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Integrating Lyngdorf TDAI3400 with Arcam AV850

anjan

Active Member
What would be the best way to set this combination up? I will have a 5.1.4 speaker setup.

Should I set these up independently using the Lyngdorf (with RoomPerfect) for music wired to the Lt, Rt and Sub; the Arcam wired to all speakers (except two atmos speakers that would need another two-channel amp)? This would mean the RoomPerfect would not be used for AV at all and 3 speakers (lt, rt and sub) would be wired to both amps.

Is there a way of integrating them so that the Lyngdorf drives the lt, rt and sub for AV? If I went this route, how would I go about room correction? Would there be a way of using the Arcam lt and rt outputs to drive the two extra atmos speakers instead? The Arcam has pre-amp outs.
 

Rob Sinden

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
Yes , that would give a huge upgrade for music and film. Here is a brief guide:-

Here is an initial starting point....please feel free to email me directly for more help. Room dims and a list of the speakers used are essential. Photos of the room and speaker location would be helpful...….

Audiophile Music & Surround Sound…… Affordably


There are many great value AV Receivers that provide all the functions and connection you require in a surround system. If you want the make a surround sound system sound exceptional for surround sound and as a high-fidelity music system, the addition of a TDAi2170 provides the perfect solution.

By using the TDA to amplify your main speakers and subwoofers, corrected with RoomPerfect, the performance of an AV system will be transformed giving performance that cannot be achieved at the price with any other system. Here’s how it works.

1. Set up the TDA connecting to the main stereo speakers and sub or subs.

2. Run RoomPerfect for these speakers and subs.

3. Connect the TDA to you Receiver’s main pre-outputs.

4. Set up your Receiver and be sure the main speakers are set to “large”.

5. Additional subwoofer can be connected to the Receiver if required.

6. Do not use the Receiver’s room correction for the main speakers

7. Connect a 12v trigger cable between the Receiver and TDA

8. Set the TDA to HOME THEATRE mode

Now, the TDA doesn’t need to be touched by the user and will act as a slave amplifier but with all the benefits of RoomPerfect and its exceptional amplifier quality.

Stereo music and surround sound will be transformed.
 

aandpwoodley

Distinguished Member
Yes , that would give a huge upgrade for music and film. Here is a brief guide:-

Here is an initial starting point....please feel free to email me directly for more help. Room dims and a list of the speakers used are essential. Photos of the room and speaker location would be helpful...….

Audiophile Music & Surround Sound…… Affordably


There are many great value AV Receivers that provide all the functions and connection you require in a surround system. If you want the make a surround sound system sound exceptional for surround sound and as a high-fidelity music system, the addition of a TDAi2170 provides the perfect solution.

By using the TDA to amplify your main speakers and subwoofers, corrected with RoomPerfect, the performance of an AV system will be transformed giving performance that cannot be achieved at the price with any other system. Here’s how it works.

1. Set up the TDA connecting to the main stereo speakers and sub or subs.

2. Run RoomPerfect for these speakers and subs.

3. Connect the TDA to you Receiver’s main pre-outputs.

4. Set up your Receiver and be sure the main speakers are set to “large”.

5. Additional subwoofer can be connected to the Receiver if required.

6. Do not use the Receiver’s room correction for the main speakers

7. Connect a 12v trigger cable between the Receiver and TDA

8. Set the TDA to HOME THEATRE mode

Now, the TDA doesn’t need to be touched by the user and will act as a slave amplifier but with all the benefits of RoomPerfect and its exceptional amplifier quality.

Stereo music and surround sound will be transformed.
Are you able to turn off room correction for just the main speakers in Audyssey.

I have a feeling it’s all or none.
 

Rambles

Distinguished Member
Are you able to turn off room correction for just the main speakers in Audyssey.

I have a feeling it’s all or none.
You can with the app.

The OP has Dirac and Room Perfect on his kit.

You can also turn off Dirac on individual speakers, I don't know about Room Perfect.
 

Seriously Ltd

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
Are you able to turn off room correction for just the main speakers in Audyssey.

I have a feeling it’s all or none.
Yes you can turn off Audyssey for L&R speakers which is what we do if used in conjunction with a Lyngdorf.
 

dazed&confused

Active Member
In the system proposed by Rob, am I correct in thinking that one would get Low Frequency Effects (i.e. any sound at all from the .1 channel) ONLY if one adds the 'if required', additional subwoofer connected directly to the AV pre-processor?

Does mixing two different room correction systems for 5.1 really work that well in practice (the AV forums review of the Lyngdorf 2170 didn't actually try this, but the reviewer speculated that it probably wouldn't be very good, albeit without any explanation)?

What would be a suitable room correction unit for the second (5.1) sub in my system, bearing in mind that a MiniDSP running Dirac is incompatible because of a firmware issue with the Audiolab 200AP? And would correction applied just to the sub (not the centre or surrounds) be sufficient?

Thanks.
 

aandpwoodley

Distinguished Member
Yes you can turn off Audyssey for L&R speakers which is what we do if used in conjunction with a Lyngdorf.
Thanks, I checked in the AVR but couldn’t find how to do it but seems you can using the app.

Lots of thinking to do now
 

Seriously Ltd

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
Thanks, I checked in the AVR but couldn’t find how to do it but seems you can using the app.

Lots of thinking to do now
Feel free to get in touch if you need any advice.
 

Seriously Ltd

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
In the system proposed by Rob, am I correct in thinking that one would get Low Frequency Effects (i.e. any sound at all from the .1 channel) ONLY if one adds the 'if required', additional subwoofer connected directly to the AV pre-processor?

Does mixing two different room correction systems for 5.1 really work that well in practice (the AV forums review of the Lyngdorf 2170 didn't actually try this, but the reviewer speculated that it probably wouldn't be very good, albeit without any explanation)?

What would be a suitable room correction unit for the second (5.1) sub in my system, bearing in mind that a MiniDSP running Dirac is incompatible because of a firmware issue with the Audiolab 200AP? And would correction applied just to the sub (not the centre or surrounds) be sufficient?

Thanks.
By telling your AVR that you have NO subwoofer and large L&R the .1 LFE is redirected to the L&R pre outs of the AVR.

There are no issues running RoomPerfect with other EQ’s.
 

dazed&confused

Active Member
By telling your AVR that you have NO subwoofer and large L&R the .1 LFE is redirected to the L&R pre outs of the AVR.

There are no issues running RoomPerfect with other EQ’s.
Ah, I see - so the LFE would be routed out of the AVR into the Lyngdorf, which would then use its own crossover (at 80Hz, for example) to send to the line-level input of the subwoofer. Alternatively I could just set the speakers to 'large' in my Audiocom Signature Oppo 105 and use the L&R outputs from its superior, dedicated stereo output directly into the Lyndorf?

Thanks Rob

The Lyngdorf is starting to sound very appealing. I'd not thought at all of using the 'set to large' solution for AV duties, and was beginning to think that I would be better off saving up for an MP 50 to use for stereo duties as well, but that would seem like a waste just for a 5.1 system in the lounge. The 2170 solution would seem to be great, provided my centre speaker (PMC CB6i) and surrounds don't really need any correction - I'll have to learn to use REW to measure my room and see what's happening at the moment.

Typically speaking, if I were to get a second sub for the set-up you describe, would I have them both up-front or would they be located towards opposite corners of the room? In my system the front speakers are firing across the width (narrow dimension) of a lounge diner.
 

Seriously Ltd

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
Ah, I see - so the LFE would be routed out of the AVR into the Lyngdorf, which would then use its own crossover (at 80Hz, for example) to send to the line-level input of the subwoofer. Alternatively I could just set the speakers to 'large' in my Audiocom Signature Oppo 105 and use the L&R outputs from its superior, dedicated stereo output directly into the Lyndorf?

Thanks Rob

The Lyngdorf is starting to sound very appealing. I'd not thought at all of using the 'set to large' solution for AV duties, and was beginning to think that I would be better off saving up for an MP 50 to use for stereo duties as well, but that would seem like a waste just for a 5.1 system in the lounge. The 2170 solution would seem to be great, provided my centre speaker (PMC CB6i) and surrounds don't really need any correction - I'll have to learn to use REW to measure my room and see what's happening at the moment.

Typically speaking, if I were to get a second sub for the set-up you describe, would I have them both up-front or would they be located towards opposite corners of the room? In my system the front speakers are firing across the width (narrow dimension) of a lounge diner.
If you want to home trial just let us know.

Front corner load the subs

Rich
 

dazed&confused

Active Member
If you want to home trial just let us know.

Front corner load the subs

Rich

Thanks Rich

I'm going to seriously think about it, but it will probably take me a few months to decide what route to go down I would imagine.

Given a choice between one corner loaded sub by itself, versus one corner loaded and the other between 1/3 and 1/2 down the length of the wall (with the front speakers firing across the width), which would be best? Or would it be okay to have them in opposite corners, with one of them right over the other side of the room nowhere near the listening area?

I don't use a very high spec sub at the moment - it's just a BKXLS400. If I got anything else it would get it would need to be down-firing, preferably in oak, to fit in with the furniture.
 

anjan

Active Member
What I find interesting is that this discussion implies room correction is done on an individual speaker basis. I get that speakers should be matched (I will probably opt for MK300s/150 for LCR) but that is a separate issue. Room correction on a per speaker basis would allow the MK150 centre speaker to be processed by Arcam Dirac, while the MK300s lt and rt speakers would be corrected by Lyngdorf RoomPerfect; while still delivering excellent movie audio.

Generalising out, it may mean that as room correction technology evolves, different room correction techniques will be applied to particular speaker/ room dimension/ position combinations.
 

Seriously Ltd

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
Thanks Rich

I'm going to seriously think about it, but it will probably take me a few months to decide what route to go down I would imagine.

Given a choice between one corner loaded sub by itself, versus one corner loaded and the other between 1/3 and 1/2 down the length of the wall (with the front speakers firing across the width), which would be best? Or would it be okay to have them in opposite corners, with one of them right over the other side of the room nowhere near the listening area?

I don't use a very high spec sub at the moment - it's just a BKXLS400. If I got anything else it would get it would need to be down-firing, preferably in oak, to fit in with the furniture.
Ideally front L&R but sometimes you have to work with the room you have.
 

anjan

Active Member
Yes , that would give a huge upgrade for music and film. Here is a brief guide:-

Here is an initial starting point....please feel free to email me directly for more help. Room dims and a list of the speakers used are essential. Photos of the room and speaker location would be helpful...….

Audiophile Music & Surround Sound…… Affordably


There are many great value AV Receivers that provide all the functions and connection you require in a surround system. If you want the make a surround sound system sound exceptional for surround sound and as a high-fidelity music system, the addition of a TDAi2170 provides the perfect solution.

By using the TDA to amplify your main speakers and subwoofers, corrected with RoomPerfect, the performance of an AV system will be transformed giving performance that cannot be achieved at the price with any other system. Here’s how it works.

1. Set up the TDA connecting to the main stereo speakers and sub or subs.

2. Run RoomPerfect for these speakers and subs.

3. Connect the TDA to you Receiver’s main pre-outputs.

4. Set up your Receiver and be sure the main speakers are set to “large”.

5. Additional subwoofer can be connected to the Receiver if required.

6. Do not use the Receiver’s room correction for the main speakers

7. Connect a 12v trigger cable between the Receiver and TDA

8. Set the TDA to HOME THEATRE mode

Now, the TDA doesn’t need to be touched by the user and will act as a slave amplifier but with all the benefits of RoomPerfect and its exceptional amplifier quality.

Stereo music and surround sound will be transformed.
Hi again

Regarding 3. - what should I connect the pre-out to on the TDAI3400? I don't have the optional analogue input module on my amp
 

markymiles

Distinguished Member
I take it you have already purchased the TDAI3400? Just asking as the Arcam with Dirac is no slouch for music. Seems a lot of money for what might not be much of an upgrade. I would definitely arrange a trial first if you haven't purchased yet.

You could also, depending on what you have already get a fairly decent speaker upgrade for £5k.
 

anjan

Active Member
The Arcam I've found excellent for AV work. I do have the Lyngdorf with MK IW300 speakers now and this is much better for music.

If it's not possible to connect my Lyngdorf to the pre-outs in the way Rob suggested, I'll could use a switcher like the Niles SPK1 to drive the IW300s for both music and AV separately via TDAI3400 and AVR850 respectively.
 

jason shep

Well-known Member
Hi again

Regarding 3. - what should I connect the pre-out to on the TDAI3400? I don't have the optional analogue input module on my amp
Hi anjan, you don’t need the optional analogue module, connect L&R pre outs from your AVR to analogue 1 or 2 input on your TDAI, select that input>menu>setup>inputs> Home Theatre mode & your good to go, I use my 2170 this way with my AVR :thumbsup:
 

anjan

Active Member
I'm actually using an Anthem MRX1120 in this setup. It's not quite working for the sub but working perfectly for FL FR. I assume that the signal going to the sub comes after the AV processor decodes the audio codec.

Without the sub, that processing results in signals going to all the other speakers.
With the sub, the corresponding signals below the crossover frequency from all speakers (not just FR and FL) go to the sub.

So connecting the sub to the 3400 alone means that it cannot get any signal from any of the other speakers that are not connected to the 3400 by the Anthem pre-outs.

In fact, I get normal sub output for music, and no sub output for movies. This is OK as the sub is bi-amped now to both Anthem and Lyngdorf; it effectively utilises RoomPerfect for music and Anthem Room Correction for movies. But I can't see any way to have it set up to utilise one or more subs for movies and music using RoomPerfect alone.
 

Rob Sinden

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
Provided all your subs are connected to the TDA and you tell the Anthem you have full range main speakers, the other speakers are bass limited and you have no sub, I cannot see why this won’t work.

Is it connected/set up in this way?

I’ve ran a system like this with a Denon for months and it worked perfectly.

I know Arcam do some odd things in their bass management which could create issues, but I assume Anthem’s bass managements is like the rest of the worlds.
 

anjan

Active Member
OK - so I checked the bass management section for the Anthem. It allows crossovers to be set for all speakers; I'm guessing turning all of these to 'off' is similar to equivalent 'large'. I just did an A/b comparison on the Blade Runner 2049 opening and... - it definitely works
 

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