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Image Retention and Screen Burn Q's

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs' started by xx396, Aug 6, 2005.

  1. xx396

    xx396
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    Does screen burn only occur when it is left on for say 8 hours with a static image or can the effect also manifest over time if the viewing tendencies are a certain way. Say like if 50% of viewing was regular tv or dvd and 50% CBeebies :) This is not my case at all but I think many can relate to that being "normal use" for a set! I was particularly worried by the one person who had trouble with CBeebies after only 4 hours even though the set was run in and under 50% contrast. Hopefully this was just image retention as I can leave my CRT on with a dvd menu overnight and having done this a good 100+ times, theres not a hint of anything, so I find it hard to believe that the plasma manufacturers claim their sets are comparable.

    I'm a bit concerned about if the viewing habits tend to be one logoed channel for a lot of the screen life (we don't watch an awful lot) and also the Sky Digi guide and blue bar when channel hopping, done so fast the bar doesn't ever go off lol, as this'll probably occupy a hefty percentage of the screens activity. My logic is that if some phosphors are mostly showing the same thing, it will eventually burn whether it be in 1 year or 5. Is this not the case as people only seem to mention it when accompanied by leaving the set on for several hours in one burn-in session, i.e. is the burn chance lost as long as something breaks up the flow?

    I'm also curious about image retention, what is the best practice to make sure it isn't a problem. Is normal viewing enough, do you avoid that particular retained source for a bit, give it some white noise?
     
  2. neilmcl

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    I think far too much is being made of the burn-in issue and there seems to be way too many scare stories circulating around, unfortunately thats the inherent nature of forums like these. Whilst plasma displays and CRTs may or may not be comparable on this issue they do indeed share the same phosphor technology as to image display and therefore can produce the same side-effects of screen burn and image retention.

    If this was such the problem in everyday use that some people seem to make out do really think the plasma manufacturers would continue to sell the millions of panels they do every year.
     
  3. pjclark1

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    get a panny 6 or 7 and forget about screen burn & image retention, after 1 year my panny PWD6 screen is "as new", but remember the PW8 or HD screens may not be as good.
     
  4. phillfyspoon

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    PW8 claim same as crt while 6 and 7 claim near crt.
     
  5. orange66

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    Well, my Sony trinitron is to all and intent burn proof, you can run the same logo for 8 hours a day 7 days a week, I see no damage at all on it. I let the cbeebies logo have less than 12 hours over 3 days, and it has left an image retention that is still visible after 3 days of non stop use on logo free screens to get rid of it. Thats not an opinion, thats fact. I do not agree with your opinions about the way the screens use the same underlying phosphor technology either. My television cost over two and half thousand pounds, and came damn close to being permanently damaged by a logo. I may have a twitchy screen, I dont know, but plasmas are a lot lot more sensitive to this than crts, and furthermore the manual warns owners not to display logos and other still images on these sets for 'an extended period'.
    I do not think that multi thousand pound sets sell in the uk 'by the million', but as HD takes off and the prices drop, they will. Then we will see this issue being raised a lot more I predict.
     
  6. peterakastorm

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    What makes you say that? I'm thinking about buying a PWD8, over the PWD7...
     
  7. Nick_UK

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    I agree. The biggest jokes are the Panasonic owners who claim their plasmas are "burn proof" and everyone else's isn't, when all plasmas use exactly the same panel technology, and in many cases the panels are made by the same manufacturer ! :) I note that airports now use plasma screens for flight details, and none of the ones I saw showed any screen burn whatsoever. (They must have been Panasonics ! :rotfl: )
     
  8. GalacticaActual

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    All plasmas should be carefully run in for the first 200 hours of the life. this means keeping the brightness and contrast levels down to around 50% until this run in period is over. A plasma, during its first 150-200 hours, is more supseptable to burn in and image retention during this time. Once this has been done ,then a self calibration of the screen should be done with some thing like digital video essentials or the avia dvd to set the proper levels of brightness , contrast, colour , ect.
    A lot of screen burn and image retention can occour because the contrast and brightness of the screen is set to high. Not only do you run the risk of this problem, but you are also reducing the plasma life span buy overriding the panel so much.
    I have a viera 37pe30. I have had no problems with screen burn and image retention because of the above advice. I have had the plasma for a year now and it is still like new. various programs get seen on it during the day and movies and it is also used for gaming.

    Dave :)
     
  9. Nick_UK

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    How do you know that it would definitely have been damaged if you hadn't gone through this ritual ?

    I have a Hitachi 42PD5300 (which many "experts" here would tell you is the worst make for screen burn :rolleyes: ), and I didn't "run it in" at all, and I don't have any problems either ! :)

    Do a Google search on "plasma screen burn". 80% of the results will be from people posting on forums like these, and the posters are only blindly repeating stuff that other posters have told them. Another 20% are from retailers trying to scare people into buying either a more expensive LCD screen, or (at the very least) extended insurance on a plasma. You see very few returns from actual manufacturers sites.

    I'm not saying that screen burn is not a "feature" of plasmas. However, I do feel that it has been "hyped up" so much now, that it actually deters people from buying plasmas, which is really stupid, because the problem is nowhere near as bad as some would have us believe !
     
  10. GalacticaActual

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    Your right, I dont know for sure, but on a display that cost me over £2000, why take the risk?





    I agree , it probably does deter some people . The problem is , is that the very fist plasmas had a lot of problems with screen burn and because of this ,it has stuck with this type of display. My Viera is supposed to be very resistant to burn and image retention but, if you look in the manuall it does warn you against it and what you should and should not be doing with the display. This of course is only put in the manuall to cover them selves against any problems that might occour, but beacuse of this warning it helps to keep the plasma burn in and image retention problem alive. :suicide:

    And again, why risk it?
     
  11. xx396

    xx396
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    I think there is still a lot of panic because for example, there was one guy on here who only ran it for 4 hrs on a logo one day, 2 the next, 2 the next, all on under 50% constrast after running the set in, and still got a nasty case of image rentention which'll take a week to clear up. Okay it probably hasn't burnt but do you want your set looking awful for a week!
     
  12. pjclark1

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    I've always considered "running in" of plasmas to be a little scam so you don't get to return a plasma that isn't good enough within the 7 day mail order cooling off period (7 days = 168 hours). Mail order suppliers are very keen to talk about "running in"
    Just my opinion.

    Panny 6 and 7 glass are the same in the UK and I have never seen any owner complain about screen burn or image retention (I understand the 7 does not allow componant input into the onboard VGA socket, maybe panny wanted to sell a few more componant boards). The 8 glass and HD glass is different and hence unknown. When manufactures change a tried and tested componant, it's often because they have found a cheaper way to make it, and doesn't always mean it's a better product for the consumer. So my rule is, don't buy a product that isn't tried and tested by other users first (fools rush in, etc.)

    So you think ALIS plasma screens are the same as Panasonic SD plasma screens are the same as cheap Korean plasma screens (what made you get a Hitachi when you could have bought a Tiny, after all, they are all the same).
    Are all LCD panels the same as well?
     
  13. Alan A

    Alan A
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    Aren't the Fujitsu screens produced at the same plant as Hitachi's?

    How many actual plasma plants are there?
     
  14. Majid Khan

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    It most certainly does, myself being one. I was very close to buying the Sony 42M1 plasma tv earlier this week (managed to get a good deal, at £1100) but have now decided to put it on hold for a while - after reading abt the problems people are having with screen burn, especially the Cbeebies logo one! my young ones have Cbeebies on all day long and it is worrying to think that I'll be spending this money (not a lot, I know - compared to the more expensive HD plasmas out there) and within days, the tele could be ruined with a cbeebies logo permanently etched on to it!

    And its not just permanent damage either that worries me, but apparently some people here think image retention is a "feature" of plasmas , I'm not so sure I'll ever be able to enjoy a tele that will retain black bars from watching a widescreen movie on a DVd, for several hours after the movie finishes.. imagine, turning on News at Ten after watching a DVD, and then seeing these irritating faded bars running through the top of Trevor McDonald's head! :rolleyes: can someone kindly assure me that this isn't a routine 'feature' of plasmas? becaause if it is , I dont think i'll be able to stand it..

    I'm now seriously considering going for a 32" Sony CRT instead for the time being - a pity, because I really wanted a bigger screen, especially for the kids to enjoy (with their Cbeebies) - but I guess the technology out there is not quiet upto it, or so it seems..

    Went to my local Comet the other day, and I was surprised that even the Pansonic PV500 (which was supposedly 'burn proof' or so I had assumed) had an MTV logo etched into it.. disappointing, if that's what the best and most burn-proof are like, than heck.. what chance do you have with a Hitachi or a modest Sony plasma dare I say it :)
     
  15. pjclark1

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    As I stated earlier only the panny 6 and 7 have proven themselves to be virtually "burn proof". Why do you assume different screens from the same manufacturer will be as good. HD screens are a totally different product.
     
  16. Badger0-0

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    It's not a problem, I can assure you.
    Just follow the (sensible advice, IMO) that's been given.
    Certainly don't let it put you off plasma :smashin:
     
  17. GalacticaActual

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    Seriously, follow the advice that has been given by my self and others and you wont have a problem. I have had a whole night of watching movies in widescreen with black bars, and not had a problem. This was after about 2 days of owning the screen ,and it was for about 6 hours non stop, apart from chaning the DVD :D
    Image and screen burn does happen, but on rare ocasions and only if you a not setting the screen up properly. Remember if you come acros this problem in a shop, its been on for 8-10 hours a day on the same channel day in and day out with a very high contrast seeting so it can be seen in the shop under very bright conditions.
     
  18. neilmcl

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    Well you should read up about the the different technologies then because as you will see both CRT and Plasma produce an image by stimulating phosphors on the back of the screen, albeit using different methods. It's the premature aging of the phoshor cells that creates the burnt in image.

    I was talking about worldwide sales after all this issue effects all displays, not just ones sold here in the UK.
     
  19. Majid Khan

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    Dave, thanks for that clarification.. btw, which plasma do you have?

    I'm glad to hear that its okay to watch widescreen movies with black bars at the top and bottom on a plasma.. from what i was told previously, this was meant to be one of the main causes of screen burn / image retention.
     
  20. GalacticaActual

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    Mate ,not a problem.

    I wont say screen burn and image retention does not happen, because that would be silly :D But as long as you are carefull and dont have the contrast and brightness up over what they should be , then you really should not have a problem.

    My Plasma is a Panasonic 37pe30.
    Pics can be found on this thread here

    ake sure to read the whole thread, its quite interesting and sows some decent setups of plasmas.

    Dave.
     
  21. Brooktop

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    I upgraded from a 32" Sony Wega to a Panny PW6 about 3-4 months ago and have had no 'burn' and most of my viewing is of DVDs (many at 2.35:1 and therefore with black bars)....no image retention. I keep it on cinema mode with most of the settings pretty much at the suggested level ie where the marker is on the bar.

    Aren't these settings adjustable so that you can alter them for different viewing conditions? If you calibrate a screen with something most people have, like the THX optimiser on Lucas discs, it suggest doing it in low light. But surely, you';d have to turn brightness up a bit in bright light. Just use common sense eg Kids have got to eat/pee etc...so what's all this talk of 4 hour viewing sessions?? (moral debates aside!!!) - Just put the TV on stand-by or change channel occassionally!
     
  22. TheGworks

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    I emailed Panasonic customer care to get advice re image retention and 'screenburn' and this is their reply:

    Thank you for your email.

    In response, there can be a danger of screen burn on Plasma screens and
    this does depend on the brightness and how highly coloured the logo is. We
    recommend changing the channel even if just for a moment at least every
    hour or flicking between channels during advertising breaks. When watching
    a film in wide-screen mode, just changing the channel for seconds can avoid
    after image.

    Without signal or operation for 5 minutes the saver will automatically
    appear to prevent image retention. Please see Page 56 of your user manual
    'Caution' with advice on voiding problems that may occur with the screen.

    Placing the Plasma screen where it may receive strong sunlight for long
    periods of time is also not recommended.

    I trust that the above will be of assistance to you. However, of course, if
    you should have any further queries, please do not hesitate to contact us
    on 08705 357357 or customer.care@panasonic.co.uk and we will endeavour to
    assist.

    Customer Support


    What they suggest makes sense - but for how long do you need to take these precautions I wonder?

    Regards
    G
     
  23. Majid Khan

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    Fascinating.. I knew screen burn was an issue with plasmas, but sun burn? :)
     
  24. kingsize

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    Jesus wept.

    Sunburn - they cannot be serious....
     
  25. av addict

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    any one recommend what factor we should be using :rotfl:
     
  26. loz

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    So Panasonic are seriously saying I can't even watch a widescreen movie uninterupted without risking screen burn?
     

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