Hybrids, PHEV Plug-in Hybrids and EV Electric cars - what's the difference?

Discussion in 'Hybrid, PHEV & EV Electric Cars Forum' started by Stuart Wright, Feb 2, 2017.

  1. Stuart Wright

    Stuart Wright
    AVForums Founder Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2000
    Messages:
    14,623
    Products Owned:
    7
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    167
    Location:
    Birmingham, UK
    Ratings:
    +10,501
    dsc_3903.jpg
    Hybrid vehicle
    Hybrid vehicle - Wikipedia
    A hybrid vehicle uses two or more distinct types of power, such as internal combustion engine plus electric motor. Most people will have heard of the Prius, which was the most popular hybrid in the UK until it was overtaken by the Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV.
    Government incentives of lower car tax plus zero congestion charge in London as well as the lower running costs can make owning a hybrid more attractive than traditional combustion engine cars. The savings do depend on your specific use of the car, however. Someone predominantly driving long motorway miles will likely find a diesel more economical.

    4.jpg
    PHEV Plug-in Hybrid Electric Vehicle
    Plug-in hybrid - Wikipedia
    A plug-in hybrid electric vehicle (PHEV) is a hybrid electric vehicle that can be recharged by plugging it in to an external source of electric power. A PHEV shares the characteristics both of a conventional hybrid electric vehicle, having an electric motor and an internal combustion engine (ICE), and of an all-electric vehicle, having a plug to connect to the electrical grid.
    A plug-in hybrid offers the possibility of running very cheaply if you do short journeys within the car's electric range (usually 20-30 miles). For example, a commute to work where it could be plugged in to recharge the battery for the journey home could mean running on electric only.
    This makes even more sense if you have solar panels to charge the car at home cheaper.

    white_car_tesla_model_3.png
    EV (or BEV) Electric Car
    Electric vehicle - Wikipedia or Battery electric vehicle - Wikipedia
    An electric vehicle (EV), also referred to as an electric drive vehicle, uses one or more electric motors or traction motors for propulsion. An electric vehicle may be powered through a collector system by electricity from off-vehicle sources, or may be self-contained with a battery or generator to convert fuel to electricity.
    An electric car is an automobile that is propelled by one or more electric motors, using electrical energy stored in rechargeable batteries or another energy storage device. Electric motors give electric cars instant torque, creating strong and smooth acceleration. They are also around three times as efficient as cars with an internal combustion engine.

    Notable green cars for 2017
    If there are errors or omissions in the above, or you would like to see this information improved, please reply below.
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2017
  2. Greg Hook

    Greg Hook
    Moderator & Reviewer

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2001
    Messages:
    23,132
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    In a secret location with Jennifer Lawrence
    Ratings:
    +10,022
    During the week I drive 2 1/2 miles to work along country roads and obviously 2 1/2 miles back!
    Then at the weekend probably only 20 miles round trip to the shops.

    Would an electric car be beneficial for these kind of journeys? I currently have a 3litre diesel.
    I'd like to try and keep the same power!
     
  3. Stuart Wright

    Stuart Wright
    AVForums Founder Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2000
    Messages:
    14,623
    Products Owned:
    7
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    167
    Location:
    Birmingham, UK
    Ratings:
    +10,501
    I read the diesels don't do well if most of your journeys are short. I quickly googled and found this
    Are Diesel Cars Suitable For City Driving? | The Car Expert
    So while you're driving in the country, the part about the filter will still apply to you.

    If you have a PHEV, you could charge it at home for the journey to work, and then again when you get there for the return journey and do everything on electric only. Although if it's only a 5 mile round trip, you needn't even charge it at work. That means you're paying for the electricity and that's significantly cheaper per mile than diesel.
    Additionally if you have economy 7, you could charge the car at night when the electricity is cheaper. Or if you have solar panels, when it's sunny so it costs you significantly less.
    These cars often come with an app which lets you remotely control these aspects of them. Like warming it up in the morning.

    It's precisely because we only do short journeys that a PHEV or even an EV would suit us.
    Then there is the reduced road tax, though that changes somewhat from April this year.
    Add to that the very recent news that some councils are going to start charging more for diesel parking and/or an inner city charge in more cities and diesels are looking less attractive.
    We're selling ours.

    If you have your own business, then buying a low emission company car makes sense because
    • It has low (7% for hybrid) benefit in kind tax
    • You can write brand new ones off 100% in year 1
    meaning it could cost the same to buy a brand new company car as (a 3-5 year old) one privately.

    I'm currently weighing up a Mitsubishi Outlander Gh4 vs a Hyndai Ioniq. The Ioniq looks nicer and works out a few grand less but I need to consider the stress of finding charging points on long journeys. Test driving both tomorrow. Ioniq is so new that the first batch specified to our requirements don't land in the UK until June.

    Hyundai IONIQ electric | Fully Charged


    Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV | Fully Charged
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
    • List
    Last edited: May 10, 2017
  4. Greg Hook

    Greg Hook
    Moderator & Reviewer

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2001
    Messages:
    23,132
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    In a secret location with Jennifer Lawrence
    Ratings:
    +10,022
    Thanks for that info. My only issue is I love the power of my 3litre Jag XF. Whilst it isn't very economical I wouldn't want to sacrifice that. I do love the Tesla but it is so far out of my budget it's not even funny!
     
  5. Stuart Wright

    Stuart Wright
    AVForums Founder Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2000
    Messages:
    14,623
    Products Owned:
    7
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    167
    Location:
    Birmingham, UK
    Ratings:
    +10,501
    You should test drive a PHEV or an electric. It's not like a sports car, but the torque from en electric system is considered better than internal combustion engine.
     
  6. LV426

    LV426
    Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2000
    Messages:
    13,474
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Somewhere in South Yorkshire
    Ratings:
    +5,905
    There are BIG changes occurring to Vehicle Excise Duty from 1 April as it will apply to newly registered vehicles. Briefly, greener vehicles will cost much more whereas "dirtier" vehicles will cost much less than at present, over their lifespan. Changes are not retrospective to vehicles already registered, nor to new ones that are bought before 1 April.
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2017
  7. IronGiant

    IronGiant
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2003
    Messages:
    63,209
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Oxford UK
    Ratings:
    +40,660

    This is the issue. To get the performance of a 3 litre Jag you need a performance Electric vehicle. And they aren't cheap.

    Electric vehicles are most cost effective for people that use the max battery capacity mileage or close to it regularly. At 5 miles a day for your commute you would take years to recoup the extra cost of your investment.
     
  8. Greg Hook

    Greg Hook
    Moderator & Reviewer

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2001
    Messages:
    23,132
    Products Owned:
    2
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    In a secret location with Jennifer Lawrence
    Ratings:
    +10,022
    Oh well, have to wait for that lottery win then!
     
  9. gangzoom

    gangzoom
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2009
    Messages:
    1,785
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings:
    +989
    Go and test drive an i3, I think your be surprised at how quick it is to 60. One massive advantage all EVs have is INSTANT throttle response with 100% torque INSTANTLY. No gears or turbo or revs to worry about, you want power and it's there under your foot straight away.

    I've owned a Integra Type R, 350Z, a very heavily modded BMW 335i dynoed just shy of 400bhp, and yet the humble Leaf I have now has better throttle response than any of those cars and by some margin. Personally I love it, and for that single reason alone I would never go back to a combustion car. Its an odd sensation to describe, but once you've tried it everything else feels instantly outdated. Going back to a combustion car for me now is like asking me ditch the smart phone for a old fashioned Nokia from the 0's, good for their time but now belongs in a musem.

    If I wasn't getting a Tesla next I would be perfectly happy with an i3/hyundai or even another Leaf (but the longer range one).
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
    • List
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2017
  10. gangzoom

    gangzoom
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2009
    Messages:
    1,785
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings:
    +989
    ALL EVs are still £0, but any with a list price more than £40k (basically Teslas) have to pay £140/year of luxury car tax for 5 years.
     
  11. Stuart Wright

    Stuart Wright
    AVForums Founder Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2000
    Messages:
    14,623
    Products Owned:
    7
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    167
    Location:
    Birmingham, UK
    Ratings:
    +10,501
    £310 a year, not £140. £140 is the standard road tax for non-green cars.
     
  12. SourKraut

    SourKraut
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2004
    Messages:
    2,858
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    106
    Location:
    Wonderful Yorkshire
    Ratings:
    +370
  13. IronGiant

    IronGiant
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2003
    Messages:
    63,209
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Oxford UK
    Ratings:
    +40,660
    This is the longest month of my life, how do people cope with ordering a new car that will take months to arrive? :confused:

    I keep wanting to ring the showroom and chant "Is it here yet?" :laugh:
     
  14. DrPhil

    DrPhil
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2006
    Messages:
    23,962
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Ireland
    Ratings:
    +9,529
    There's a long wait for the Ioniq in Ireland, quite a few ordering in the last month and have to wait til October.

    Kinda mental considering that the upgraded Leaf is being announced in September!
     
  15. Stuart Wright

    Stuart Wright
    AVForums Founder Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2000
    Messages:
    14,623
    Products Owned:
    7
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    167
    Location:
    Birmingham, UK
    Ratings:
    +10,501
    Someone from Sweden replied to my Youtube video saying they ordered April 1st for delivery in December!!
     
  16. gangzoom

    gangzoom
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2009
    Messages:
    1,785
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ratings:
    +989
    Good things come to those who wait :)

    Ordered the Tesla back in July 2016, finally picked up in late March 2017.
     
  17. DrPhil

    DrPhil
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2006
    Messages:
    23,962
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Ireland
    Ratings:
    +9,529
    That's nuts.

    I couldn't handle the wait simply because I'm too impatient, but the key is the September date for the new Leaf.

    I know that tech is always changing and much like a mobile phone, a new EV will be outdated pretty quick. But ordering an older version now knowing that a new one will be released before yours even arrives is a strange one.

    I suppose if the Ioniq meets all your needs then there's no reason to wait, but if nothing else I would expect better prices on the current Ioniq and Leaf once a newer longer range model is announced.
     

Share This Page

Loading...
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice