Immensely fast and cheap to run

=adrian=

Member
Ok. An exercise for all bored people.

Lets see what options there are, if any. A car that is fast and won't break a budget.

Newish (up to 5yo and 50k miles))
Fast (200+ BHP)
Not too expensive to run (parts, services, etc)
Reliable
comfortable with all the gadgets
5 door
Economical when needed, immensely fast when pushed
Up to £10k

Does such thing even exist? I can't think of anything that will fit that description.
 

=adrian=

Member
How economical? 2009/10 Focus ST?
Yes, well. Focus ST, Mazda 3 MPS, I don't think those cars fit the "economical when needed" category.

I think you really have to drive them like a nun to hit low 30s (mpg). I was thinking more 40s when driving normal.

Though certainly an option to keep in mind.

Given the choice between the two I think I'd lean more towards the Mazda TBH.
 

Rob8980

Member
A diesel Astra with 150bhp as standard will remap to about 200bhp or just over, should be available within budget. Could probably get similar with a diesel focus or golf.
 

Sloppy Bob

Distinguished Member
BMW 330D or 325D

Not much in the way of petrol (if anything) is going to get you the combination of performance/power and fuel economy you want.
 

=adrian=

Member
Yes, I realise that probably my best bet would be a diesel. That's why I was looking at diesel Audi's earlier. The prices for something like 3L diesel 5 yo A4, A5 or A6 seem to start from 10-11k. Problem with those however is that they usually have around 100k milage for that price and I wouldn't necessarily call them "cheap to run". Any fault and I'll be looking at few grands worth of repair bill, as with all Audi's and BMW's.

BMW 330 and 325 is a similar story to Audi. I'll have to stretch my budget and then if anything happens, I'd be left with a big CC bill. I will however keep it in mind. I'd love either Audi or BMW, but I'm not sure I can afford to keep and run one everyday.

My current car is 09 Mazda 3, though not 2.2 diesel but 1.6 petrol and that's the main reason why I think about changing - not enough power. 2.2 diesel is definitely worth keeping in mind though and if I decide to go for more powerful Mazda 3 than mine and for any reason MPS would be out of the run, then 2.2 is next in line.

The problem I have with diesels however is that the car would be doing lots of short trips. My work is few miles away, so my car is mostly doing few few-mile-trips each day, to work, to shop, etc. I'm not sure how diesels will work in conditions like that.
 

MC77

Well-known Member
Up to 10k? Hmm, I would of put forward my VW CC, I bought it at the end of February, 170 GT version, getting it mapped next week which should return about 210BHP, just returned 60mpg on a 370 mile run?
 

un1eash

Distinguished Member
Immensely fast and cheap to run don't go together. You can have a quick cheap to run car but not both. Big engine BMW's/Audi/Mercs or smaller engine turbos will give you performance but as mentioned not always that cheap to run.
 

=adrian=

Member
Yes, I know it is a tall order, hence I created this thread to see what other people opinions are. I'm glad that I did though, because already it gave me some ideas.

VW CC I do like those cars. They offer pretty much what I'm after, comfort and space for my family, gadgets and good equipment for me. Performance? I'm not sure, I think they are quite heavy and more, erm, limo-like(?), if you know what I mean. Kind of more towards comfort than performance. Mike, can you say that this car is fast when you put your foot down?

One thing I read about them is that they lose value very quickly and they are quite hard to sell. Also I don't think they are cheap to run, parts are expensive and hard-to-get from what I heard.
 

Sloppy Bob

Distinguished Member
If your regular commute is only a couple of miles each way then I'd probably forget about a diesel. It won't have a chance to get up to temperature properly so it won't be properly "diesel" efficient.
You may also run into issues the the DPF if it's an older car and not getting up to operating temp.
 

=adrian=

Member
Seat Leon FR remapped TDI?
Purely esthetic and personal thing, but I don't like this car (and most Seat's for that matter). I know it's fast, but I don't really like how it looks.

I know I sound like I'm trying to find faults with suggestions people add to this thread, but that's really not the case. I appreciate all the help I get :)

If your regular commute is only a couple of miles each way then I'd probably forget about a diesel. It won't have a chance to get up to temperature properly so it won't be properly "diesel" efficient.
You may also run into issues the the DPF if it's an older car and not getting up to operating temp.
That's what I thought too, but I plan to give it some kick from time to time, which I think will help. It's the problem that I struggle with all the time though, petrol or diesel, neither like short trips.
 

=adrian=

Member
I think I'm just wasting everybody's time here. I don't think the car I'm looking for exists within this budget. Time to suck it up and save more money and think about it again in some time.

I don't think it is a good idea changing a 2009 car for 2009 car which is just a bit faster, but other than that very similar to what I have now. If changing, I'd love to get more premium car than what I have now.

Is it just a such a tall order to have a car that looks this good, is very fast, reliable and cheap to run?

(pic shamelessly stolen from another thread on AVF)




Is this Audi A5 or A7?
 

MC77

Well-known Member
VW CC I do like those cars. They offer pretty much what I'm after, comfort and space for my family, gadgets and good equipment for me. Performance? I'm not sure, I think they are quite heavy and more, erm, limo-like(?), if you know what I mean. Kind of more towards comfort than performance. Mike, can you say that this car is fast when you put your foot down?

One thing I read about them is that they lose value very quickly and they are quite hard to sell. Also I don't think they are cheap to run, parts are expensive and hard-to-get from what I heard.
Adrian,

I'll tell you a little story about how I came to own a CC;

Two years ago I started my current job which required me for a short while to take several trips up and down the M6 from West Cumbria to Surrey every month, I didn't own a car at the time so plumped for something that would get the most MPG and be comfortable at the same time, this car was a 2008 VW Passat highline which I hated the look of as it reminded me of something my old man would have, although it came decked out with everything, Sat Nav, leather seats the lot, and the best thing? It returned 60-65 MPG on long runs. Perfect. That was a 2.0CR 140 model. I bought it for 10K with 30,000 on the clock.

Now, fast forward to February this year, I still hated the looks of the car, but I had literally fallen in love with how nice it was to drive and how cheap it was to run. In the 14 months I owned it, I had put nearly 35,000 miles on it (unbelievable right?) and managed to do 1000 miles to a tank on one of my trips from West Cumbria to South of France, I did this trip a few times and only managed it once, but still! In my time of ownership, I had one service and one failed rear parking brake, aside from insurance, fuel and the other little bits, the car cost me just over 800 quid in nearly 3 years worth of average mileage.

I decided that although I'm nearing 30 faster than I would like, I wanted something that I liked but I was very reluctant to give up the running costs of the Passat, so I started looking at alternative, I looked at the Golf GTD, but something didn't quite click with me and then I decided on the CC, practical, (I have a 7 year old) same engine as the Passat, I preferred the idea of the 170 to the 140 but was happy to settle with the 140 as I was planning on a remap anyway, and I knew the exact spec I wanted so I played the waiting game and just checked the VW used website on a weekly basis, I had already set my budget, which was 10k plus my car, which was worth about 5.5 to 6.5 depending on the dealer.

One afternoon of searching I found the car I purchased now with everything I wanted, 170 engine, GT spec which adds adjustable suspension, rear tinted windows and a few other small things, alacantra sports seats, the upgraded Sat Nav unit, bluetooth cruise control, the works. It was a 2010 model which was slighter older than I wanted however it had 17,000 on the clock. Perfect.

Went to see it the next day at VW Guildford and bought it on the spot, it was flawless, full service history, not a mark inside and everything I'd hoped.
After a fair bit of negotiation, (Without sounding big headed, a strong point of mine and I was prepared to walk away if need be) I managed to get the cash price down to 6k between haggling up and down between my car and the new one, so there are good deals to be had just require a little patience is all.

Ownership-wise I haven't had a problem, the garage I bought it from is awful to be honest, no after sales service to speak of, however it's not detracted from the car which I think it brilliant, obviously this is personal but I love it. Currently on one of our French runs, and since a week last Thursday I've covered 1600 miles at an average of 57MPG. Yes it down a bit, but really I can live with it. In regards to performance, it sits at 80MPH on the French motorways all day with no issues, and the pickup is great, obviously it's not immensely fast, but it's quick enough, I believe it's around 8 or 9 seconds to 60, but I don't rag about like I used to when I was 17 anymore, and it's nimble enough in the corners and I'm fairly confident in it whilst driving, a couple of times I've questioned whether I'm going a bit too fast, however it's never come unstuck yet. The adjustable suspension does make a difference with both a comfort setting, which makes it a bit wallowey which is great for long distance cruising you can't feel a thing and a 'sports' mode which tightens everything up and makes everything sharper for a hoon around the Lake District on a Sunday afternoon.

I'm booked in next Wednesday for my remap which as I said before is meant to take it to around 210BHP, I'm not that fussed on PHB to be honest (Pubtalk horse power) however it's supposed to add a significant amount of more torque which by all accounts transforms the experience of the car but maintains the economy.
If it gets anything close to these claims I'll be a happy man, I will report back once it's done!

Anyway, essay over. I hope it's helped because although it seems a long saloon sort of car, I couldn't recommend it more. Love mine.

If you have any other questions feel free to ask, I believe you're on the north east? If you're ever in the lakes give me a shout and I'll be happy for you to come have a go.

 

MC77

Well-known Member
And in regards to reliability and cost to replace consumables, it's essentially and B6 Passat underneath so easy enough to get hold of and a decent reputation for reliability. Parts can be had cheap enough if you're prepared to shop around and not go directly to VW. Example being the parking brake I mentioned in my last post. I was quoted 800 by VW, I got a new OE quality one from my local garage for 350 fitted.
 

un1eash

Distinguished Member
I think someone really likes their passat cc.
 

=adrian=

Member
Adrian,

I'll tell you a little story about how I came to own a CC;

Two years ago I started my current job which required me for a short while to take several trips up and down the M6 from West Cumbria to Surrey every month, I didn't own a car at the time so plumped for something that would get the most MPG and be comfortable at the same time, this car was a 2008 VW Passat highline which I hated the look of as it reminded me of something my old man would have, although it came decked out with everything, Sat Nav, leather seats the lot, and the best thing? It returned 60-65 MPG on long runs. Perfect. That was a 2.0CR 140 model. I bought it for 10K with 30,000 on the clock.

Now, fast forward to February this year, I still hated the looks of the car, but I had literally fallen in love with how nice it was to drive and how cheap it was to run. In the 14 months I owned it, I had put nearly 35,000 miles on it (unbelievable right?) and managed to do 1000 miles to a tank on one of my trips from West Cumbria to South of France, I did this trip a few times and only managed it once, but still! In my time of ownership, I had one service and one failed rear parking brake, aside from insurance, fuel and the other little bits, the car cost me just over 800 quid in nearly 3 years worth of average mileage.

I decided that although I'm nearing 30 faster than I would like, I wanted something that I liked but I was very reluctant to give up the running costs of the Passat, so I started looking at alternative, I looked at the Golf GTD, but something didn't quite click with me and then I decided on the CC, practical, (I have a 7 year old) same engine as the Passat, I preferred the idea of the 170 to the 140 but was happy to settle with the 140 as I was planning on a remap anyway, and I knew the exact spec I wanted so I played the waiting game and just checked the VW used website on a weekly basis, I had already set my budget, which was 10k plus my car, which was worth about 5.5 to 6.5 depending on the dealer.

One afternoon of searching I found the car I purchased now with everything I wanted, 170 engine, GT spec which adds adjustable suspension, rear tinted windows and a few other small things, alacantra sports seats, the upgraded Sat Nav unit, bluetooth cruise control, the works. It was a 2010 model which was slighter older than I wanted however it had 17,000 on the clock. Perfect.

Went to see it the next day at VW Guildford and bought it on the spot, it was flawless, full service history, not a mark inside and everything I'd hoped.
After a fair bit of negotiation, (Without sounding big headed, a strong point of mine and I was prepared to walk away if need be) I managed to get the cash price down to 6k between haggling up and down between my car and the new one, so there are good deals to be had just require a little patience is all.

Ownership-wise I haven't had a problem, the garage I bought it from is awful to be honest, no after sales service to speak of, however it's not detracted from the car which I think it brilliant, obviously this is personal but I love it. Currently on one of our French runs, and since a week last Thursday I've covered 1600 miles at an average of 57MPG. Yes it down a bit, but really I can live with it. In regards to performance, it sits at 80MPH on the French motorways all day with no issues, and the pickup is great, obviously it's not immensely fast, but it's quick enough, I believe it's around 8 or 9 seconds to 60, but I don't rag about like I used to when I was 17 anymore, and it's nimble enough in the corners and I'm fairly confident in it whilst driving, a couple of times I've questioned whether I'm going a bit too fast, however it's never come unstuck yet. The adjustable suspension does make a difference with both a comfort setting, which makes it a bit wallowey which is great for long distance cruising you can't feel a thing and a 'sports' mode which tightens everything up and makes everything sharper for a hoon around the Lake District on a Sunday afternoon.

I'm booked in next Wednesday for my remap which as I said before is meant to take it to around 210BHP, I'm not that fussed on PHB to be honest (Pubtalk horse power) however it's supposed to add a significant amount of more torque which by all accounts transforms the experience of the car but maintains the economy.
If it gets anything close to these claims I'll be a happy man, I will report back once it's done!

Anyway, essay over. I hope it's helped because although it seems a long saloon sort of car, I couldn't recommend it more. Love mine.

If you have any other questions feel free to ask, I believe you're on the north east? If you're ever in the lakes give me a shout and I'll be happy for you to come have a go.

I'm sure there is a thread here some time ago before I bought my current car where I ask questions about VW CC.

You mention you don't like the exterior much, I do like it though. I don't care if it looks like an old-man car, I still like it. Always did. What's more I'd love to own one. I always liked big cars, my current car is a compromise where I had to downsize (engine-wise and size-wise) due to running costs and having my first baby. Now however, I miss having a bit more under my right foot when I need to (especially when overtaking) and also the space in the back is a bit of a joke.

It looks like I won't be able to afford my Audi anytime soon, so I'll definitely keep the CC in mind. I still have some time to think about it all.

Thank you for a nice post, it was a good read :smashin:
 

PSM1

Distinguished Member
I know it is brand new so well out of budget but something like the new Golf GTE could be the sort of car you are looking for. May just have to wait a couple years for it to fall into budget!!!!!
 

MC77

Well-known Member
I think someone really likes their passat cc.
Did I go a bit over the top?

I'm sure there is a thread here some time ago before I bought my current car where I ask questions about VW CC.

You mention you don't like the exterior much, I do like it though. I don't care if it looks like an old-man car, I still like it. Always did. What's more I'd love to own one. I always liked big cars, my current car is a compromise where I had to downsize (engine-wise and size-wise) due to running costs and having my first baby. Now however, I miss having a bit more under my right foot when I need to (especially when overtaking) and also the space in the back is a bit of a joke.

It looks like I won't be able to afford my Audi anytime soon, so I'll definitely keep the CC in mind. I still have some time to think about it all.

Thank you for a nice post, it was a good read :smashin:
Just to clarify, I didn't like the old Passat, hence why I changed to the CC, much more aesthetically pleasing.
 

=adrian=

Member
Did I go a bit over the top?



Just to clarify, I didn't like the old Passat, hence why I changed to the CC, much more aesthetically pleasing.
I never liked the old Passat look too. CC is a completely different looking beast. I'm sure if it wasn't for a VW badge and Passat name, it would be a completely different story sales-wise.

I know it is brand new so well out of budget but something like the new Golf GTE could be the sort of car you are looking for. May just have to wait a couple years for it to fall into budget!!!!!
Funnily enough, when I searched for the GTE (as I never seen it before) it also returned a result for another VW. This one:


Volkswagen New Midsize Coupe concept revealed | Auto Express
 

gangzoom

Well-known Member
My wife has been pushing me to get something cheaper to run than our 335 for a few months now. She is using it a lot more recently and I think feed up of sticking in £80 of petrol and getting less than 300 miles from the tank.

So, cheap to run and fast (300bhp minimal, ideally 400bhp) is my wish list for the next car....The only thing I have found so far that can deliver this and has approval from the wife is Tesla S. But at £65k for the mid range 360bhp, 85kwh model I want, it's going to take me a few years to save up, but am 95% sure my next car will be a performance EV along the lines of the Tesla S....The plus side means I'm no longer been pushed to swap the 335 (which to be honest is pretty cheap to run for a 400bhp machine), so hopefully 3 years of saving plus 3 years of depreciation will put the Tesla within reach :)
 
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