I'm in the market for a new DAP ... and I'm gonna buy what YOU vote for!

Discussion in 'Headphones, Earphones & Portable Music' started by shadowritten, Oct 26, 2005.

?

Which one do YOU think I should buy?

Poll closed Dec 1, 2005.
  1. Creative Zen Sleek 20GB?

    4.6%
  2. Rio Karma 20GB? (Availability permitting)

    7.7%
  3. iPod Video 60GB?

    44.6%
  4. Archos Gmini XS202 20GB?

    6.2%
  5. iAudio X5 30GB?

    20.0%
  6. Other ... convince me to consider a model of YOUR choosing!

    27.7%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. shadowritten

    shadowritten
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    Yep, it's poll time once more.

    Given my recent infuriating/angering run-in with Sony Connect's shocking 'Big Brother'-style DRM system (see my thread on who benefits from DRM), and the news that the HD5 is, as many of us expected, being dropped like a hot turd by Sony in terms of future software support, I've decided it's time to look elsewhere. Yes, I'm gonna miss Sony's gapless playback (amongst other great features), but I have my principles and my limits ... and I've reached the latter!

    So, it's over to you people. I've listed the makes and models I'm considering, and I'd appreciate it if you could not only vote but also argue furiously in favour of your preferred pick of this bunch ... and I'll buy whichever DAP has the greatest number of votes AND strongest supporting arguments for its superiority.

    Clear on the rules? Grand! Vote/argue away :smashin:

    PS: My thanks to you all in advance :thumbsup:

    PPS: Polling station closes on Dec 1st 2005.
     
  2. Sasso

    Sasso
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    Can I break the rules? I voted for other but, other not as in other player but other suggestion.

    I think you should KEEP YOUR HD5!

    Do you honestly believe that there is another player you'll like better than the HD5?
    Dont let it anger you, the software is a little slow, so what, be patient, its a very small fraction of the time of your life and look how much entertainment it has given you, listening to all those hours of good quality music.
    What can compare to the HD5?, there is no battery that lasts longer, there is no player smaller (for the capacity), there is no player that sounds better (imo from what i have experienced), there is no player that looks as good (imo, it looks pretty good), just put it on the desk look around the room, look outside for a while (i dont know if you have a view or not, look at trees if you can see them), then look at the HD5 again, its a gorgeous little thing, so cute and innocent looking, so technical and minature, just think of whats inside, a 20 yes 20 gigabyte hard drive in this little device the size of a pack of cards, who ever though that possible. (it gets more perspective if you put it on the floor in front of your stereo and stand up and look at it from across the room)

    Whats your current problem with DRM? The only thing that annoys me is that you cant transfer off the HD5 onto any computer. And I have to say, it has prevented me from copying music for friends, so it does its job well. But yes the problem is that you cant use it to back up your own music. But come on think about it, you will have all of your music on your computer anyway, and if not, use an external hard drive, i would not trust the HD5 being my only backup of my music anyway, considering mp3 players are mobile and do get exposed to G-forces and whacks so would not be anywhere near as reliable as a hard drive or external one or CD/DVD for long term storage.

    (one of) The only big complaint about the HD5 is the fact that you cant have a shuffle session that continues when the player turns off, which it does too quickly and shouldnt turn off at all when on pause. Well there are many complaints but that is that one bugs me every single day and annoys the crap out of me. oh that and how long it takes to change to line out.

    All you will get from getting another player is maybe a week of happiness then you will find out all the flaws and wish you had your sony again.
    Just imagine if you get another one. EVERY TIME the song changes and you hear a GAP, EVERY TIME the battery goes FLAT, EVERY TIME the sound distorts, you will feel the PAIN of regret.

    Just think about it. But otherwise get an iPod, if you cant beat them, join them. However you wont realise what you had until its gone (or not being used).

    Also - How is the iPods DRM restrictions different from Sony's? Any dont the other players you have on the poll have copywright protection too?
     
  3. lukey

    lukey
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    what ever you end up choosing i would go for something that supports mp3 and always keep your music in that format, that way you wont have to re-rip your music time after time if you end up changing you player like i did when i went from the hd1 to the ipod.

    However on this instance i would be unsure in recommending the ipod, you will find that there are issues regarding bass ouput (although i admit im a bit of a bass freak), it does scratch quite easy so you have to treat is like the crown jewels although itunes, its interface and hard drive size and features do make up for its misgivings. I dont regret buying mine, and would consider replacing it with another in the future asi have to admit that the new 60gb slimmer version does look nice, and the larger hard drive size means you could rip in an decent quality mp3 and not suffer the drm issues you have had with the sony

    I haved voted for other and would consider the archos gmini402 camcorder, its 20gb and got other toys attached like, it takes pictures, has a built in camcorder, is very small and sleek, supports all files types, autosyncs with media player, line in for wav recording, 2.5 inch colour screen, plays videos either on itself or through a tv., problem is its only 20gb which these days isnt that much space
     
  4. DiGdUb

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    if you hate drm, then cross the ipod off your list too. what you need is a drag and drop in windows explorer player.
     
  5. lukey

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    theres no DRM issues on the ipod if your ripping your music from a cd in mp3, only if you download from itunes or rip in aac format.
     
  6. Cloysterpeteuk

    Cloysterpeteuk
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    You can also strip the drm from a Apple AAC file with it's 'fair play' drm easily.
     
  7. Sasso

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    there are no DRM issues with Sonicstage when ripping either Atrac or Mp3 either. I dont see what the big deal is.
     
  8. Cloysterpeteuk

    Cloysterpeteuk
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    I always find it amusing when people base there choice of DAP of what the DRM is like, even those who know 99% of the music they will put will come from discs they already own. Apple has by far the worst rep when it comes to DRM and i'm really not sure how they acquired it, they are no worse than the others in that respect. I've even come across a few perspective DAP buyers who thought the only way to get songs on a pod was to use itms and one of them asked me what the difference between an mp3 player and an ipod was!.
     
  9. shadowritten

    shadowritten
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    Thanks for your thoughts so far.

    The 'big deal' with DRM for me isn't so much that I can't get around it in the majority of cases. It's more about me finally tiring of supporting manufacturers who:

    a) Restrict how music files are added to their DAPs;

    and

    b) Restrict what honest customers can do with DRM 'infected' files (i.e. making simple back-ups to external media without some complicated process which COULD threaten the future use of said files!).

    This is why my two top choices for a future player are the iAudio and the Archos: both use DRM-free MP3 (I know this true of many other DAPs), and crucially, both are drag 'n' drop. In fact, maybe its not just the DRM thing that's annoying me now; maybe the D 'n' D aspect is also becoming more important.

    So, I'm still open to suggestions. And if - by some happy coincidence - gapless features among your recommendations, I'll be as happy as a sandboy!

    Again, cheers!

    PS: I've voted for the Archos and iAudio, as these are at the top of my investigations at present.
     
  10. Happytab

    Happytab
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    Ha ha - Ipod's winning and you hate Apple !
     
  11. shadowritten

    shadowritten
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    Happytab, I didn't say anything about me not RETURNING the DAP that wins if it turns out to be a load of toss for my needs! And besides, it's the supporting posts that'll make up my mind, not just the number of votes.

    So there!
     
  12. mrtbag

    mrtbag
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    The title of your first post clearly says you'll by the one we VOTE for, not recommend. I have now voted for an I-Pod too, so I can watch you back peddle!! :rotfl: :hiya:
     
  13. woody57

    woody57
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    Hello,Ive tried them all,until i recently obtained a new PHILLIPS HD 6330,ITS THE BEST LOOKING,Player out their,better than the NANO,better than the SLEEK just better looking than anything before,sound wise its as good as anything out there, view it on -dapreview.net if this player ,had been released in the UK THE COMPETITION WOULD BE OVER------YOU WAIT TILL YOUVE SEEN AND HEARD IT . ABSOLUTELY AWESOME-WOODY
     
  14. Pecker

    Pecker
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    Can I offer another alternative?

    If the poll closes in December, why not wait & see if anything new comes on the market before then.

    In general, my opinion (or way of choosing) would be to see which ones were good sound quality, first and foremost. If there's not much in it (which I doubt if there will be), look at size. That doesn't mean that you should just choose the smallest, merely that you discard any that are too big/bulky.

    When you have a shortlist of players that are acceptable in terms of size & sq, look to see which has software/usability that suits.

    If you still have more than one player left on your list, go with the one you think looks best.

    That's how I'd do it. I can't tell you which one would be best for you, 'cos I don't know your requirements/taste in a number of these areas, but that's the way I'd go about it.

    Oh, I'd also have to check size of memory (do you need 60gb or not?), additional features (do you need video playback or not?) and, obviously, price (do you have a limit to your budget?).

    Sorry, that's probably not a great deal of help, and you were probably doing all that anyway.

    Steve W
     
  15. Steven

    Steven
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    Well as you all know I've been lookin at the X5...its had a price cut recently due to 5G iPod...

    20gb X5L = £230
    30gb X5L = £255
    'L' = 35 hrs, as opposed to standard 14 hrs

    mistco.co.uk have great prices, but I've yet to be convinced they give you an 'L' version as its just a typo on their site

    pm me if you want comparison pics of X5 with HD3
     
  16. Happytab

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    Shadow - "I'm in the market for a new DAP ... and I'm gonna buy what YOU vote for!"

    That's what you said - that's what the thread is called - Don't worry - I am thinking of getting a 30gb 5g Video - I guess we'll be like two peas in an ipod.
     
  17. Cardiff Irons

    Cardiff Irons
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    Well, it's got to be the ipod, because.....errr....because that's what I'm getting!

    Arguments don't get much stronger than that! :D
     
  18. shadowritten

    shadowritten
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    mrtbag/Happytab: I WILL buy the one you vote for. As long as the supporting arguments are ALSO compelling. It's all there in black and blue in post #1!

    I'll own the winner for a MINIMUM of 14 days to 'road test' it. If it makes the grade, it goes everywhere with me. If it don't, it's back in the box and back to the store.

    Sorry if this sounds like backpeddling - it's not, just sensible consumerism!

    Incidentally, if you think this is all about me not liking Apple/iPod, you're wrong. Would I have included it on my list if I wasn't seriously considering it?

    C'mon all. Let's have some more votes ...
     
  19. Steven

    Steven
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    I'll vote...eventually...I got plenty of time

    Hey, everyone, did you all notice shadow voted for the X5?

    P.S that site is meant to be misco.co.uk
     
  20. shadowritten

    shadowritten
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    And here's my reason from an earlier post:

     
  21. shadowritten

    shadowritten
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    I'm inclined (once again) to agree with much of what you say, Steve, but in terms of these points in particular ...

    ... my answers would be: Yep, need 60GB+. Still have at least that amount of MP3s encoded at 320kbps from a year or so ago - though I'll probably transcode down to around 192kbps, as I've no qualms about doing this. Video playback: I'd probably never use it, but it might be fun to try for a bit - certainly, it wouldn't be a fair 'road test' if I didn't at least try this feature, should the new iPod win the race. Price: I've always maintained I'd go as high as £350, no more. So again, if the more expensive iPod or iAudio DAPs won, I'd need to source the most competitive price.
     
  22. shadowritten

    shadowritten
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    Just checked this out ... looks good 'on paper', so another possible if the 'Other' category on my poll wins out. Tell me more about your experiences with it, as I've always avoided Philips due to poor past performance with some of their products.
     
  23. shadowritten

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    Well spotted. I missed off the 'L'. I'd definitely want the longer battery life.
     
  24. Sasso

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    Its still not making sense to me. Apple falls under both A and B like Sony. So if they are the same in that respect, what does the iPod have over the Sony, for you? For me its like downgrading. Sure something different is nice but in the long run it will come down to the same thing, you will be sick of Apple and starting another poll of which player to get next.

    As for point a), is it really that bad? Even if a player was drag and drop it still needs software to hold a library so it can be organised, doing all the organising in folders is a little harder especially since you need to check the tags manually. Where would you 'need' d&d? All of your music is on your home computer and so is the software to transfer it, and I'm sure you wouldnt want to transfer songs off it onto another computer unless its your own, because thats not legal. And if it was your own, just transfer the original files, in this case atrac, which has no copying restrictions anymore, using another medium.
    For b), what copying restrictions? Whats the complicated process?, highlighting your music folder and pressing send to: (external hDD/dvd...etc)


    To me it sounds like you are sacrificing everything you bought the HD5 for, for a player with no DRM. Thats a big sacrifice considering DRM isnt much of a pain.

    If you are going to buy what gets voted on the poll, then looks like its an iPod, and I would suggest it out of whats there, mainly because i have never seen or used the other ones on the poll, but its not going to solve your problems and in addition to that you are getting rid of everthing you liked about the Sony.


    Also I would wait for the Sony A3000, you knever know it might be very good. It is apparently "drag and drop" so you might be lucky, unless sony misinterpreted the term and have made it like iTunes, still requiring software to transfer songs to the player.

    Just imagine you are buying one for the first time. WHat actually appeals to you in those other players? Make a list of the Pros and Cons of all those players and compare the lists, I can almost guarantee that the sony will have a bigger pros list than the others. That would make your decision easy, keep the HD5.
     
  25. Ryzir

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    Shadow, I'm sorry to see you are having so much difficultly with Sony that you are completely giving up on them. Maybe all of us Sony supporters need to do this so that Sony will finally "see the errors of their ways".

    Nobody really knows what the new Connect player is going to be like or the new players. Perhaps they are better, then again perhaps thay aren't. Might be worth it to wait and see.

    Don't you currently have a HD5H? and what are going to do with it? I'm in the market for one if you are going to sell it!

    Anyway good luck! :thumbsup:
     
  26. shadowritten

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    Ryzir: Whilst I can't discuss my plans for ridding myself of my HD5H on this thread (or indeed, outside the Trading Forum - this would be breaking the rules), I'll let you know if I do decide to post it up for sale in the appropriate place.

    Sasso: I hear you on so many levels. But it boils down to this - of all the iPod owners I know, none seems to have quite the same problems with DRM that Sony owners seem to. I know of no one who's bought music from iTunes which has then been invalidated on their Mac/PC simply because they made changes to their computer's software environment (this has happened to me with Sony Connect, and it's on this principle that I reject Sony's interference with my right to do as I please with my PC's set-up). Besides, I could easily use a 60GB drive ...
     
  27. Sasso

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    But what is it about, the problems other people are having, or the problems you are having? It doesnt matter that other people have problems with sony stuff, its their problem, as long as you can solve your problems, thats all you have to stress about. I dont have any problems with DRM, since SS3.2 it is exactly the same as iTunes and many other players.

    It seems that you are angry because the connect shop isnt working properly. Well, who's problem is that? Its Sony's. You dont have to use Connect, I thought you can even use iTunes to download music and then convert it to an MP3 (or burn it first). So you dont really have a problem from what i can see. Dump connect, use iTunes and keep your HD5. You can do what you please with your computer and keep the player best suited to your needs.

    iPods can only be used on 1 computer, I can use my HD5 anywhere to add songs. I believe that makes the HD5 better when it comes to DRM/Computer authorization.

    Another thing, when you download a track from connect, when your computer is deauthorized does that mean you cant play that track anymore? If so then why dont you just use your method of removing copyright on those songs, so you dont have that problem?
     
  28. lukey

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    Not quite true im afraid, you can add songs to an ipod from other computers as long as its got itunes installed and you set itunes for 'manual' sync instead of automatic.
     
  29. Sasso

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    I thought you had to format it. Well it doesnt make the sony any worse.
     
  30. Cloysterpeteuk

    Cloysterpeteuk
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    Even if the other comp doesn't have itunes if your ipod is enabled for disk use then you can just whack the mp3's on the hard drive like an external drive, then when you get back to your place import them using itunes.
     

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