How To Output 1080p

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs Forum' started by rage99, Jan 20, 2008.

  1. rage99

    rage99
    Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Messages:
    160
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Ratings:
    +14
    With my 360 i can only output 1080i on component. And 720p on VGA.

    And to be quite frank, this is complete crap.

    Why on earth should i be forced to buy something with a HDMI lead when i have a perfect HD & Blu Ray player that can use component and vga !

    Is there any way around this silly little business that Pioneer have done to the TV i payed £2,500 for?

    :rolleyes:
     
  2. rwniel

    rwniel
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,050
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Ratings:
    +232
    It's by and large a conscious decision by manufacturers not to allow 1080p content over analogue connections because they view it as making copying easier. With hdmi they feel they have some control of that using HDCP (High-bandwidth Digital Content Protection). With a decent deinterlacer, 1080i should still look pretty good though.

    Robert
     
  3. rage99

    rage99
    Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Messages:
    160
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Ratings:
    +14
    1080i has jaggedy edges on mine :(
     
  4. Scrutinizer

    Scrutinizer
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2007
    Messages:
    580
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Ratings:
    +175
    Then presumably you are upscaling DVD content? Your TV is probably better at this. This works best is you connect at 576i (or 576p if that is not possible). You could have a look at the table in my sig if you like and see if these settings work for your 507XD as well.

    S.
     
  5. rage99

    rage99
    Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Messages:
    160
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Ratings:
    +14
    Thanks man, but i do not have an 8 series or HDMI :(
     
  6. Scrutinizer

    Scrutinizer
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2007
    Messages:
    580
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Ratings:
    +175
    I realise that, but I suggest you try it anyway and see what it looks like..
     
  7. chaparral

    chaparral
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2006
    Messages:
    1,971
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    Planet Earth
    Ratings:
    +366
    Your Pioneer 507XD is only a 720p plasma (1365x768 screen Resolution),,,
     
  8. Scrutinizer

    Scrutinizer
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2007
    Messages:
    580
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Ratings:
    +175
    So is mine (508XD), but I think the term 720p plasma is incorrect as it is a 768p plasma. A HD signal looks much nicer at 1080i than at 720p on mine incidentally.
     
  9. rage99

    rage99
    Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Messages:
    160
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Ratings:
    +14
    Well if that is true, why does 1080 work fine?
     
  10. rwniel

    rwniel
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,050
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Ratings:
    +232
    There's a difference between accepting a particular resolution and displaying it natively dot for dot. The 507XD is natively 1365 (Hor) x 768 (Ver) pixels - the closest standard resolution is 720p (i.e upscaled slightly to fill the screen in both dimensions). 1080i or 1080p would both be downscaled as there's no difference in the number of pixels in either of those instances, just the way it's displayed. Differences in processing on different televisions means it's often worth experimenting; sometimes the source is better at doing it, other times it's better to let the television take care of all of the procesing.

    Robert
     
  11. Lin3ar

    Lin3ar
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2005
    Messages:
    6,853
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Ratings:
    +2,771
    All this has already been explained to you on the 360 forum:boring:.

    If you want 1080p get a 1080p full HD TV.It is the only way.
    You can't even get 1080i on your Pioneer.
     
  12. rage99

    rage99
    Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Messages:
    160
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Ratings:
    +14
    So will downscaled 1080p videos look better than full 720p videos?

    Thanks guys
     
  13. Scrutinizer

    Scrutinizer
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2007
    Messages:
    580
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Ratings:
    +175
    Yes but there is this misconception that 720p is somehow related to 768p. It isn't. 768x1365 is used because it is exactly 1 Megapixels, whereas 1920x1080 equals 2 Megapixels (nice round numbers for the processors). Also I don't think scaling 720p to 768p is any easier than 1080p to 768p nor that it will somehow give better results (on the contrary). A 1080p TV will also scale, unless it is used in dot-by-dot mode (1:1 pixelmapping) and the input signal equals the screen resolution.
     
  14. Lin3ar

    Lin3ar
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2005
    Messages:
    6,853
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Ratings:
    +2,771
    Not really, no.

    A lot of people can't see the difference between 1080p on a PZ70 and 720p on a PX70 so there is not really much chance of seeing the difference with downscaled 1080p on your panel.
     
  15. Scrutinizer

    Scrutinizer
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2007
    Messages:
    580
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Ratings:
    +175
    Most if not all HD material on HD DVD and Blu-ray is currently 1080p24 or 1080i60. IMO, this will probably look best if you feed this to your TV using 1080i in your case. DVD material is 576i and is best supplied using 576i. In both cases you limit the number of scaling operations to 1.

    S.

    (It may be worth checking if 576p looks better than 576i if you have a very good DVD player.)
     
  16. Scrutinizer

    Scrutinizer
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2007
    Messages:
    580
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Ratings:
    +175
    A 1080i signal fed to the TV contains exactly the same resolution and information as a 1080p signal in the case of video (film) content (not in the case of 1080p games).
    This is either because they are too far away or because they were watching an upscaled DVD. On my Pioneer there is a clear difference in the case of HD DVD playback.

    S.

    (Incidentally, his TV can even handle 1080p24 over HDMI.)
     
  17. Lin3ar

    Lin3ar
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2005
    Messages:
    6,853
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Ratings:
    +2,771

    I hear what you are saying BUT his Pioneer can't display 1080i or 1080p at its native resolution and just downscales it.

    Incidentally, I am with you on there being a difference between 720p/1080i and full 1080p.
    1080p offers a sharper, more detailed picture on a full HD set (and that is why I am planning on getting a 1080p Panasonic as soon as I can persuade the missus:D)
    However, I know several people who will swear there is no difference.
     
  18. rwniel

    rwniel
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,050
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Ratings:
    +232
    That's why it's worth experimenting and seeing which you prefer i.e. different combinations of processing and upscaling/downscaling (by the source itself and also the television). it may be that a particular form of processing/upscaling will introduce artefacts in the image which the subsequent downscaling process will then "mask". Other times there'll be little or no difference unless you view things from very close up - or it will look 'different' without being either better or worse. Basically different ways of getting the initial source image to the final native resolution of the panel (1365 x 768).

    Any difference between 1080i and 1080p is down to the quality of the deinterlacing. So for those who said there is or isn't a difference you're both right. :) Every television or separate/standalone processor is going to vary.

    Robert
     
  19. Scrutinizer

    Scrutinizer
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2007
    Messages:
    580
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Ratings:
    +175
    True, but I think good processing is more important than screen resolution. My Pioneer 8G set only displays 1365x768, but it has such good processing that it is better than any other 1920x1080 set I know (including the one I had before this one), with the exception of the 1080p Kuro's.
    There is a difference, but it is between 720p and 1080i/1080p. However, currently 720p is only of use for gaming over HDMI. I am not aware of HD material yet that is 720p. So any other 720p signal is either downscaled 1080i or upscaled 480i/576i. Both look worse on my set than the unaltered original passed straight to my TV without intermediate scaling.

    1080p (@60Hz) is of no use currently, unless one owns a HD playback device that offers better processing than the TV, which is not so in my case, so 1080i60 over HDMI will actually render a picture superior to 1080p60. Actually the highest resolution HD format currently available on HD DVD and Blu-ray is 1080i60 video, followed by 1080p24 film. There currently is no such thing as 1080p60.

    A 1080p screen will offer a sharper image than a 768p screen, but only at a relatively short viewing distance. And only if both screens are equally good at providing the processing required. Otherwise the 1080p set will only be better as long as the image does not move. The moment objects start moving a lot of resolution is lost and artefacts get introduced and it will lose out to the lower resolution screen with the superior processing.

    S.
     

Share This Page

Loading...