many different rooms over the years and my experience tells me that for an accurate tonal balance (note: not everyone seeks an accurate tonal balance - this is where personal preference comes in) a speaker with a single 6" - 7" bass or bass/mid driver in each cabinet (or equivalent driver area) usually works better in a 20 sq.m. room than a speaker with a 5" bass or bass/mid driver in each cabinet.

Rooms of 15 sq.m. would be the maximum size I'd recommend for a 5" driver and the minimum size I'd suggest for a speaker with a 6" - 7" driver. You've grown accustom to using speakers with 8" drivers in this room which, IME, usually gives a warmer-than-accurate tonal balance. If that's the tonal balance you're after, I'd suggest using speakers with a 6" - 7" driver. The Dynaudio Emit M20 would therefore fit the bill or any other similarly sized speaker, of which there are many.

So what happens if there's too much bass in the song for example? Does it auto-adjust?
(Sorry if my questions seem daft)

Back in the day, when all amps sported basic bass and treble tone controls, I don't remember using them. Reason was, whilst tone controls could clearly change the sound, they rarely seemed to improve it - not to my ears anyway. I mean, what are the chances that a recording with excessive bass, say, could be properly equalised by using an amp's bass tone control? Not very high, I suspect. More chance of introducing additional peaks and troughs in the frequency response.

That said, there are still many amps out there with traditional tone controls so the choice is yours.
 
Hi Dogfonos.
There is or was a very good reason for having bass and treble controls in amplifiers,.
Rooms with a lot of damping, eg heavy curtains,carpets can do with a wee bit of treble lift , whereas rooms with a lot of hard surfaces, may be over endowed with high frequency energy.
As recent postings on speaker cables have discussed, long cable runs can also benefit with a touch of treble lift, to equalise the response.
In addition, not everyone of advanced years has a perfectly flat frequency response ,and the ability to tailor the sound output is an advantage.
..
I see it as an arrogance that manufacturers rarely give this option any more. It is in fact an area where the much maligned AVR and home cinema recievers are in advance, of the stereo amplifer segment, as some of these provide multi frequency equilisation, by measuring the room acoustics.
 
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Lots of tone controls were a farce. Poorly implemented and having a huge change manifested with a tiny nudge. Ridiculous.

Arcam, Cambridge Audio and Nad, all of which I owned back in the day, had much more subtle an effect. Just a couple of dB here and there depending on which room they were being used.

Quite useful at times, but mostly I left them alone.
 
There is or was a very good reason for having bass and treble controls in amplifiers,.
Rooms with a lot of damping, eg heavy curtains,carpets can do with a wee bit of treble lift , whereas rooms with a lot of hard surfaces, may be over endowed with high frequency energy.
As recent postings on speaker cables have discussed, long cable runs can also benefit with a touch of treble lift, to equalise the response.

I take your point. There must be folk who find them useful - guess I just wasn't one.

...some of these provide multi frequency equilisation, by measuring the room acoustics.

Now that is an advance over simple bass/treble tone controls. Seems to me that things have moved on apace in recent years and there are now several DSP-based solutions that really do allow successful frequency response manipulation, taking into account as they do, speaker/room interactions.

I wonder if such 'room correction' DSP EQ systems will ever be integrated into 'real world' stereo amps or will they remain an add-on?
 
If you class the Yamaha RN803 everyday then I think that is about as far as it goes down the food chain at the moment for room correction. Obviously av receivers have a form of it in their set up e.g denon aydussey.
 
If you class the Yamaha RN803 everyday then I think that is about as far as it goes down the food chain at the moment for room correction. Obviously av receivers have a form of it in their set up e.g denon aydussey.
Also, Lyngdorf have their Room Perfect software integrated into their stereo amps, and MiniDSP have their new SHD preamp with Dirac.
 
I would audition as many speakers as you can. Speakers have their own house sound, find the sound that you prefer and then consider a change of amplifier if you think you’ll need it.

Do not rule out 2nd hand speakers and or amplifiers, you will get a lot more bang for you buck. If possible audition some transmission line speakers, you may get a surprise at low to medium listening levels.

As for amp power, don’t get hung up on it. One example is the Marantz PM7200, 95w per channel at 8ohm class D or 25w full class A mode.
 
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Hello All
New question..
I've been looking at the Cambridge CXA60 and the REGA BRIO, main difference being the digital inputs on the Cambridge as well as a lack of a phono stage. If I were to go for the Cambridge, i'd need a preamp for my Thorens 160 right? Would i be correct in thinking that the REGA FONO is the kind of thing i need?
Rega Fono MM MK3 review
Thanks once again
 

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