How much subwoofer output capability do you need in your system?

Mr B 85

Active Member
Hey all. Have an odd shaped room, essentially a rectangle front room with an archway into the kitchen. Listening position is on the right of the front room... see terrible drawing for an idea.

Do I calculate the m3 for both rooms as there's just an arch between them and no door, or imagine a wall is there?
 

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NewAcousticDimension

Active Member
Hey all. Have an odd shaped room, essentially a rectangle front room with an archway into the kitchen. Listening position is on the right of the front room... see terrible drawing for an idea.

Do I calculate the m3 for both rooms as there's just an arch between them and no door, or imagine a wall is there?

Your room is a different orientation but not wildly different to the set up that @John24ssj has been challenged with for months now. Might be interesting for you to read some of his story. You will note the number of people who keep suggesting a door! He cannot put a door there and expect it's the same for you:

 

Mr Wolf

Well-known Member
The short answer is that you should allow for the total area both rooms but there's a bit more to it than that.

My understanding is that in practice those openings leak sound pressure into the other space and the extent to which they do it depends on the size of the opening and the locations of the subs and seats in relation to the opening. My room is sealed but as an experiment before I've left the doors (one single, one double) open and didn't really notice a difference in the bass but then the subs and seats are nowhere near the door openings which I think would make a real difference.

That thread that @NewAcousticDimension linked to is a really interesting read and highlights potential problems in non-rectangular spaces. Like the OP in that thread, to get good bass you may well need multiple subs so going for at least a pair of more smaller subs is likely to be much preferable to a single larger sub. Unfortunately you won't really know any of this for sure until you try.
 

Harkon321

Well-known Member
I was going to start a new thread, but might be better to just add to the discussion on here.

I'm sure I just read a quote from @Mr Wolf saying he preferred ported subs to sealed subs for movies. I can't find the quote/thread now to check that, sorry, but presuming that this is due to tactile response.

Is the better tactile response from a ported sub purely down the additional output from the port in the lower frequencies? There isn't any other subwoofer vodoo that I'm missing...

So, in a small room, with very large amounts of room gain, if you can hit similar levels of Db, in those same frequencies, would the tactile response be the same as a ported sub?
 

Mr Wolf

Well-known Member
I did say that but it’s not an SPL thing at all. I just find that the crushing rumbling sound that ported subs make at lower frequencies present as far more realistic e.g. explosions sound more like an actual explosion in your room rather than a speaker reproducing the sound of an explosion.

I prefer sealed subs for music though but find their extra clarity at lower frequencies works against them in some low frequency movie effects. It’s just a personal view and I expect many will disagree with me.
 

Harkon321

Well-known Member
I’m hoping to try both at some point, just to see what I prefer in the same room.
 

Mr Wolf

Well-known Member
Can you add the Perlisten D15s to the list. If you can. Thanks
I can if you're able to link me to its CEA-2010 measurements. Perlisten don't publish these on its website and I've only seen them for the D215S (tested by Audioholics) and I added those a while ago.
 

Gasp3621

Distinguished Member
Can you add the Perlisten D15s to the list. If you can. Thanks

There is no measurements for the D15 done outside. We have the D215 data so we could guess how much more output it has over the single D15, but that is not accurate. +3db for doubling cone area, +3db if power would be doubled but it isn`t (2000w -> 3000w) so maybe +1,5db? and the slightly taller and deeper cabinet so extra volume. I have sent email to Perlisten and will keep you updated if they respond as the main designer will surely know something. :)
 

Mr Wolf

Well-known Member
the main designer will surely know something.
Dan Roemer? I'm sure he'll have these figures in his head!

It's just not always helpful for marketing/product range management to purposes to have them up there in lights on a company's website next to each product as it might encourage people to spend less. I can only conclude that's why SVS don't publish them despite being quick to send all their new subs to James Larson for review measurements.
 

Gasp3621

Distinguished Member
Dan Roemer? I'm sure he'll have these figures in his head!

It's just not always helpful for marketing/product range management to purposes to have them up there in lights on a company's website next to each product as it might encourage people to spend less. I can only conclude that's why SVS don't publish them despite being quick to send all their new subs to James Larson for review measurements.

This is other person some tech engineer.

SVS has given CEA2010 measurements via email in past when i have asked and as they said in the video clip i posted few days ago they happily send the units to be measured. Listening between the lines the larger dual opposite SVS could be the next thing we see with them.. :)
 

rccarguy2

Distinguished Member
Comparison between svs pc 2000 pro, monoprice 13", and monoprice 16"? (Single)
 

Mr Wolf

Well-known Member
@Mr Wolf I think he meant to say "please" at the end of that :)
Unfortunately, he didn't mean to say that at all as that would be totally out of character and also likely a first on AVF so I'm afraid your well intentioned post/tagging me has only served to undermine the wonderful value of the "Ignore" feature.
 

TB Rich

Active Member
Unfortunately, he didn't mean to say that at all as that would be totally out of character and also likely a first on AVF so I'm afraid your well intentioned post/tagging me has only served to undermine the wonderful value of the "Ignore" feature.
I was starting to formulate a theory that he was actually a chatbot gone rogue, just enough information to appear contextual... but then chatbots are never short of manners so I remain perplexed as to the phenomena that is rccarguy2 🤔
 

Conrad

Moderator
I was starting to formulate a theory that he was actually a chatbot gone rogue, just enough information to appear contextual... but then chatbots are never short of manners so I remain perplexed as to the phenomena that is rccarguy2 🤔
I always think of the old Morecambe and Wise Piano sketch. He’s typing all the right letters, but not necessarily in the right order.

There’s a reference for those of a certain age!
 

NewAcousticDimension

Active Member
Anyone else that can do dB comparison?






Well, this is Mr Wolf's thread, that he made to assist people in their subwoofer choices. He initially invested a lot of time into creating the post and continues to put a lot of time into providing additional guidance.

So, it would be assumed that you were asking him. And, like I teach my grandchildren, we all say please and thank you in this world.
 

steve sph

Distinguished Member
I was starting to formulate a theory that he was actually a chatbot gone rogue, just enough information to appear contextual... but then chatbots are never short of manners so I remain perplexed as to the phenomena that is rccarguy2 🤔
The only issue that has me perplexed is why he's still here at all.
Rude, unnecessarily confrontational and refuses to post pictures of a set-up I seriously doubt he owns.
For a while I tolerated him for the unintentional comedy value he provides, but to quote Morrissey - 'That Joke Isn't Funny Anymore...'
 

TB Rich

Active Member
I always think of the old Morecambe and Wise Piano sketch. He’s typing all the right letters, but not necessarily in the right order.

There’s a reference for those of a certain age!
Haha very much!! Regards the actual sketch, that's a saying I've heard often....and well now I know the origin! 😅
 

NewAcousticDimension

Active Member
The only issue that has me perplexed is why he's still here at all.
Rude, unnecessarily confrontational and refuses to post pictures of a set-up I seriously doubt he owns.
For a while I tolerated him for the unintentional comedy value he provides, but to quote Morrissey - 'That Joke Isn't Funny Anymore...'

Or, as Alexei Sayle said back in the days of his comedy shows, "It's better to shout spite than it is to spout 5h1te".
 

dts197

Distinguished Member
Well, this is Mr Wolf's thread, that he made to assist people in their subwoofer choices. He initially invested a lot of time into creating the post and continues to put a lot of time into providing additional guidance.

So, it would be assumed that you were asking him. And, like I teach my grandchildren, we all say please and thank you in this world.
Almost 7k posts and not used the "thanks" button once. Don't expect to see any gratitude or manners.
 

Toobad

Active Member
Go easy guys. Consider the possibility that people can be wired not to conform to generally accepted societal norms and conventions through no fault of their own. A surprisingly high percentage of people are classified as having Autism Spectrum Disorder, they just process things in a different way to the majority of us and interactions can sometimes be perceived as challenging. Offence is rarely intended.
 
Go easy guys. Consider the possibility that people can be wired not to conform to generally accepted societal norms and conventions through no fault of their own. A surprisingly high percentage of people are classified as having Autism Spectrum Disorder, they just process things in a different way to the majority of us and interactions can sometimes be perceived as challenging. Offence is rarely intended.

And some people are just mean!
 
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