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HS10 and supplied filter

Discussion in 'Projectors, Screens & Video Processors' started by museumsteve, May 19, 2003.

  1. museumsteve

    museumsteve
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    still lovin my HS10 over 800+ hours on yet I haven;t even bothered to look at the filter that was supplied with it. Has anyone tried it or is anyone using it.? If so happy with the results and what sort of compensating did you need to make with things like brightness and contrast.:)

    thanks in advance
     
  2. Kramer

    Kramer
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    Not much tweaking needed with the supplied Sony filter - just recalibrate with Avia etc...

    Definitely recommend spending £18 on a CC40R from SRB though - I would never consider using the HS10 without it - absolutely essential IMO.

    :smoke:
     
  3. museumsteve

    museumsteve
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    thanks mate (how did I know you'd reply.;))
    who is SRB.? do they have a webby address.:)
     
  4. JohnS

    JohnS
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    I'm going to partially disagree here, I originally bought the cc40r and was impressed by the increase in black levels but have since gone back to the supplied cinema filter as a compromise for better black than stock but without losing so much of the punch from the restricted light output with a cc40r.

    My advice would be to try the supplied filter to begin with which gives you an incrimental improvement for no money and you hardly lose any brightness after recalibrating but you will lose some compared to no filter and see if you like the results.

    I know the CR increases with the cc40r but the loss of overall white level and colour saturated punch just wasn't worth it for me. I might be temted with a cc30r though.
     
  5. robfitzp

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    How do you calibrate the HS10 - I know where the menus are etc but do you do it by eye or with some gadget or other?

    BTW up to 200+ hours with not a single false start or any other problem for that matter. I am not supersticious.......

    Cheers
    Rob.
     
  6. John_N

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    Hi.

    I use the CC30R after an initial spell with the CC40R. Like John S, I was not happy with the loss of brightness that you get with the CC40R. The CC30R is brighter.

    The filters are available from www.srbfilm.co.uk and are £18 ea including P&P.

    Calibration should be done properly using a photospectroradiometer but these are expensive. A tool like colorfacts will set you back well over £1000.

    With this in mind, most people appear to do it by eye. You use the AVIA DVD and tweak the R,G and B gain and bias until the greys in the greyscale appear grey and not tinted red, green or whatever. This is a simplification but basically that's the gist of it. If you mess with the red/green/blue gain and bias settings you need to write down your original settings first.

    You adjust these settings from the service menu or the factory menu. If you search on these terms for the HS10 you will get the remote keypresses to enter that mode.
     
  7. beta

    beta
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    yeah I must add with my 10 foot wide screen you cant restrict the light too much out of the HS10 or it does seem rather dull.

    the ccr40 just seemed to take too much edge from the brightness, the supplied one isnt too bad, but yeah the ccr40 did have noticably better blacks
     
  8. Kramer

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    How are you guys using the HS10 with CC40R - sources, settings etc...?

    With my 8' 1.2 gain screen, via DVI & calibrated - plenty bright enough with CC40R & that's in cinema black mode.

    Via DVI, make sure you're running in "text" mode - major difference in brightness but needs serious "Avia'ing".

    :smoke:
     
  9. Klippie

    Klippie
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    robfitzp,

    Over on AVS Forums a guy called Dave Bozwell callibrated his HS10 fitted with a CC40R filter and posted the settings as % changes so that anybody could set their own PJ up roughly to his.

    Now every PJ is different so you own settings will be slightly out compaired to the calibrated set on Dave's PJ but not by much it will look fantastic all the same. This is exactly what I did to my own HS10 and then had a fiddle with Avia just to set a few other items.

    The result is stunning compaired to the out of the box settings on the HS10 it really makes all the difference.

    I find the picture plenty bright with the CC40R filter fitted but its purely down to personal taste.

    Word of warning though, remember to take a note of the original settings before you start as you can always change them back again if needed.

    Klippie.
     
  10. museumsteve

    museumsteve
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    okay..convinced I need to try the supplied filter first..now where can I get my hands on an Avia disc..and does it come with a colour filter screen (or whatever you call it). I have a Sound & Vision tune up disc, will this be as good.?
     
  11. Kramer

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  12. museumsteve

    museumsteve
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    thanks mate.:)
     
  13. robfitzp

    robfitzp
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    Cheers all, will give this a go.
     
  14. museumsteve

    museumsteve
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    Klippie, dont suppose you have a link to that avsforum thread do you. I've searched but cant find anything
     
  15. museumsteve

    museumsteve
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    well I just put the supplied filter in so will have a play tonight with some of my fav movies..:) and hopefully my Avia will be here Wednesday.:)
     
  16. museumsteve

    museumsteve
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  17. Kramer

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  18. museumsteve

    museumsteve
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    well someone slap me round the face with a wet kipper..:D
    I cant believe I waited this long to sit down and put quality time into my HS10.
    I put the supplied filter on and then went off and checked Dave Boswells fantastic thread over at avsforum.
    I'm now watching Hollow Man Superbit in almost 3D. It is absolutely incredible, Black and shadows are better, colour is stunning and skin tones are as believable as I've seen.
    The depth of image is streets away from what I expected to get with a £2k LCD unit..but I am truly astounded.

    That's all..:clap:
     
  19. Klippie

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    museumsteve,

    If you think the HS10 is good with the Sony supplied filter the CC40R is another jump again I highly recommend you get one from here...

    http://www.srbfilm.co.uk/index1.html

    These changes are for CC40R filter from the original factory settings from Dave Boswell's post on AVS.

    Red Gain - No Change
    Green Gain - Increase By 40.2%
    Blue Gain - Increase By 210.6%

    Red Bias - Decrease By 6.7%
    Green Bias - No Change
    Blue Bias - Decrease By 13.4%

    Klippie.
     
  20. museumsteve

    museumsteve
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    might just do that mate..thanks.:)
     
  21. John_N

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    Well I'm going to fly in the face of Dave Boswell and his settings and ask you to consider this:

    The above adjustments that you make to the projector for a CC40R filter mean that you need to reduce the red panel drive whilst increasing green and blue to compensate for the colour of the filter. This is because you can not drive green and blue hard enough to make 100IRE 'white' - without reducing red drive. With me so far?

    This means that for a 100IRE 'white' field, the green and blue panels will let through 100% of light, whereas the red panel will let through say 95% of light to maintain colour balance.

    This results in reduced brightness.

    However. If you look at what you need to do for a CC30R filter, because the filter is less 'red' you can afford to keep the existing 'red' setting the same, while increasing green and blue to get the colours right. This means a brighter picture.

    to my eyes, my calibrated CC30R has the same improvement in contrast and black level that my CC40R filter had, while being noticeably brighter. It's not as bright as the unit with NO filter fitted, but it's quite a lot brighter than CC40R.

    I seem to be the only person here who has tried it... Suggest that for £18 from SRB someone else should try it too...


    J
     
  22. Mr. Wilby

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    Hi John,

    If I go for an HS10, I'll definitely be getting a filter from SRB (dealt with them in my camera days and they're helpful and fast). Do you think its worth going down as far as CC20R (if such a beast exists)?

    Do you have the exact make and model for the CC30R you purchased?

    Cheers
     
  23. JohnS

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    Its a 67mm cc30r, I've just ordered one:)
     
  24. Mr. Wilby

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    Thanks John (the other one) ;-)
     
  25. Klippie

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    John_N,

    I'am intrigued by the CC30R filter idea but before I buy one please tell me what you used to calibrate your HS10 with and what you used to measure the brightness at the different IRE levels so that it is adjusted correctly at each step to give the proper colour balance.

    Klippie.
     
  26. robfitzp

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    I must be being stupid but I cannot see the Dave Boswell thread on AVS - can someone brighter please post a link.............

    Cheers
    Rob.
     
  27. Kramer

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    Assume it's still there somewhere robofitz.

    I never even looked at it TBH, used Avia & a few hours myself to get excellent results.

    Only way to do it "correctly" is with a colour anyaliser (Colourfacts etc...) but at the cost of several $ks.

    As long as you write down your initial settings, you'll be OK with Avia & your eyes.

    :smoke:
     
  28. museumsteve

    museumsteve
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  29. robfitzp

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    Cheers both

    Rob.
     
  30. John_N

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    Hi Klippie

    Agree with Kramer.

    The correct method is to use a Photospectroradiometer or tool such as Colorfacts. This costs about £1500.

    There is no real value with using someone else's % settings. They will most likely not look very good. This is the problem with the Dave Boswell % settings.

    The best way is to write down what you have and then use the settings on the colour temperature medum setting as a baseline for your twiddling. You can change the colour temperatures individually.

    You can use AVIA and your eyes to get the balance sort of reasonable. If you can feed the DVD signal to a calibrated CRT monitor then you can have a reference to compare colours to.

    J
     

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