I'm falling out of love with my PJ

paul cliff

Active Member
I've had a Benq W1070+ for a few years now, coupled with an 84" electric screen from Amazon, which was around £100.

Recently I've been getting more and more bothered by the poor shadow details and performance in darker scenes. Everything that remotly in shadow just looks black, Ive played with settings, I even bought a Disney setup bluray and ran through that, didn't really help.

The room is painted mostly Magnolia, but the wife doesn't like the sound of anything darker, she absolutely hates dark rooms, everything has to be light and bright.

I only use the projector when its dark, I mean dark enough that I need a torch to move around the room, so its not too bright in the room, I also bought a filter for the PJ as I read this improves black levels, and it does, but its still not enough.

So, is the W1070 just not up to the job? Will I ever get black levels and shadow detail comparable to my 7 year old 42" Toshiba TV? I don't want to spend hundreds on a new (better) screen if I'm just going to be left disappointed. Should I be looking at replacing the PJ, and if so how much am I going to have to spend to get an improvement?

Another issue is noise, I'm noticing the fan noise a lot recently, I'm pretty sure it hasn't got louder but I'm noticing it more, and its starting to annoy me, do quiet PJ's exist or will I need to build a hush box?
 

kbfern

Distinguished Member
You will need a better pj and most sub £2k pj's will not have great shadow detail.

You could buy a used higher quality machine from Sony/JVC for upwards of £1k for a 3-4yr old machine or £2k + for something a year or two old.

A Pj is not going to give as much shadow detail as most tv's but there again most tv's will not give the WoW factor of a 100"+ pj screen,

Magnolia walls even at night are not great for pj's either so maybe pay out £2k+ for a 65 or even maybe 75" 4k tv at least you will get SOME WoW factor with that.
 

kbfern

Distinguished Member

Mallardo

Well-known Member
Another issue is noise, I'm noticing the fan noise a lot recently, I'm pretty sure it hasn't got louder but I'm noticing it more, and its starting to annoy me, do quiet PJ's exist or will I need to build a hush box?
Quiet PJs do exist. I've just checked the specs for the W1070 and it is 30db in eco mode, which isn't too bad. However my Sanyo is 19db in eco. When it comes to fan noise size is a big factor, your PJ is 2.6kg, mine is 7Kg. The Sony's and JVC's mentioned above will dwarf the Benq. So you need to consider that too if room aesthetics are an issue.
 

Gilbers

Active Member
If your room has Magnolia walls and a white ceiling you may find that even a state of the art projector will struggle to produce black levels that you are happy with. Low APL scenes may be ok, but as soon as you have a mix of light and dark areas on screen simultaneously the dark areas are going to be washed out by light bouncing back from your room.

If you really can't do anything to treat the room (it's worth checking out this thread for some creative solutions Maximising image contrast - Part 2) then your best bet would be some form of light rejecting screen (e.g Draper React). Unfortunately these can be pretty expensive - although your relatively small screen size may help keep the cost down.
 

geogan

Well-known Member
Yeah, you need some SXRD panel tech in your projector. Cheap LCD just does not do it at all.

See my signature left, that is my living room with Sony HW40-ES on about 3.3m wide screen area.

Shadow details and contrast are excellent.

And I have no woman controlling my environment, so my walls are painted in a darker two-tone brown colour for even better contrast ;)

Only my ceiling is still white and this is what is causing most problems at the moment.

And much quieter than cheap small PJs (when new! - gets a bit noiser as internal dust starts causing cavitation in fan mechanism)
 

paul cliff

Active Member
Thanks all, nice to have an idea of how much to spend in the future.
I dont think I could ever go down to anything smaller than 84", I've actually been looking at going bigger to be honest.

Wife did mention that she quite liked grey walls a while a back, I may need to investigate this to see if something can be done...might be easier than convincing her we need to spend £2k on a new PJ.

Light grey walls and a better screen is perhaps the way to go at the moment.
 

Nayfne

Distinguished Member
Thanks all, nice to have an idea of how much to spend in the future.
I dont think I could ever go down to anything smaller than 84", I've actually been looking at going bigger to be honest.

Wife did mention that she quite liked grey walls a while a back, I may need to investigate this to see if something can be done...might be easier than convincing her we need to spend £2k on a new PJ.

Light grey walls and a better screen is perhaps the way to go at the moment.
I have the w1070, and the biggest PQ quality upgrade was to put it in our now dedicated room, with a dark colour scheme and blackout curtains, the difference was night and day from our living room set up..the colour scheme and ambient light really make a difference[emoji106]
 

sim12

Well-known Member
Sony 45 is your answer

I'm inclined to agree, a few years ago I went from the optoma 131xe, upto the the Panasonic pt-at6000e at the time that Rivelled the older sony 40, the Sony 45 is said to be better than that, the difference was night and day, I would go as far as to say I went from watching a projected image to something that resembled a plasma TV image.
 

paul cliff

Active Member
I have the w1070, and the biggest PQ quality upgrade was to put it in our now dedicated room, with a dark colour scheme and blackout curtains, the difference was night and day from our living room set up..the colour scheme and ambient light really make a difference[emoji106]

Good to know, suppose I could 'plant the seed' that the spare room doesn't get much use
 

Harkon321

Well-known Member
React type screen will definitely help but they are expensive.

I also painted the screen wall and darkish purple as a feature wall. I've also got some brown curtains covering windows and glass doors. All helps.
 

MLCinema

Active Member
I've exactly the same feeling. Been using a Benq W1070 for 3 years now in a batcave and the lack of shadow detail and contrast is starting to get annoying. Thinking of upgrading to a X5500.

I do agree however that creating better viewing conditions by painting the walls in a darker color would be a good first step. Friend of mine also uses the Benq in a living room and found the projector to be be much better in my batcave

A darker color scheme will also attribute to getting the most out of a future upgrade!
 

swiftpete

Distinguished Member
I had a benq w1070. It was alright for the money as it was cheap but it was noisy and black levels weren't great. The Sony hw40es I replaced it with is much better in all ways. Sorting the room out helped a huge amount as well though.
 

jfinnie

Distinguished Member
The ReAct3 ambient light rejecting screen I have now was a bigger upgrade in my white room than going from a Sanyo PLV-Z800 to JVC DLA-X3. Although a high native contrast projector will undoubtedly look better in a bad room than a lower contrast projector, the washing out of the image during mixed brightness scenes is something that the native contrast of the projector only has a minimal effect on.

I think if you're constrained by the room to the extent you say then really an ALR type screen is a must. I made a video to show it off here:

 

geogan

Well-known Member
The ReAct3 ambient light rejecting screen I have now was a bigger upgrade in my white room than going from a Sanyo PLV-Z800 to JVC DLA-X3. Although a high native contrast projector will undoubtedly look better in a bad room than a lower contrast projector, the washing out of the image during mixed brightness scenes is something that the native contrast of the projector only has a minimal effect on.

I think if you're constrained by the room to the extent you say then really an ALR type screen is a must. I made a video to show it off here:



Nice video. Did you make sure to have the camera on all manual settings (shutter, aperture and ISO) so that it didn't change exposure itself during the test? Any changes to camera exposure would mask any in room lighting changes a lot.

What size is that screen and how much do those cost now (for a laugh!). I can just imagine the cost of one of those 3.3m wide... probably the same as a new car. :eek:
 

jfinnie

Distinguished Member
Nice video. Did you make sure to have the camera on all manual settings (shutter, aperture and ISO) so that it didn't change exposure itself during the test? Any changes to camera exposure would mask any in room lighting changes a lot.

What size is that screen and how much do those cost now (for a laugh!). I can just imagine the cost of one of those 3.3m wide... probably the same as a new car. :eek:
The video is accurate within reason; I set the camera as manual as possible. If you look when the rollerblind is half up half down infront of the fixed frame ReAct the image is same brightness top and bottom, (ReAct gain is just over 1 straight on) so there would be no reason for exposure to change. If anything the video is a little dark in the shadows compared to reality for both (for the image with this brightness the rest of the room is a bit lighter looking once your eye adapts). But of course the camera has lower dynamic range than human eye, so not much you can do about that without shooting the video in HDR.

I have an old 2016 manufacturers' price list in front of me; 3.2m wide 16:9 SRP was about 18,000 SEK with fixed Frame Vision frame covered in Veltex (they are Swedish). For electric it is quite a lot more as you have to go to Linea casing style for that width. I got a bargain and found mine used via eBay, but it is only 1.6m wide and funny 16:10 aspect.

It is a great screen and you won't be able to achieve this kind of contrast outside of a dedicated room regardless of which projector you use. Everything in my room is white and you can even turn on a little ambient light above the screen and not have the image ruined (just no light allowed from projector direction for obvious reasons...!)
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
I've had a Benq W1070+ for a few years now, coupled with an 84" electric screen from Amazon, which was around £100.

Recently I've been getting more and more bothered by the poor shadow details and performance in darker scenes. Everything that remotly in shadow just looks black, Ive played with settings, I even bought a Disney setup bluray and ran through that, didn't really help.

The room is painted mostly Magnolia, but the wife doesn't like the sound of anything darker, she absolutely hates dark rooms, everything has to be light and bright.

I only use the projector when its dark, I mean dark enough that I need a torch to move around the room, so its not too bright in the room, I also bought a filter for the PJ as I read this improves black levels, and it does, but its still not enough.

So, is the W1070 just not up to the job? Will I ever get black levels and shadow detail comparable to my 7 year old 42" Toshiba TV? I don't want to spend hundreds on a new (better) screen if I'm just going to be left disappointed. Should I be looking at replacing the PJ, and if so how much am I going to have to spend to get an improvement?

Another issue is noise, I'm noticing the fan noise a lot recently, I'm pretty sure it hasn't got louder but I'm noticing it more, and its starting to annoy me, do quiet PJ's exist or will I need to build a hush box?


I thin projectors have less value nowadays given that they're lagging behind in resolution and TVs are getting cheaper and cheaper by the year.

I really wanted to buy one but my mind said no given the tradeoffs which ur describing.
 
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ben16v

Active Member
i use a 120" platinum grey screen with my infocus 8606hd and its great in a magnolia room (in the dark) run on normal bulb not eco, movie for 2d and bright for 3d.
my sony 52 w4500 is obviously better for daytime viewing but i would not be with the pj.
if i was going to change then i would go for the sony 45 but its too large for siting in my room - oh well.
 

sim12

Well-known Member
i use a 120" platinum grey screen with my infocus 8606hd and its great in a magnolia room (in the dark) run on normal bulb not eco, movie for 2d and bright for 3d.
my sony 52 w4500 is obviously better for daytime viewing but i would not be with the pj.
if i was going to change then i would go for the sony 45 but its too large for siting in my room - oh well.

Are you completely happy with the platinum screen? I currently have a blackwidow diy job that I'm happy anough but I fancy a change, but these grey screens seem a little too cheap, perhaps too good to be true, any pitfalls you could share ?
 

ben16v

Active Member
Are you completely happy with the platinum screen? I currently have a blackwidow diy job that I'm happy anough but I fancy a change, but these grey screens seem a little too cheap, perhaps too good to be true, any pitfalls you could share ?
hey, its definitely not perfect, there are a few lines visible on bright scenes and one hot spot, perhaps it would be solved if it was tab tensioned but for £120 for an electric grey screen vs the alternatives i am happy, if you are someone who is super critical of images then i wouldnt recommend it - but i can look past it for the size and quality of the image overall. its a lot better image than the white beamax screen i had before - and that was a £300 screen which still had a few v lines visible
 

sim12

Well-known Member
hey, its definitely not perfect, there are a few lines visible on bright scenes and one hot spot, perhaps it would be solved if it was tab tensioned but for £120 for an electric grey screen vs the alternatives i am happy, if you are someone who is super critical of images then i wouldnt recommend it - but i can look past it for the size and quality of the image overall. its a lot better image than the white beamax screen i had before - and that was a £300 screen which still had a few v lines visible

Thanks for the response, that's another £120 saved, although I am inclined to agree, for the price and value it can't be knocked.
 

paul cliff

Active Member
i use a 120" platinum grey screen with my infocus 8606hd and its great in a magnolia room (in the dark) run on normal bulb not eco, movie for 2d and bright for 3d.
my sony 52 w4500 is obviously better for daytime viewing but i would not be with the pj.
if i was going to change then i would go for the sony 45 but its too large for siting in my room - oh well.

Do you have a link to the one you have? is it from Platinum Home Cinema?
 

ben16v

Active Member

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